Does anyone ever actually fail a CCW permit class?

[Hook686]

In California, part of the permit is qualifying , with the handgun. Three handguns are permitted on the application, and each must be qualified with (75% average, 10 rounds, in 2 minutes, on B24 target at 10 meters was the case at the range I took my class at).

[Nortonics]

Passing a CCW course is about as hard as buying a $75 box of Cracker Jacks.

[protectedbyglock]

Happy to live in good 'ol PA. Fill out a form with your name, reason for wanting to carry, and all the standard federal bs, and pick your permit up in a week. $30.
My girlfriend went with me and got hers, too. She didn't even know what she was getting. The guy at the desk at the Sheriff's office was laughing because I kept telling her what to write. "Check the hunting box....the self defense box....and the target shooting box. No, not the employment box, honey, because then they want bank deposit slips and stuff... I think". "Don't worry about the $30, it's my treat."

I like hearing the stories about your classes, though. Pretty funny stuff.

[tepin]

only if you shoot yourself or someone else.

[Gbro]

I have failed some and still regret not failing more. The written test is basically a survey to see how well i presented the material. But the Range and hands on is the critical part.
I have canceled 2 classes because Bozo's i know wanted to take class, and there was no way my name was going onto their cert's.

Here are to LIKE individuals here. They took classes and when they applied the Sheriff said NO!

http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/art...b4256260555054

[Hardtarget]

I think there are some that should not be carrying...BUT...if they are smart enough to know they need a gun and may need to defend themselves...then they should be smart enough to LEARN how to be safe and proficient with it. Not expert, mind you, just how to shoot it, clean it, be safe with it. That is not asking too much.
Mark.

[Hkmp5sd]

Currently, most Legislators have not mandated yearly qualifications. But don't for a moment think that some one of them haven't given the idea a thought or two. After all, we require our police to qualify, at a minimum of once yearly, don't we? Then why not us?

Firearm: A device so complex to use that it requires a mandatory 8 hour safety class before being purchased by an adult.

Firearm: A device so simple to use that it requires madatory safety locks to prevent children from shooting themselves.

[guntotin_fool]

a friend who is an instructor asked a gentleman to leave the class, gave him cash back, Buddy said he was making odd remarks and tough guy jokes all thru class, buddy just tossed him.


In my most recent class, we had a guy who dropped the slide and then somehow managed to pull the trigger at the same time. and did this twice. he was told he needed more range time and was later given a pass. I understand he was a shop owner who had been assualted twice in a month and had never touched a gun before hand, Two hours of private lessons and he did very well i was told.

[shooter71]

i was the dumb one in my class...i missed "1" question and i believe everyone else got them all right

the question read something like :

" if you see a guy kicking in your door, do you have the right to shoot him"

i said no

well i was wrong..the instructor said if you can "see" him in the process of kicking in my door that is a violant act you can shoot. now if you have a solid door obv this wont work or the guy has already broke in and is just standing there he isnt doing anything violent. me being the funny man i am i told the instructor, that i felt if he worked so hard to get in the least i could do is pay him with a $.15 bullet , obv i was the only one laughing

[Tex32cal]

Ditto on the Walthers PPK/S. I think those weapons are possessed I kept my all of one month before dumping it for a Springfield XD9.

Michael

[David Armstrong]

The whole point of a ccw is to defend yourself. If you don't have good training [obviously common] and the mental preperation you're kidding yourself and the gun is nothing but a 'warm blanket' !!

One might think so, but reality dictates otherwise. It appears that a large number and probably most successful defensive shootings are done by those with very limited training or no formal training at all.

Having said that, yes, I have failed some people who were trying to get their concealed permit.

[Tokamak]

There was a splash of sparks and the bullet or fragment cut the target in half on a diagonal from the top of the head. Half fluttered to the floor. The other half caught fire on the edges. The guy next to me wanted to know what kind of round of I was shooting.

Now that is one of the funniest things I have ever heard. LOL.

