Taurus Tracker 45 ACP problem in SA

[Stargazer]

Guys I am new here. I have a brand new Tracker in 45 ACP that has a puzzling problem. After about 25-40 rounds ALL in SA, the pistol is hesitant to cock or stay cocked. Sometimes, and the last time out it happened 4 times, it will cock and no matter how hard I pull that trigger the hammer will NOT drop and fire the round. I have to push the hammer with my weak hand thumb to get it to fire. This happened (4) times Friday AM while I was out. DA works everytime perfect. I have used new Winchester, new Wolf and (2) different powders with my reloads and it does this every time. Sent it back to the factory, they have had it longer than I have, and they shot it (90) rounds and of course, no problem found. I will video tape the problem next weekend and send it back to them with the tape showing me pulling the trigger as hard as I can and the hammer not falling.

It doesn't seem like a powder fouling problem as I used 700X the last time out and it burns super clean. But the problem does not start until I have fired about 25-40 times every time I take it out. Any suggestions to fix this or as to what might be causing this? Thanks guys!

[45reloader]

Could be that the primer are dragging and stopping the wheel from locking up completely.

Next time it happens look at the primers of the unfired and fired brass for scrape marks.

[Stargazer]

Now these pistols do have a case dragging problem on the back frame. A lot of folks have experienced that especially when using dirty powder with the 45 ACP Tracker. Usually when that happens the rounds will not seat good either as there is a lip for head spacing inside each chamber. But the factory rounds and my reloads drop right in now. My reloads used to not drop in, but since I got that Lee factory crimp die they drop in like brand new rounds now. I will check the primers though, thanks for the suggestion.

[Slip Shooter]

My son purchased an early model of the 5 shot Taurus 45 ACP Tracker 445 that had tight chambers which barely passed the cartridge minimum specs test. Unburned powder and lead build up on the chamber mouths and sides contributed to the problems you mentioned. A quick solution was to size a 45/70 case using a 45 ACP sizing die to the depth of a 45 ACP case. Use it as a cleaner or scraper for the chamber mouths followed by a clean patch. A cleaner burning powder and jacketed bullets mostly solved the problem but not entirely. Tight chambers and grungy chamber mouth build up will contribute to cartridge set back in these revolvers and will lock up the action. Watch for high primers also.

Be safe!

Slip

[Mad Martigan]

Man, with a warranty this good I'd just send it in and let them sort it out in Miami.

[Stargazer]

I just checked my primers on fired cases and they are fine. And remember now, DA works everytime perfectly. It is just SA function that messes up. The rounds seat just fine now using 700X powder, I was using Unique and (10) rounds of Unique is like (50) rounds of 700X, dirty wise. But new Wolf rounds do the same thing and so do new Winchesters ( man that powder is dirty, but Wolf powder is clean burning). May be the problem is heat related? I thought it might be powder related, but switching to 700X had no effect on the SA problems.

[clayking]

Hmmmm........my new Tracker 445 would not fully cock and kept rotating to the next cylinder. If I kept doing it over and over I could eventually fire 4 of the cylinders. I sent it back to Taurus, and waiting for return. Ain't happy.........ck

[Stargazer]

I think these revolvers, since Taurus chose to head space on a lip in the chambers instead of like S&W does it, is a big design problem. Perhaps so many problems, especially with case head dragging, is why they are discontinued now? Thank God it works flawlessly for me in DA because usually in a revolver life or death situation, I think the DA is used to fire the pistol.

Yeah when I send it back next week they will see the video and the problem I am talking about. Clayking, same case dragging problem as I experienced before I switched powders. I used to use a boresnake through the cylinders after 25 rounds and could make it through a box of new dirty powder Winchesters. So you will get yours back with no problems found too.

[clayking]

Stargazer.........When mine will not cock, it will not DA either. And it started on the second shot. I'll just drive down to Miami and have it out with them.... ..................ck

[Stargazer]

I took the side plate of last night to get a better grasp of what is goin gon inside there. There is defintely two different firing points, one for DA and one for SA. The SA notch is at the very end of the hammer whereas the DA is a piece located on the hammer itself prior to the SA notch. I also noticed the pawl connecting bar is directly connected to the trigger. This bar slides between frame members and man that bar is in there very tight. I could see galling on the side of the bar and some on the side plate inside where the hammer rubs. If heat is causing the problem, maybe the tightness of that pawl bar is seizing up and causing the trigger to be unable to move in it's most rearward position. Most of the inside of the lockwork was dry so I put a dab of CLP on those galling spots to see if that will help the situation. I could swear the trigger will not budge when it acts up and I noticed that when the trigger does move back in SA, the safety bar raises just slightly. I will observe whether or not that bar moves. If it does move that means it is not something binding the trigger, but maybe something holding the hammer back. I have to push rather hard on that hammer to get it to drop BTW. I got to figure this out, I like the pistol and the caliber since I own (2) 45 ACP glocks as well. Will report what I find out.

