No Blood Trail, Rifle Not Powerful Enough - Page 2

Art Eatman · February 19, 2012, 08:32 AM

I've had excellent results with Sierra's 150-grain flat-base in my '06, and I'm getting around 3,000 ft/sec without blowup problems.

Rifleman1776 · February 19, 2012, 09:11 AM

The tendancy is to always want bigger. Not usually necessary.
This past deer season I downed a big doe with my 30-06, dropped where she stood. The bullet was a 150 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip, not unlike the partition. The bullet went all the way through her and exited. Not a drop of blood to be seen anywhere until I cut her open.
I usually hunt with a traditional muzzle loader and pure (soft) lead round ball. The balls sometimes exit, sometimes not but the deer take an short leap and drop with seldom a blood trail.
Ye got yer deer, that's wat counts.

TX Hunter · February 19, 2012, 09:17 AM

Thanks Guys, I will try a different bullet, like the Hand Loaded ones for Hogs, and try to work on Shot Placement maby things will work out better.
Thanks for all the replys,

thallub · February 19, 2012, 09:20 AM

Quote:

I'm frustrated, and want a good blood trail,

Your are not going to get a good blood trail with hogs every time. You will not even get a good blood trail most of the time; that's the nature of hogs. There is no substitute for putting the bullet in the right place.

publius · February 19, 2012, 07:11 PM

Bullets can be unpredictable and do strange things. It sounds to me like you got a bad box of bullets though. Although Core-Lokt's aren't the best penetrators on the planet, they are good and are what I used back before I started handloading. I have killed dozens of whitetail with .308/.30-06 Core-Lokt's and almost always got exit wounds. I would suggest that you go buy some Federals loaded with Partitions.

jimbob86 · February 19, 2012, 07:56 PM

Quote:

As previously mentioned, the short barrel is costing you velocity.

Not enough to worry about, if Corelockts are "blowing up".

We took a good sized buck last fall with a Ruger Frontier in 7-08, 150 gr handloads, downloaded to 2400 for use by the kiddoes...... 150 gr "blemished bullets" from Midway ....... recovered the bullet and it weighs 76.5 grains..... 40 yard quartering away shot, hitting high in the ribs on the near side and lodging against a rib on the far side, tearin up the top of both lungs ....deer went 50 yards or so, spraying blood out the entrance wound with every breath......

I have chronographed several loads out of that gun, including Remington factory loads (150 gr Corelokts, 2660 f/sec), 139 gr Hornady Sp (40 gr IMR4064 gave 2525 f/sec) and the 150gr Midway blems (37.6 gr of the 4064 got me the 2400 f/sec I was looking for) ..... Top powders listed in my manuals were much slower, like RE19, H4350*, W760 and H414......but I figured that the 16.5" barrel of the Frontier would waste much of their oomph as flash and bang ..... so I chose a quicker powder, lower down on the list. It has worked pretty well..... 30/30 level energy with little recoil or blast, in a kid friendly package. Now to get a can for it!

*My brother used the H4350 in his daugter's A-Bolt (24" barrel) in 7-08 ..... got about 2800 f/sec out of it with Hornady SST's, IIRC.....

jimbob86 · February 19, 2012, 08:25 PM

Quote:

One was shot with a Nosler Ballistic-Tip, one with a Hornady SST. Good hits, dead deer, no blood trail. Interesting

Neither one of those are controlled expansion types, IIRC- if you need exits, you should to go with a bonded bullet like accubond, a Partition, or one of the all copper offerings like Scirrrocco, or TSX.

Oddly enough, I use a relatively soft bullet in my .270 WIN (150gr SIERRA Gameking) and get exits on all my broadside shots, even out to 460 yards...... on frontal shots under under 100, though, they break up and stop before they get to the diaphram. That's useful!

BIG P · February 19, 2012, 09:13 PM

I have 16'' saiga in 308 I use to hog hunt.I also use 150gr.SST hornady with the same no pass through But I've not had one go 20yds from impact yet,& Am getting pretty good penatration & blood trail from entrance wound.

So IMO just change your bullets you'll be fine.A couple of the hogs were 250-300lbs that I took with SST's might try them. good luck.

Kreyzhorse · February 19, 2012, 09:16 PM

Core-Lokts have always done a great job for me, but in your case, try some different ammo and see how that works for you. I'd guess a different round might help with an exit wound.

