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Old December 11, 2006, 05:17 PM   #1
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Home Defense Question?

Hello, Thanks for stopping in for the quick question.
I was just wondering does anyone have any experience with dogs, I'm looking for a good gaurd dog as for my house seems to be the target for unwanted intruders they haven't got in yet but 2 weeks ago my german shepard puppy came up missing, 1 week ago I go out back and my storage shed is standing wide open, last night I go out back and one of my screens have been ripped off the guest bedroom window. So something is going wrong please could you tell me what the best home defense dog would be someone that if needed too could rip the legs off a perp. My wife is getting really scared at night and I'm getting really close to camping out back and popping a hot one in who's ever ass it is, but I don't want it to come to that because i'm a law bidding citizen and want a big dog to bark at the first hint of noise to discourage them from ever coming in. I know your probably saying well you had a dog and you let it get stolen. All I can say is that I loved my dog but I had to leave him outside in the day time because he was like a bull in a china store very roudy dog. So the new dog will have to be a mello dog but when the time comes ready to fight. Any ideas?

wow that was a really quick question wasn't it
Also mods i'm sorry I know this is a gun forum but you guys have some the best advice i've heard so if its not appropreite please delete the post
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Old December 11, 2006, 05:23 PM   #2
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You should consider a layered defense to your problem.

A dog alone will not suffice.

1. Contact the police and get all this on record.

2. Install extra/better locks on windows, doors, etc.

3. Install extra lights or motion sensitive lights in specific areas.

4. Install a possible floodlight you can turn on that will brighten a wide area.

5. If possible, an alarm system of some type. There are people on this forum that can suggest a multitude of systems that don't break the budget.

Getting a dog and training it is a large task and probably the slowest to stop this problem.

Also, do not camp outside, if caught off guard you are outside with little protection. Try to video the perps if possible.

Keep safe and call the police, engagement is probably the last thing you should do in most situations.
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Old December 11, 2006, 05:34 PM   #3
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See thats what i'm talking about great advice quick, fast, and in a hurry.
I have a camera system on the way with 3 wireless camera's that i'm going to hook up and wireless them to my laptop so i can see everything outside they also have night vision, as for the flood lights and and motion censor I have one in the same 2 big flood lights with the motion censor built in but that was something I had forgotten to mention was they both stopped working They were not busted but they both went out at the same time. Alarm system I have Its just not operational I need to get someone out to look at it. I'm going to lowes today to get somethings I need I already beefed up my locks and things but need a few more things to install them.
So really all I need is my alarm looked at and replace my lights which i'm doing tonight. and i'll have everything you said + camera system. So all I need now is a companion for my wife and I that would be our gaurd dog.
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Old December 11, 2006, 05:49 PM   #4
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Loosing a dog would put me through the roof.

Great Pyreenes and rotts would be my favorites for guard dogs. You'd have to look a bit more at your house, and, your yard, and decide if you really have enough room for a dog run, and, a big dog, and, if your climate dictates a short hair, or long hair dog.

Sorry to hear about your problems, but, you got good advice, above...

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Old December 11, 2006, 05:50 PM   #5
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Get something that's already grown to at least a year or two. Look in the paper or adopt from the humane society. Look for something that you and your wife will both like, that has good temperment, but sounds like the devil himself trying to break the gates of Hell with his bark.

My neighbor used to have a German Shepherd that was the sweetest dog until you messed with "mom or dad" then he'd rip your throat out. My kinda dog
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Old December 11, 2006, 05:56 PM   #6
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Thats what I was really hoping for in this dog We got him from a breeder it was a all black german shepard KNC registered got him for 1200 but he never had a chance to grow up really. he was only about 14 weeks old but boy was he getting big. He was just too nice I hadn't gotten him trained yet that anyone but me or mom comes in the back yard to chase them away. But we'll miss him alot.
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Old December 11, 2006, 05:57 PM   #7
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I love my pitts but here's the ultimate. The Canis Panther. Their website.

Constitution of Virginia

Section 13. That a well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defense of a free state, therefore, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed...
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Old December 11, 2006, 06:25 PM   #8
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HUGE. Very very mellow. The ones I had growing up were like furniture - had to be dragged outside to play twice a day.

HUGE. Very sweet dogs. They let small children put laundry baskets on their heads.

HUGE. You don't want to upset one. You do want to take them to an obediance class (although in my experience they're not rocket scientists, with a great big dog you want it to mind simple instructions).

HUGE. Nobody but a fairly athletic burglar will steal your bullmastiff.

I had two when I was growing up. When I was 11 or so I'd wander all over the woods and fields by the house. I could be gone all day, but I'd take the female with me and, oddly, my parents never worried.

