Bedding a k98k in mil. stock?

bugman53 · May 6, 2009, 06:22 PM

I just got finished bedding my bcd43 Mauser in its stock. I had a hard time getting the bedding to stick with all the cosmolean( sp?) but some cleaning and grinding she’s set. So I bedded around the front lug and 2inches of the barrel. Well it came out pretty good. This was my first bedding job.

Here is the problem. When I really tighten down the screws the barrel hits the upper hand gaurd. I spaced the barrel with orings but i clamped the action with zip ties i did not use the action screws when i bedded it.

I was shooting for a full floating barrel. I tried to shim the back just a little and that helped. but if i watch the barrel at the bayonet lug as i start tightening them down the barrel starts moving closer to the barrel bed and as i keep tightening them the barrel starts to move up and just touches the hand guard with maybe 3lbs of force when the screws are really tight. Is the action flexing to the shape of the bed? I think I bedded it with the barrel just a little high and that is where it is wonting to go.

I played with the screws and with about 4-5ft Lb. of torque the barrel is floating between the handgard and not touching anything. But is the action fully in the bedding or just touching in a few spots?

So my question is it ok with 5 ftlb on the front screw (rear real tight) or do i need to grind it out and start over?

So am did i take a step back and the action is in a bind? If i sit the action with the screws loose there is clearence.

bugman53 · May 6, 2009, 06:45 PM

My goal with the rifle is to have a stock looking rifle thats a tack driver. The bore in the barrel is GREAT. looks like a mirror. The stock is ok but a little beat up.

After playing with it some more it looks like the front of the barrel is 1/8 inch to high and that is causing it to hit the handgaurd well the front band.

Humm if 4-5lbs of uplift on the barre helps some shoot why not down pressure?

So grind it down and redo the bedding with the barrel where its floating or see how it shoots with some down pressure on the barrel. probally 3-5 lbs. If it was a rifle with out bands and a handgaurd i would just let it be.

Or just take the front band off at the range and its floating but does not look as cool and its missing parts.

44Magnum · May 10, 2009, 03:52 PM

Is it a Russian capture? I wouldn't mess with it if it's a matching non-import marked rifle.

DnPRK · May 10, 2009, 09:27 PM

The military Mauser action with the thumb cut for stripper clip charging isn't very rigid and doesn't hold up well to great clamping forces and cantilever barrels. Paul Mauser's design uses a pillar bedding system around the front and rear action screws. He also designed the stepped military barrel with fore/aft clearance in the stock, but the fore end supported the barrel between the forward and rear rings. I recommend you work with those accuracy enhancing features, not against them.

bugman53 · May 10, 2009, 11:43 PM

it is a Russian capture. It does have a metal tang in the for end of the stock that was pushing up on the barrel just a little. Now it’s got some down force from the front band. I betting that will hurt it more than help it. Not my intention.

So action does seem more solid it was moving a little before. it looks like I can grind it out a little and do a skim coat of epoxy and get it floating and then play with different uplifts and tune it in. does that sound like a plan?

Or take the hand gaurd off and shoot it and just see where it’s at now that it’s already done?

So will down force have the same effect as up pressure? If so its got 5ish lbs of down force it might shoot ok?

Bart B. · May 11, 2009, 06:56 AM

DnPRK mentions:

Quote:

Paul Mauser's design uses a pillar bedding system around the front and rear action screws.

I don't think those round steel tubes around the stock screws were accuracy enhancing. Instead, they prevented the wood stocks from crushing when the stock screws were tightened. With the receiver and trigger guard/magazine clamped hard at both ends of these "pillars," the action is free to move up and down at each stock screw when the wood shrinks or works away from it's original semi-loose fit when new. The action is no longer held firmly in the stock. From my own observations and measurements of excellent condition M98's in original stocks show this to be the case.

But then, they helped the rifle maintain accuracy. Some of the wood used was a bit on the soft side.

DnPRK · May 11, 2009, 10:59 PM

Quote:

I don't think those round steel tubes around the stock screws were accuracy enhancing. Instead, they prevented the wood stocks from crushing when the stock screws were tightened.

That's the definition of a pillar.

bugman53 · May 12, 2009, 02:09 AM

so is down pressure from the front band a big no no or same effect as up pressure?

Bart B. · May 12, 2009, 05:31 AM

DnPRK, thanks for responding.

Your're right about the meaning of pillars. The ones in Mauser stocks I've seen were not glued in place. Pusing them out of the stock was easy. Which means they didn't hold the receiver in place relative to the stock very good.

Modern pillars are epoxied or well glued in the stocks and this method does help accuracy. I'm not convinced its any better than conventional epoxy bedding, but lots of folks swear by it as it has a good track record.

Bart B. · May 12, 2009, 03:20 PM

bugman53 asks:

Quote:

is down pressure from the front band a big no no or same effect as up pressure?

As long as any pressure on the barrel from any direction is the same for each shot, it won't effect accuracy.