603Country · February 19, 2012, 10:00 PM

I shot an awful lot of deer with core-lokt bullet and had no problems that I can remember, but the bullet was mostly in my 35 Remington. That old 35 would penetrate most anything (deer, hog, engine block). Maybe at high velocities it'll destruct too soon. I can't say, though I wouldn't hesitate to use it.

TX Hunter · February 19, 2012, 10:45 PM

Well I tried my New Hand Load today, and suprisingly it was very accurate, and even hit the same place as my factory load did, Which is strange, but anyhow, I took it hunting this evening, and all I have to say is it hits like a Sledge Hammer.
I shot a Sow Hog this very evening with it at 160 yards, (known Yardage to Feeder) and It Penetrated the Skull Exited, went beside down the neck then penetrated again on the base of the neck and inside of the shoulder, Blew up the Heart we didnt find the bullet,but it was a head on shot, and with the distance it travled after striking bone I would say it was Excelent performance, Dead hog, my Son and I and a good friend Skinned the The Hog, and were all impressed with what the 180 grain handload did in the Carbine. It was impressive, and the accuracy suprised me because It was just a guess. I have no doubt that with a Rib Cage shot, that this load would exit and leave a Blood Trail.
Thanks for all the help guys, and I recomend this load. .308 Winchester Speer Hot Cor 180 over 39.5 Grains of IMR 4895. Taken out of the Complete Reloading manual for .308 Winchester, the little Yellow book.

HiBC · February 20, 2012, 05:07 AM

Good for you! That is one of the advantages of handloading.

phil mcwilliam · February 20, 2012, 08:13 PM

Each to their own, but Remington core-lokt 150 grain pointed soft points is the ammunition I use by choice in my .308. They won't always pass through a deer, & quite often the bullet is found just under the skin on the far shoulder, having expended all its energy within the deer. I've culled several hundred pigs using 150 grain .308's, & if pigs are running away after being chest shot, my guess is you are hitting them too far back.
I hope the 180 grain load works for you, but I won't be changing from what's worked for me for the last 25 years or so.

TX Hunter · February 20, 2012, 08:35 PM

I dont have anything against Coreloct bullets either, Ive have killed lots of game with them over the past several years too, They just didnt work the best for this short carbine.
I will still use them in my longer barreled Rifles.
Quick Question though, When shooting at a Hog, from the side, should I aim for The Shoulder, or Behind the Shoulder, to make a good shot ?

phil mcwilliam · February 20, 2012, 09:32 PM

I always aim for shoulder , neck or even head shots on pigs. If you aim behind the shoulder you will possibly just clip the lungs & your pig will keep running.

rickyrick · February 21, 2012, 05:51 AM

I aim for the neck, or very low just behind the leg. The low chest shot may be tricky at some distance. The neck is a fairly large target.

TX Hunter · February 21, 2012, 07:30 AM

Thanks for the tip Ricky Rick,

warbirdlover · February 21, 2012, 05:41 PM

I use 150 gr coreloks in my .300 Win Mag for deer and 180 gr for elk. No whitetail or mule deer, elk or black bear have ever gone farther then 10 yards after shot behind the shoulder. They usually drop on the spot. The bullet always goes through and puts a good hole in the animal. Not always alot of blood though. I want the shocking power. Weatherby knew what he was talking about.

The same goes for the 270 Win 130 gr I now use (corelok or ballistic tip Winchester). They go down like a rock.

the .308 and 30-06 I had did not put them down like this. Everything I've ever used (except a .243) has always penetrated (and the .243 would have to with nosler partitions).

603Country · February 21, 2012, 06:18 PM

I shoot em (deer, pigs, and coyotes) just behind the shoulder. That has always worked just fine, even on a 'godzilla' Boar I shot some 20 years ago (270, with 130 grain Ballistic Tips). I have always felt that the behind the shoulder shot, if you don't put the bullet too far back, gave me a larger kill zone - more of a vertical zone rather than horizontal. That's more forgiving (for me anyway) if you aren't sure of the range. I started doing it that way back when I had that old 35 Remington, which had a trajectory like a mortar round, and I just carried that approach over to my flatter shooting rifles.

LSnSC · February 21, 2012, 07:01 PM

Looks live you've found a load thet works. I've used an 18.5" barreled Model 7 for years with 150 Speer Mag Tips. They got impossible to find locally, so I switched to Sierra 150 Pro Hunters over Varget or H4895 with very good results on deer and pigs.
If you want to boost you velocity some and have a bullet that will expand and penetrate any hog or deer stem to stern, try the Barnes TTSX 130. I use the TTSX 95's in my 6.8 SPCII. They perform much better than you would think a light bullet at modest velocity should.

langenc · March 1, 2012, 11:03 PM

Corelokts exploding,really!!