They can't be outdoor dogs, though. They're not very heat or cold sensitive.

Sounds like you've got evil teenagers or something similar in your neighborhood. I'd recommend getting an adult dog (either a "pet quality" animal from a breeder or a shelter dog) since a pup seems like too easy a mark. I'd further recommend you let it be seen. Walk it, play with it in the yard.

I'm sorry you lost your G. Shep. My girl now is a Shepherd, and she's FABULOUS. You're right, though, they need to be entertained or they'll think up evil things to do to your house.
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Old December 12, 2006, 12:36 AM   #9
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Sorry I countn't resist

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Old December 12, 2006, 05:31 AM   #10
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Pointy snout & ears that stand = goofball dogs.
Our G.Shep was goofy @ best and a sometimes head case.
Our Husky is a head case too. He chewed up 5 sets of doorknobs on the back door trying to get in the house, and ate a section of Al. siding off the house. We finally caved in and put in a doggy door so he can come and go as he pleases. Now he goes out and sits in the backyard and just stares at the house Go figure...

The best beast we had was our Great Dane. He was the ultimate couch potato and detested going outside. He was also totally devoted to my wife. He was sure "mommy's boy".

IMHO though a dog is about the fourth line of Home D.
- Location. Buy in the best neighborhood you can afford. It may mean less house, the long run you'll do better.
- Good locks,,and more importantly,,proper installation of them.
- Motion sensors that trigger lights & carefull attention to the layout of your yard. High fences are great for privacy, but also shield the actions of someone trying to break in.
- Dog. Even an ankle biter can bark up a storm to alert you. Bigger dogs are more of a deterrant.

P.S. Re: topical.
It sounds like this belongs more in the tactics section since your talking about a whole Homed D package.
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Old December 12, 2006, 06:23 AM   #11
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3 types of dogs i would recommend

Caucasian Mountain Dog, Tibetan Mastiff, or German Shepards, I personally hate pits but that because i been chased by to many stray ones. The caucasian is a big and i do mean big dog they way in excess of 160 lbs, but they can get over 200 sometimes. Tibetan Mastiff are just as big, average is between 100 to 160 but some have reached the 200lb mark. Shepards are around 100 as you prolly know. I have a german shepard and i ve see my dog scare the heck out of people who came to my door. But when somebody is let in house the dog calms down and accepts them immediately. All thse dogs do great with defense but you need more than just them. like people said get yor alarm working and more lights and it will help to dicourage more problems.
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Old December 12, 2006, 09:10 AM   #12
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Well thanks guys for all your help.
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Old December 12, 2006, 09:33 AM   #13
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Lowes used to sell a stand-alone motion sensor/alarm. You just plugged it in and it would guard a room, had a key pad to disarm. Cheap and simple, a good way to monitor, a good early warning system for rooms you do not frequent.

IMO a LOUD dog is better than a big dog for home defense . . . bad guys hate to draw attention to themselves. Your local Humane Society should be full of them. Sheperds and Labs are great because they are both big and loud.

Contact your immediate neighbors, give them your contact info and offer a significant reward for the capture/arrest of these repeat visitors.
America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards. Claire Wolfe
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Old December 12, 2006, 09:50 AM   #14
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Doberman Pinscher

My buddy has one, ~100lbs., and she's a nice dog, if she knows you. As for a BG, he'd crap his pants and get away from there in a hurry.

For me, I've only got cats, and I doubt even "evil kitty" would be of much good, so I have to rely on my hardware alternatives. The .38Spl is easy to handle, close to the bed, and should be enough.
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Old December 12, 2006, 12:02 PM   #15
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Others have offered sound advice. Short of spending big bucks for an already trained guard dog, it'll take time to get a dog "up to speed".

+1 on the Doberman though. Dobermans are highly intelligent dogs that enjoy being part of the family fun (whatever it happens to be) and enjoy being given things to do. They love to be close to their favorite person -- I was 17 and my 85# male Dobie insisted on snuggling with me on a twin bed! -- but will easily get along with other family members. If you have a Dobie, you must plan on spending some time playing with him and exercising him to keep him happy. If he can go where you go, so much the better.

The AKC standard says a Doberman's temperment is "Energetic, watchful, determined, alert, fearless, loyal and obedient." We can also add inquisitive, playful and definitely a loyal companion.

Or you can buy some signs....

Post these on your fences and leave a water dish and dog toys in the back yard to complete the illusion.