[Stargazer]

I took it out last Sunday and on the third shot it locked up and the trigger being pulled hard would NOT drop the hammer. I took videos to show Taurus what was happening. Had three seperate incidents taped. When I got home I was able to recreate the lock up at my kitchen table. I put (5) empty cases back in it, a chore to say the least and if I held on to the cylinder while cocking it, simulating dragging case heads on the frame, I could get it to lock up every time. Here is what is happening. When the cases fire, they push back against the rear frame. Since the chambers are so tight, the cases stay back causing the cylinder to drag. This gets the lockwork and cylinder pawls/pawl bar out of time and the pistol locks up. The pawl bar is directly conected to the trigger so now that the pawl bar is locked up, the trigger will not move. If I pulled extremely hard on the trigger it will move or flex enough so a hard push on the hammer will release it and finally fire the round. I have (2) chambers out of the (5) that are extremely tight and really I believe the problem is being caused by the tight chambers, period.

The revolver is on it's way back to Taurus now with the tape. I have requested a new cylinder, new pawls and pawl bar. I gave them permission to ream the chambers to open them up some so the problem will go away. Hopefully they will do something as they can plainly see me on the video pulling that trigger as hard as I can and the pistol not discharging. I do believe ALL of the 45 ACP lock up problems myself and others have experienced are just due to too tight of chambers.

[clayking]

I still do not have mine back from Taurus yet but I'm nearing the promised 3-4 weeks period. I also felt that the chamber was too tight....................ck

[Stargazer]

I have "Video Enclosed" all over my box. They should get it tomorrow according to UPS tracking. Hopefully the "Video Enclosed" will get their attention and they will see what I have discovered. I don't know if slightly larger chambers will cure the probem or not. Has anyone else heard of case head dragging problems on any other revolver other than these 45 ACP's? Do normal .357's or 44's do this?

I would have gotten mine back in the promised 3-4 weeks had FedEx not supposedly been able to find my house. Instead it took 5 weeks as it rode back and forth again. Maybe yours will show up soon, let us know what they say/found. All my paperwork said were two notes to keep it clean ( I do ) and to use only Factory Ammo (doesn't matter which ammo I used, it still locked up ).

[Hotdog1911]

Some American revolver shooters just don't get it.

Taurus just isn't the answer. Right now...would you trade your in-transit Taurus, a 100, 200, no-300 bucks, your aggravation, and wasted ammo for a working, brand name, 45ACP revolver? If you think shipping is expensive now, wait until you have to re-ship the thing again.

If I'm not mistaken Colt and Smithenweesal had the 45acp revolver concept figured out in what was it...1917; circa First World War. Did I say WW-One.

Currently there is a shooting sport called 'ICORE' with a thousand for so nationwide active shooting members; half of whom use 45acp revolvers on a regular basis. I bet not all their 45acp revolvers are brand name. And I'd safely say not all of the brand name 45 revolvers are perfect. But I bet the majority of 45acp revolvers arn't Taurus and arn't being shipped back to 'My-Hammy' or Brazil either.

I have alot of respect for you trying to fix the problem yourself and for the documentation. Regarding those little CS parts you referred to; if they are exclusively Taurus...not an exact copy of say a Colt or Smith...God help the next Taurus 45 acp revolver owner a few years from now when his discontinued model needs parts.

[John28226]

Stargazer, you asked about the experience of others - not sure if this is helpful but I have two (2) Smith 25-2s - both of which have had serious gunsmithing work - both of the Smiths are smooth as glass to shoot and, with the modifications to the cylinders, allow for reloading that beats the semi autos.

Unfortunately the Smiths are too big, too heavy and too bulky for daily CCW. For that purpose I have 2 inch Taurus Stellar Tracker. It has had some mild gunsmithing but has been just as reliable as the Smiths - and, at 7 yards it is just as accurate. I only shoot double action so I can't comment on the single action problems. I did, however, find that the chambers are "tight".

Prior to loading my ammo into the moon clips, I run each reload through the cylinder to check for fit. Most all load properly. The few that are too tight, I put to one side for use in my 1911.

Since the Taurus is my prefered carry gun it should be obvious that I have confidence in it. With almost 2000 rounds fired it has yet to not function properly.

And, yes, I paid less for it than a Smith 325 which I think is overpriced.

Please let us know how your Taurus works out. I hope as satisfactory as mine!

John
Charlotte, NC

[Stargazer]

Ok this is what the insides of the Tracker series looks like. I have no idea how it compares to Colts or S&W revolvers.