[Hook686]

Today, 10:05 AM #34

shooter71 wrote:

i was the dumb one in my class...i missed "1" question and i believe everyone else got them all right

the question read something like :

" if you see a guy kicking in your door, do you have the right to shoot him"

i said no

well i was wrong..the instructor said if you can "see" him in the process of kicking in my door that is a violant act you can shoot. ...

This caught my attention. You mean in your jurisdiction you can shoot a guy for merely pounding on a door ? Geesh ... here in California I believe a lethal threat needs to be present, before pulling a gun and shooting anyone. Pulling a gun on a guy pounding on the door strikes me, as 'elevating the confrontation to a lethal level'. In other words, aside from brandishing, a felony out here, the BG would then be justified in killing me.

Interesting perspective ... does a stranger pounding on the door to my home, as in trying to breakin, pose a lethal threat to the occupant(s) ?

[pdkflyguy]

I first got my CCW permit in Georgia, where all you have to do is fill out a form and sign about 3 pages of documents. Since I've moved to Florida, I have to now take the "Firearms Training Course" at a local shooting center. Having been shooting for a while, and also having taught my wife to shoot, I am interested to see what the crowd will be like. I know my wife and I will pass, but I'll be interested to see if there are people there who have no busines carrying a gun.

IMHO:
I know it's a previledge that we are all afforded, but so is driving. And let me tell you this, there are certain people that I don't want behind the wheel of a car, either. People don't take enough responsibility these days to learn the practical skills to handle the dangerous situations they find themselves in, whether carrying a gun or driving a car. I know the gun owner's community is usually more responsible than the general population, but there are still some crazies out there who just don't need a car, a gun, a dog, or even a sharp stick. They're liable to hurt themselves or someone else real soon, and I don't want that person they hurt to be me.

[pdkflyguy]

On a second note, I was at a range when a class was being offered to beginner shooters, and a young woman of about 22 was being taught to shoot a .38 revolver. She kept hitting the target holders more often that the target, which I guess would be pretty good if it had been on purpose. It scared the crap out of the rest of us on the range, because we didn't want to get hit with a ricochet, so most of us left shortly thereafter.

[chris in va]

What I can't figure out is why there isn't a standardized test/training for firearms ownership. Seriously, I've seen a lot of people at the range that shouldn't come anywhere near a gun, much less be firing one.

Virginia's test is a joke. Sit in a 'class' for a couple hours, poke a few holes in paper and voila...now you can carry concealed? C'mon. I hear the Texas test is a lot more stringent, as it should be. Failing someone probably isn't a good idea, but extensive training should be mandatory. I don't feel excessive costs are needed either, especially for the single mother trying to raise two kids and protecting her family from a deranged ex-whatever.

[waynedm]

Right the bear arms? I guess I could work out more and try to grow the hair out longer but I don't think my nails will come even close to resembling that of a bear's.

[HiltonFarmer]

You could live in Canada and never get a CCW

The hoops I had to jump through to get my restricted license were incredible. All common sense but still a two day course if you have never fired a gun before - not to mention the 280.00 for the course plus the 80.00 to apply to the government for your license. BTW - the process takes approx 45 days from the time you file your applicatio! A mandatory 28 day waiting period plus 17 days administration time.

And then to top it all off - I have to get an Authorization to Transport my handgun before it can leave the house. Hmmm - I believe the Charter of Freedoms and Rights in Canada is based on the Magna Carta and the British North American Act.

Oh well. The test/course shouldn't be easy but then again it shouldn't be hard either. On the other side of the coin, I don't think everyone should have a gun given some of the practices I've seen and read in my limited time owning a firearm but I do agree that everyone should have the right to bear a firearm given they have demonstrated they are responsible enough to.

Hiltonfarmer

[pdkflyguy]

I went to the class that Florida requires. They handed out a booklet and said this verbatim:

"The state of Florida requires you to know everything in that book, but I'm only going to go over the three points that we think you need to know, then you should just read it at your leaisure."