Best of all... Dobermans can go from this:

To this... in 0.7 seconds when someone threatens their family.
BillCA in CA (Unfortunately)
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Old December 12, 2006, 12:16 PM   #16
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My two Heinz mutts bark when somebody approaches my property. I can tell by the nature of the barking whether they're barking at other dogs or people.
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Old December 12, 2006, 02:38 PM   #17
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Did your pup have a chip or tatto?? If he was imported (Sorry but that is a guess as I'm unfamilar with the KNC) he likely had one of these things which can come in handy as definitive proof of ownership, as to finding him call all the vets in the area, and police the area for him --- esp anyone who knew of him and his value / breeding. Good luck, as that stinks big time and theft / loss of my dog is one think that I really fear / dread.

As to your direct question any adult dog that barks (sometimes it's hard to get them to stop) is less likely to get stolen and would be more of a deterent, of course the traditional attack breeds provide a psycological deterent as well. In regard to specific breeds keep in mind that in any breed there is varyation and all dogs that have a job (police, search, guide) are tested / evaluated for suitability early on in life. If this is something that your wish to use a dog for obviously you would want to discuss this with your breeder and select an apropriate puppy temperemtn and drive wise. If you have a good breeder (of Shepherds) they would understand this (and if they really don't know what you are talking about you might want to look elsewhere for the kind of coin you are talking about) and offer you maybe 2-4 pups for your consideration after talking to your about your goals. By having a selection you can pick the one that meshes with your personality best, funny thing it as in horses a lot of handlers pick the crazyest dog in the lot... not something I have ever understood (or reccomend) but to each their own. Even so genetics being what it is it does nto always work out.

If you want to train for guard / atack / protection duties keep in mind that this requires a time / money comittment that rivals what it would take to make you a highly compeditive shooter in your chosen field. Furthermore once you uncork the genie of canine agression you are stuck dealing with it for life. Anyway I'm guessign you just want a barker, if you want more than that find a good trainer in your area (asking local police K9 handlers who they reccomend is a good start) and watch / talk with them before you leap in.

Good luck, I'm in AZ otherwise I'd offer to help put the word out on your missing pup.
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Old December 12, 2006, 03:01 PM   #18
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I am of the OPINION that dogs are far better ALARMS than they are WEAPONS. If you get a dog for home defense, get a small, quick, YAPPY little dog. They make good door alarms, and they're pretty hard to catch and kill. A big dog might try to attack, but one good stab to the side of the head, and it's "no more doggy." Also, big dogs raised as family pets have a tendency to get comfortable with people, and so they don't tend to bark when strangers are around.

I recommend a Rat Terrier, a Toy Poodle, or a Chihuahua. They're LOUD, agile, and almost invariably scared of strangers. If someone comes into the house, they will bark their heads off! Then, you wake up, and reach for a REAL weapon.

Remember, most people who burglarize houses are looking for money for drugs. They have no problem killing a dog, but they don't want to draw alot of attention to themselves while they do it! Make it LOUD!
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Old December 12, 2006, 03:09 PM   #19
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I am almost embarrased to say that I own a yorkshire terrier ( all 7 pounds of terror ) and I agree with samuari, they are great little yippy alarms. Ours notices everything and barks at any car that comes by the house - at any hour of the day or night.

She lets us know if anything is going on within her hearing range 100% of the time.

My inlaws own and breed newfoundland, they have a half a dozen of them and not one of them would bark at a stranger - ever
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Old December 12, 2006, 04:10 PM   #20
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Thanks guys you all have given really good advice and thanks vet for your compassion on getting the word out of my missing dog. I was talking with a breeder earlier today he breeds Pits its also a guy I work with so he is trust worthy his dog TANK is the grand national pulling champ in the 75# and above group and the mom to the litter placed in the same comp so I know they are really good dogs. He is selling them for 1k each but said if he had any left over or if anyone backed out that he would give me one because he knows how bad it is to loose a dog. But I was talking to him ealier and told him I didn't know if I wanted a puppy or a full grown dog and he said he has another dog from a different litter same dad different mother and is about a year and half he said he is very protective of his family and probably would tear into anyone messing around the house but would deffenantly if they came in. So I don't know of yet what i'm going to do. Here is a link to their site click here ACE GOODNER's TANK is the black and white one pulled over 7k pounds in that comp. ACE PARNELLE's GRACIE is the mom on the females page she is the brindle one.
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Old December 12, 2006, 04:47 PM   #21
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Some of the guys in the post are right. Little dogs may not tear the BG apart but they are yappy dogs and the whole nieghborhood will know that someone is in your backyard.
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Old December 12, 2006, 05:31 PM   #22
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Somehow, I missed this one. It's pretty much a duplicate of this thread. Merging them would be confusing because of the different dates, so I'm closing this one and leaving the original, older thread open.

Please continue any posts there, and remember to keep it on topic for Tactics & Training .
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