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Old October 14, 2021, 05:10 PM   #1
Longshot4
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I might have a Ruger 77\44 with fliers.

I suspect the pupperware stock is the reason I receive a 6" flier at 100 Yards. Three shots tight and one drops. I use a rest so I don't think it is me. The fore stock moves and touches the barrel. I have been told that epoxy doesn't hold to the plastic.
Does any one have a cost effective suggestion to float the barrel?
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Old October 14, 2021, 07:07 PM   #2
BornFighting88
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Gunline barrel bedding tools at Brownell's, then some glass bedding. Get a wooden stock or something stiffer. The forestock touching the barrel is just a recipe for trouble.

On the other hand, allow me to ask you a few questions. Simple ones.

Barrel contour?? Whatcha got?? Pencil thin, bit of a fatty?? Talk to me.

Barrel heating up is another issue. Three shots is fine, but if it is not with a little gap between the shots, heat is an issue.
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Old October 15, 2021, 07:44 PM   #3
Longshot4
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The rifle can place 3 shots at the same lateral line with in a inch. Then throws the next shot 6 inches. No it is not a bull barrel. I believe the forarm is cause for the flier since it does not hold still. This is a 44 Mag. you know big hole. It is not a long taper. 18 1/2". I have never seen a heat issue group 3 and throw 6''. The group should grow. Not Blow.

I don't agree with heat.
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Old October 17, 2021, 04:02 PM   #4
BornFighting88
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You may not agree with the heat issue, but she be a real cruel mistress, friend!! Swelling from the heat (mind you, you mentioned you are shooting a 44Mag, which has less powder than many high powered rifles), can cause the bore to open up little by little, causing that engagement with the lands and the bullet to fall off bit by bit. Less (or different amount of) grip changes ballistics.

What you are telling me leads me to believe it is the forend. If it is warping THAT much under firing, start off by getting a different/new one.

That bullet should be moving slow enough that it shouldn’t do THAT, and twisting slow enough that it shouldn’t spin itself off axis.
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Old October 18, 2021, 06:36 PM   #5
Shadow9mm
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Before you go crazy, I would suggest torquing everything if you have not already. bedding will not fix 6in fliers, something is probably loose. Check your action screws, check your scope bases, check your scope rings. I have a wheeler and I am happy with it. there are many others.

https://www.amazon.com/Wheeler-71090...4599897&sr=8-3

In relation to bedding a polymer stock. if it flexes enough to touch the barrel I suspect bedding will not fix your problem. I have successful bedded with JB weld before, and there are other epoxies that will bond with plastic. JB weld adheres to plastic just fine. However proper surface prep is important. Clean well. I like brake cleaner but there are other options. scuff the area with rough sandpaper, 120g grit range. I like to use a small drill bit to drill a bunch of shallow holes to give the expoy more places to lock into. It can be done but if torquing everything down does not fix it, a new stock may be your only option imho.
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Old October 19, 2021, 10:22 AM   #6
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what Shadow said x 2. I just drove myself nuts with a .308. Turned out to be a simple loose scope rail.

If you do decide it is the stock, I have had real good luck with the Boyds for $100 - $200

https://www.boydsgunstocks.com/
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Old October 19, 2021, 10:46 AM   #7
Maxwell Haus
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Does it always happen in the same manner, 3 tight and one way out ? I am not familiar with that stock ,but wondering if you could tape under the receiver to float the barrel some
or grind out the barrel channel ?
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Old October 19, 2021, 11:12 AM   #8
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you mentioned you are shooting off a rest. With a tupperware stock it is possible that the weight of th ebarrrel could be flexing the stock enough to cause touch. You could move the rest back as close as you can get to the action screws to test that
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Old October 19, 2021, 06:10 PM   #9
Longshot4
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The stock forearm moves like a lid on a Tupperware box. The forearm screw is a pain to remove it is so tight. The movement is at the end. Flex flex flex. The stock is the quality of a Tupperware lid. TRASH!

I Think a solid stock will be the ticket. Savage makes a Tupperware stock called Accu-stock. I have one on my 10t in 6CR. I shoots much better. Not that I like Tupperware but the Alum. bed goes up into the forearm to keep it off the barrel. It is a shooter but I still don't like it.

I need a solid or Lam. stock. I'm hoping for suggestions.
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Old October 19, 2021, 06:45 PM   #10
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hounddawg's suggestion of Boyd's is seconded by me. I have an At-One adjustable from them. Stiff as a board. Before all the add-ons I put on my order, it was $189 in "Nutmeg" laminate. They have some really cool colors and blends of colors. Jungle Camo is pretty awesome.
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Old October 20, 2021, 11:05 AM   #11
hounddawg
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I have one of the Boyds AT1's on a CZ 452 and a pair of the prarie hunters on Savage model 10's. No complaints here about Boyds products
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Old October 20, 2021, 02:39 PM   #12
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The Boyds AT-One stocks are horribly designed and executed. The so-called adjustable LOP is adjustable from 12" to 13-1/2", still too short for most adults, and the so-called adjustable cheekpiece is too small and only adjusts vertically. The overall square profile is ergonomically awful, holding onto a square pistol grip or forearm is painful. I would say save your money rather than buy something that hurts to shoot.
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Old October 20, 2021, 03:23 PM   #13
Maxwell Haus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorch View Post
The Boyds AT-One stocks are horribly designed and executed. The so-called adjustable LOP is adjustable from 12" to 13-1/2", still too short for most adults, and the so-called adjustable cheekpiece is too small and only adjusts vertically. The overall square profile is ergonomically awful, holding onto a square pistol grip or forearm is painful. I would say save your money rather than buy something that hurts to shoot.
I agree 100 percent . I was amazed to see praise for it honestly . I have never owned one because I saw what they were in person . I felt bad for my buddy when I saw him take it from the box , he was not impressed either .
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Old October 20, 2021, 03:42 PM   #14
BornFighting88
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Dang, I am just running into you all over the forums today, Scorch. Haha.