There was no test, just the booklet. Some people in the class had never shot before. That scares me a little bit. I don't mind people being able to carry, but they should at least have a general knowledge of how guns work first.

Then came the shooting test. It was a standard silhouette target with 5-9 rings and then the X ring. Again, verbatim:

"As long as most of your shots aren't outside the 7 ring, that'll be good enough."

Ok, so that's not as bad. You don't need to me a Marine Sniper to carry a concealed firearm. Since the FBI data says that the average shooting occurs at 3 feet, you should be able to hit that. But he made it pretty obvious that even if your first 10 magazine's didn't hit the paper, you'd probably be allowed to keep shooting until you did.

I think that there should be a test, and some amount of proficiency required. I know several states require you to qualify to police officer standards every year, and I think that's way too stringent. A cop is much more likely to need to shoot his weapon, and hit what he's aiming at than your average citizen. Training and practice ARE important, but that's just one more thing the government doesn't need to regulate. Get them out of our business.

[DonR101395]

. I know several states require you to qualify to police officer standards every year,

Where is that? I couldn't find a reference.

[Snow Fox]

Pennsylvania is a little differnet than protectedbyglock discribed. it varies from County to county. Bucks county to the north of me is as easy as he said. Montgomery where I live is a little different. There I had to drop off the form at the police station, then wait for them to call me to go pick it up a few days later then take it down to the county court house. I had to pay $40 for mine.

[Shamus]

I teach here in Ohio and have failed 3 in the last 12 months. It's mostly about safety, firearm knowledge and practice, practice, practice. The law is something we don't discuss, we bring in LE and a lawyer to cover those topics. For some reason everyone pays attention when they answer.

There are many that can strip any one of several firearms blindfolded but I would be nervous next to them at the range. Some just talk a good line but are clueless and finally a few that just scare the crap out of you.

The balance, 85-90% are there to learn something.

[Mokumbear]

My experience in Florida was that filling out the paperwork
and making the time to go to the one main Sheriff's office in the County
that could scan fingerprints (rather than the traditional "hard card")
was the hardest part of the test. (The background check processes much faster with scanned prints.)

Oh yeah, I had a little trouble paying for the background check online because the people at the Sheriff's office didn't spell my log in info very clearly. When I got on the 'net later, a tiny problem with a capital letter or space missing resulted in me having to call their tech support.

As far as the shooting portion of the test, I don't think you had to even hit the target.
Just discharge your firearm without wounding yourself or the instructor.

I found it a little worrysome that some of the people in my class seemed to have never fired a gun before! (At least the people at the gun shop told them they offer shooting courses.) Anyway, the newbies stuck it out.

One funny part was at the end of filling out paperwork and briefly reviewing
CCW law in our state, the instructor wisely said "anyone who is experienced and comfortable with shooting, step forward, those who need some help we'll work with at the end".

Needless to say, I practically ran to the front of the line!
(Eager not to be around people with no training/experience and just wanting to get on with my day).

Not that it mattered, but I quickly dumped 15, 9mm rounds into my now DOA target.
They handed me the papers I needed and said "have a nice day"!

[Samurai]

I find a great deal depends not only on the state, but the specific instructor. A fellow martial artist I know went to a CCW class taught by one of our instructors. In my class, under a different instructor, we had to hit the target 60% of the time over 50 rounds at 3m, 7m, and 15m, respectively. But in her class, our martial arts instructor made her do double taps, quick draws, tactical reloads, and traverse the indoor range delivering a single shot down each lane! (He was totally messing with her! We all laughed about it later!)

Ultimately, there's "what the instructor is supposed to do," and there's "what the instructor actually does."

[Mokumbear]

Very interesting, though funny!

My fave local range would not allow 2 of the mentioned techniques.

1) No "quick draw"

2) No shooting across lanes (I assume this is a richochet issue).

All the same, better to be overtrained than undertrained!