[clayking]

Got mine back today, 3 weeks less one day from their receipt. Said that they adjusted the cylinder and extractor. I loaded five live rounds and cycled the cylinder (in back yard) but didn't fire it. Seems to work fine, save the real test for this week-end.......................ck

[Stargazer]

Please let us know how it goes.

[clayking]

So much for Taurus service. When I got it back Tuesday, I loaded the cylinder and rotated it without firing. Wednesday, I ran into an indoor range, and fired one full cylinder before they closed. It fired all five, however two were a little hard to cock. Went home and cleaned the gun. Today (Sunday), I went to the range for the full test. Taurus Gets a frigging F--

It was just as bad as before and perhaps worse. Out of 100 shots, I was never able to cock the hammer on all five cylinders. The best I could ever do was four, and most of the time only 3. Three times, once cocked, I had to pull the trigger very hard to get it to fire. All I can say, is that Taurus service sucks, if after a repair the same problem still exists. There will be an interesting conversation tomorrow.......................ck

P.S. Should have known from the number of shooters who have said, "Never Taurus, Taurus stinks, or whats a lifetime guarantee worth when they have it all the time...................

[MOPLS]

Interesting problems. I also have a Tracker 455 that I have a bit of a problem with. It fires just fine in single action mode, but I get failure to fire in double action most of the time. It works better using factory loads, but still isn't 100% reliable. With my reloads, it's mostly failure to fire. When I say failure to fire, I mean that I pull the trigger, the hammer falls, the firing pin strikes the primer, but the round doesn't go off. I can rotate the cylinder around and bring the round up again and it will fire in SA so it isn't a dud primer or bad powder. I'm thinking the overall length of the round is a bit short on my reloads which causes the round to seat too far forward. I don't know of anything else that could cause it to act this way. I took the side panel off and thoroughly cleaned all the interior parts then added a couple of drops of CLP to lubricate the moving parts. That didn't seem to help much. I've decided to try and reload some rounds using a longer OAL to see if that might be the solution. If that doesn't do it, then I'll have to decide whether to send it in to Taurus or trade it in for something else.

If anyone has any suggestions or advice as to what might be causing the seeminly light strikes in double action mode, I would appreciate hearing them.

Thanks,
john

[clayking]

I also had several strikes in SA that did not go off also, factory loads. I'm thinking that I'm going to ask Taurus that they give me something else to replace it. Bad part is, the gun really shoots quite well.......when it shoots. And I really wanted to own a tracker as I like the looks.

Mine went back to Taurus today, on their dime this time, as they failed to repair the gun. I think that I will call them in a day or two, to discuss a trade, as I've lost any confidence that they can repair it to my satisfaction. We'll see if they "walk the talk"....................ck

[Stargazer]

I got mine back Tuesday from Taurus. That was quick. It had a sticker on it that said, "Brazil Repair", as if it went to Brazil for repair. I can now hold that cylinder as tight as I can simulating dragging case heads and it does not lock up. They did something, said extractor adjustment on the paperwork. Mine may be fixed, lockwork wise. It is still rather tight chambered on two of them though. We will see how it does come Saturday.

[Stargazer]

Back to Taurus it goes. Went to local indoor range and the first SA cock would not catch and hold so the second one did and it locked up on my first shot. Fiddled with my weak hand to get the camera out and running and took video of it again with me pulling the trigger as hard as I could. Finally got it to fire by pulling the trigger extremely hard flexing it and pushing on the hammer with weak thumb. Not a good situation at all with others so close by in the range area! I will demand replacement with another caliber as it is obvious that revolver can not be repaired. This will make the third time back since June. How do other folks Trackers in 357 and 44 mag do? Are these OK and work?

[WESHOOT2]

Suggest buying better quality anything, regardless of price, for greater owner satisfaction.

I am not knocking Taurus but their revolvers too often do leave something to be desired.

Anyone aware of ANY LE agency in this country issuing ANY Taurus (or Rossi? or Charter Arms?) firearm?

(see, 'cause I'm aware of S&W and Ruger being issue guns...)

[clayking]

suggest buying better quality anything, regardless of price, for greater owner satisfaction.

Far be it for me, after this experience, to defend Taurus, however, they had the gun (SS, 6", revolver, ported, ribbed, .45ACP), although discontinued, that I wanted. And I really wanted a Taurus Tracker as I think they are very good looking pistols. But this battle with Taurus is not yet over, so maybe I'll get lucky, or else I'll have my money back, or a different Tracker that really works. Stargazer has had two trips to Taurus, and I'm waiting on the second trip to come back. If this doesn't work, we go to war.

I guess I will have to go to the S&W Model 625 in 5", at least I know it will function, albeit, at twice + the price. If you know of any others, let me know.........................ck