They dont do that for me..

bobnoffs · March 6, 2012, 08:08 AM

it's the BULLET! i will never shoot another deer with a rem, 150 gr corelock bullet again.
i shot a 200 lb dressed buck this fall quartering at me at 150 yds with a .308. perfect shot placement in ''left front quarter' trailed him 2 hrs saturday, 6 hrs sunday, 5 hrs monday, of us outsmarted him and killed him tues. morning. his shoulder was obviouslt broken, bullet didn't exit. we had a fresh snow and he was hurt bad enough that he would bed every time i quit pushing. he would be where i left off the day before. he was also strong enough that out of 6-8 times i kicked him from his bed i only saw him once.
i don.t know about a 30/30 but i know a .308 ahould have ventilated him left front shoulder to right ham. it never got to a vital organ.
i posted this on another forum and asked for bullet recommendationsfor a better bullet. federal supreme[ or something like that] came up in 165 gr. one hunter said he has shot 30 deer with this load in .308 and never lost one. when i asked how the bullets expanded, did they breakup, his answer was he never shot a deer that the bullet stayed in!
i have shot broadside deer with the remington and that is pretty easy kill for any bullet but i will never carry that load again. i never want to do that to another animal or myself again.
bob noffs
n. wi.

MOshooter65202 · March 6, 2012, 08:35 AM

All bullets are not constructed equally,with this statement I am still a bit confused with the performance of the corelokts? Most reviews of this bullet always seems to get good reviews for hunting thin skinned game?

I personally hunt with 7mm rem mag and use Nosler Partition bullets with nothing but good results,I would try handloading with a better constructed bullet.

Good luck

GlockedNLoded32 · March 6, 2012, 08:53 AM

I would come up with your own load using hornady sst's they are great i use them for my .308 and I also use Hornady Amax as well both 168 grain

dlb0412 · March 6, 2012, 09:21 AM

Remington might be making there bullets cheaper like they do everything else now. Get a bonded bullet that keeps most of its weight. If you want it to exit stay away from sst and ballistic tips. Try 168 grain barnes tipped tripple shock. Your .308 is plenty powerfull for anything in the lower 48. Its not the rifle its the bullet. Good luck.

February 19, 2012, 07:11 PM	#30
publius Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2005 Location: Mississippi/Texas Posts: 2,505	Bullets can be unpredictable and do strange things. It sounds to me like you got a bad box of bullets though. Although Core-Lokt's aren't the best penetrators on the planet, they are good and are what I used back before I started handloading. I have killed dozens of whitetail with .308/.30-06 Core-Lokt's and almost always got exit wounds. I would suggest that you go buy some Federals loaded with Partitions. __________________ "Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress, but I repeat myself." Mark Twain

February 19, 2012, 09:16 PM	#34
Kreyzhorse Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2006 Location: NKY Posts: 12,463	Core-Lokts have always done a great job for me, but in your case, try some different ammo and see how that works for you. I'd guess a different round might help with an exit wound. __________________ "He who laughs last, laughs dead." Homer Simpson

February 20, 2012, 05:07 AM	#37
HiBC Senior Member Join Date: November 13, 2006 Posts: 8,283	Good for you! That is one of the advantages of handloading. Last edited by HiBC; February 23, 2012 at 05:30 AM.

February 20, 2012, 08:35 PM	#39
TX Hunter Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2010 Location: East Texas USA Posts: 1,805	Phil Mcwilliam I dont have anything against Coreloct bullets either, Ive have killed lots of game with them over the past several years too, They just didnt work the best for this short carbine. I will still use them in my longer barreled Rifles. Quick Question though, When shooting at a Hog, from the side, should I aim for The Shoulder, or Behind the Shoulder, to make a good shot ?

February 21, 2012, 05:51 AM	#41
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,236	I aim for the neck, or very low just behind the leg. The low chest shot may be tricky at some distance. The neck is a fairly large target. __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

February 19, 2012, 08:32 AM	#26
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	I've had excellent results with Sierra's 150-grain flat-base in my '06, and I'm getting around 3,000 ft/sec without blowup problems.