That squarish profile suits my intended purpose perfectly. I am also a ham-fisted variety of fella. Setting this up for a varmint/long range deal, so my hand probably won’t wrap around the wrist all too often. The lengths of pull are perfect, plus they even offer the option of extended recoil pads to mitigate the LOP issue you mention.

Only gripe, and I mean ONLY gripe, is the barrel channel. They make them for either military profile barrels, or pencil thin pipes, and that just makes it more work to fit it for a bull barrel or anything bigger than a #2 taper.

The cheek riser issue is also something I guess is subjective to perspective, no?? Also lined right up perfectly for me. Comfy, too.

To each their own, for sure.
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Old October 20, 2021, 09:47 PM   #15
hounddawg
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Have to agree with born fighting on the profile, LOP etc. I am a short and stocky with baseball mitts for hands. Anyway Boyds has a slew of other stocks to choose from and in the ordering process you can specify the LOP, choose a model with or without the monte carlo profile etc

Scorch and Maxwell perhaps you can offer some alternate suggestions for the OP. To quote

A jackass can kick a barn down, but it takes a carpenter to build one. ~Speaker of the House Sam Rayburn, January 12, 1953
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Old October 21, 2021, 06:30 AM   #16
std7mag
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6" flier, something is up besides the stock flexing.

You "shooting from a rest" tells me nothing.
Every year i see people shooting from a rest. With the barrel on the rest, not the stock.

Are you hand loading, or using factory ammo?

Tupperware stocks can be bedded & forestock stiffened. Key is the prep work.
Scuff up, drill holes through webbing of forestock. Clean with starting fluid (there's no oils in it).
Spray adhesion promoter. It truly does work!
I found light weight Bondo best for forestock.

Same prep for bedding.
Found Acraglass too soft, in both forms.
Devcon works great!
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Old October 21, 2021, 09:59 AM   #17
Maxwell Haus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hounddawg View Post
Have to agree with born fighting on the profile, LOP etc. I am a short and stocky with baseball mitts for hands. Anyway Boyds has a slew of other stocks to choose from and in the ordering process you can specify the LOP, choose a model with or without the monte carlo profile etc

Scorch and Maxwell perhaps you can offer some alternate suggestions for the OP. To quote

A jackass can kick a barn down, but it takes a carpenter to build one. ~Speaker of the House Sam Rayburn, January 12, 1953
Cute quote, being a Finish Carpenter puts me above building barn doors . One of the reasons I believe the Boyd at one is junk . How many rifles come with 90 degree angles in all the wrong spots ?
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Old October 21, 2021, 10:39 AM   #18
NoSecondBest
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I have bedded “tupperware” stocks with good results. Get a barrel inletting tool from Brownells and open the channel up front to back. Bed the recoil lug area also. I’d suggest bedding about six inches of the barrel and let the rest free float. If buying another stock floats your boat, that is a good option also. I haven’t seen any rifle shoot the first three good and the put the fourth six inches out of the group because of bedding. Something else is wrong here but most people get pretty defensive when it’s suggested that it might be something they’re doing. If something were loose it wouldn’t keep showing up on shot #4 every time. Big problem with Tupperware is the shooter can really input the outcome simply by moving their head on the stock, moving the front rest to a different spot on the stock, and exerting downward pressure on the stock with their head. Lots of possibilities here.
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Old October 23, 2021, 09:39 AM   #19
4V50 Gary
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Get a huge dowel rod and wrap sand paper around it. Back & forth with the paper along the stock's barrel channel. See if a dollar bill will slide between the barrel and the stock. If so, stain and seal. Test again.
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Old November 18, 2021, 06:27 PM   #20
Longshot4
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I looked at the Boyd stocks. they put a lot of details to make them look good. Infact I'm looking for a solid bred stock that will improve the accuracy. I don't see any thing to improve bedding. Also the but pads don't impress my tender shoulder.

Even though I do appreciate all your input. I will keep hunting for a Ruger 77/44 stock with my requirements.
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Old November 18, 2021, 07:48 PM   #21
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Just out of curiosity, why is 3 shots of .44 Mag in an inch not good enough??

You have a carbine sporter and those are not intended to be benchrest or match guns consistent with long shot strings.

Quote:
I don't agree with heat.
This is easy enough to check. Fire your three shots close together, and then take a "coffee break" and return to shooting when the rifle is again cold. Then see where shot #4 goes. If it goes into the same tight group the earlier shots did, then there's a good case for heat being the cause of the flyer.
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Old November 18, 2021, 08:02 PM   #22
BornFighting88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Longshot4 View Post
I looked at the Boyd stocks. they put a lot of details to make them look good. Infact I'm looking for a solid bred stock that will improve the accuracy. I don't see any thing to improve bedding. Also the but pads don't impress my tender shoulder.

Even though I do appreciate all your input. I will keep hunting for a Ruger 77/44 stock with my requirements.
You can buy an upgraded pad, last I checked. Bedding options are pillar bedding from Boyd’s. The laminate is easy enough to work with. I had to open up the receiver pocket for my Dumoulin 98, and it was a dream to work with. No delamination, just need to re-seal it. Also need to open the barrel channel, as they only cut it for a military barrel at Boyd’s. But its a dream to work with, and like I said, you can buy an upgraded pad right from them. You can get a thicker Kick-EEZ, or a 1” Decelerator I think.
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