Riflesmiths in military shops match conditioning M1 and M14 service rifles bed their receivers such that there's some down pressure at the stock ferrule. Garands did/do best with about 30 to 35 pounds. I don't know what M14's do best with but it's probably close to that.

When shooting these rifles with a sling on, you have to keep the same pressure on the sling for each shot. Any difference in sling pressure transfers to the stock changing how much its forend bends and that changes the down pressure on the barrel. Not by much, but the best shots can see the results as shots going wild when they change sling tension. Accuracy problems usually happen when the off hand elbow (on the arm the sling's strapped to) changes its resting location from shot to shot which changes sling tension.

May 6, 2009, 06:22 PM	#1
bugman53 Junior Member Join Date: February 1, 2009 Posts: 6	Bedding a k98k in mil. stock? I just got finished bedding my bcd43 Mauser in its stock. I had a hard time getting the bedding to stick with all the cosmolean( sp?) but some cleaning and grinding she’s set. So I bedded around the front lug and 2inches of the barrel. Well it came out pretty good. This was my first bedding job. Here is the problem. When I really tighten down the screws the barrel hits the upper hand gaurd. I spaced the barrel with orings but i clamped the action with zip ties i did not use the action screws when i bedded it. I was shooting for a full floating barrel. I tried to shim the back just a little and that helped. but if i watch the barrel at the bayonet lug as i start tightening them down the barrel starts moving closer to the barrel bed and as i keep tightening them the barrel starts to move up and just touches the hand guard with maybe 3lbs of force when the screws are really tight. Is the action flexing to the shape of the bed? I think I bedded it with the barrel just a little high and that is where it is wonting to go. I played with the screws and with about 4-5ft Lb. of torque the barrel is floating between the handgard and not touching anything. But is the action fully in the bedding or just touching in a few spots? So my question is it ok with 5 ftlb on the front screw (rear real tight) or do i need to grind it out and start over? So am did i take a step back and the action is in a bind? If i sit the action with the screws loose there is clearence.

May 10, 2009, 03:52 PM	#3
44Magnum Senior Member Join Date: September 29, 2008 Posts: 325	Is it a Russian capture? I wouldn't mess with it if it's a matching non-import marked rifle. __________________ "It'll all fit in there, it must be a compressed load." I never joined SAMMI.

May 6, 2009, 06:45 PM	#2
bugman53 Junior Member Join Date: February 1, 2009 Posts: 6	My goal with the rifle is to have a stock looking rifle thats a tack driver. The bore in the barrel is GREAT. looks like a mirror. The stock is ok but a little beat up. After playing with it some more it looks like the front of the barrel is 1/8 inch to high and that is causing it to hit the handgaurd well the front band. Humm if 4-5lbs of uplift on the barre helps some shoot why not down pressure? So grind it down and redo the bedding with the barrel where its floating or see how it shoots with some down pressure on the barrel. probally 3-5 lbs. If it was a rifle with out bands and a handgaurd i would just let it be. Or just take the front band off at the range and its floating but does not look as cool and its missing parts.

May 10, 2009, 09:27 PM	#4
DnPRK Senior Member Join Date: August 24, 2001 Location: LC, Ca Posts: 1,917	The military Mauser action with the thumb cut for stripper clip charging isn't very rigid and doesn't hold up well to great clamping forces and cantilever barrels. Paul Mauser's design uses a pillar bedding system around the front and rear action screws. He also designed the stepped military barrel with fore/aft clearance in the stock, but the fore end supported the barrel between the forward and rear rings. I recommend you work with those accuracy enhancing features, not against them.

May 10, 2009, 11:43 PM	#5
bugman53 Junior Member Join Date: February 1, 2009 Posts: 6	it is a Russian capture. It does have a metal tang in the for end of the stock that was pushing up on the barrel just a little. Now it’s got some down force from the front band. I betting that will hurt it more than help it. Not my intention. So action does seem more solid it was moving a little before. it looks like I can grind it out a little and do a skim coat of epoxy and get it floating and then play with different uplifts and tune it in. does that sound like a plan? Or take the hand gaurd off and shoot it and just see where it’s at now that it’s already done? So will down force have the same effect as up pressure? If so its got 5ish lbs of down force it might shoot ok?

May 12, 2009, 02:09 AM	#8
bugman53 Junior Member Join Date: February 1, 2009 Posts: 6	so is down pressure from the front band a big no no or same effect as up pressure?

May 12, 2009, 05:31 AM	#9
Bart B. Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Posts: 8,927	DnPRK, thanks for responding. Your're right about the meaning of pillars. The ones in Mauser stocks I've seen were not glued in place. Pusing them out of the stock was easy. Which means they didn't hold the receiver in place relative to the stock very good. Modern pillars are epoxied or well glued in the stocks and this method does help accuracy. I'm not convinced its any better than conventional epoxy bedding, but lots of folks swear by it as it has a good track record.