February 19, 2012, 09:11 AM	#27
Rifleman1776 Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 3,309	The tendancy is to always want bigger. Not usually necessary. This past deer season I downed a big doe with my 30-06, dropped where she stood. The bullet was a 150 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip, not unlike the partition. The bullet went all the way through her and exited. Not a drop of blood to be seen anywhere until I cut her open. I usually hunt with a traditional muzzle loader and pure (soft) lead round ball. The balls sometimes exit, sometimes not but the deer take an short leap and drop with seldom a blood trail. Ye got yer deer, that's wat counts.

February 19, 2012, 09:17 AM	#28
TX Hunter Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2010 Location: East Texas USA Posts: 1,805	Thanks Guys, I will try a different bullet, like the Hand Loaded ones for Hogs, and try to work on Shot Placement maby things will work out better. Thanks for all the replys,

February 19, 2012, 09:13 PM	#33
BIG P Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2010 Location: North Georgia Posts: 1,679	I have 16'' saiga in 308 I use to hog hunt.I also use 150gr.SST hornady with the same no pass through But I've not had one go 20yds from impact yet,& Am getting pretty good penatration & blood trail from entrance wound. So IMO just change your bullets you'll be fine.A couple of the hogs were 250-300lbs that I took with SST's might try them. good luck.

February 19, 2012, 10:00 PM	#35
603Country Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2011 Location: Thornton, Texas Posts: 3,998	I shot an awful lot of deer with core-lokt bullet and had no problems that I can remember, but the bullet was mostly in my 35 Remington. That old 35 would penetrate most anything (deer, hog, engine block). Maybe at high velocities it'll destruct too soon. I can't say, though I wouldn't hesitate to use it.

February 19, 2012, 10:45 PM	#36
TX Hunter Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2010 Location: East Texas USA Posts: 1,805	Well I tried my New Hand Load today, and suprisingly it was very accurate, and even hit the same place as my factory load did, Which is strange, but anyhow, I took it hunting this evening, and all I have to say is it hits like a Sledge Hammer. I shot a Sow Hog this very evening with it at 160 yards, (known Yardage to Feeder) and It Penetrated the Skull Exited, went beside down the neck then penetrated again on the base of the neck and inside of the shoulder, Blew up the Heart we didnt find the bullet,but it was a head on shot, and with the distance it travled after striking bone I would say it was Excelent performance, Dead hog, my Son and I and a good friend Skinned the The Hog, and were all impressed with what the 180 grain handload did in the Carbine. It was impressive, and the accuracy suprised me because It was just a guess. I have no doubt that with a Rib Cage shot, that this load would exit and leave a Blood Trail. Thanks for all the help guys, and I recomend this load. .308 Winchester Speer Hot Cor 180 over 39.5 Grains of IMR 4895. Taken out of the Complete Reloading manual for .308 Winchester, the little Yellow book.

February 20, 2012, 08:13 PM	#38
phil mcwilliam Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2007 Posts: 573	Each to their own, but Remington core-lokt 150 grain pointed soft points is the ammunition I use by choice in my .308. They won't always pass through a deer, & quite often the bullet is found just under the skin on the far shoulder, having expended all its energy within the deer. I've culled several hundred pigs using 150 grain .308's, & if pigs are running away after being chest shot, my guess is you are hitting them too far back. I hope the 180 grain load works for you, but I won't be changing from what's worked for me for the last 25 years or so.

February 20, 2012, 09:32 PM	#40
phil mcwilliam Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2007 Posts: 573	I always aim for shoulder , neck or even head shots on pigs. If you aim behind the shoulder you will possibly just clip the lungs & your pig will keep running.

February 21, 2012, 07:30 AM	#42
TX Hunter Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2010 Location: East Texas USA Posts: 1,805	Thanks for the tip Ricky Rick,

February 21, 2012, 05:41 PM	#43
warbirdlover Senior Member Join Date: December 13, 2009 Location: central Wisconsin Posts: 2,324	I use 150 gr coreloks in my .300 Win Mag for deer and 180 gr for elk. No whitetail or mule deer, elk or black bear have ever gone farther then 10 yards after shot behind the shoulder. They usually drop on the spot. The bullet always goes through and puts a good hole in the animal. Not always alot of blood though. I want the shocking power. Weatherby knew what he was talking about. The same goes for the 270 Win 130 gr I now use (corelok or ballistic tip Winchester). They go down like a rock. the .308 and 30-06 I had did not put them down like this. Everything I've ever used (except a .243) has always penetrated (and the .243 would have to with nosler partitions).

February 21, 2012, 06:18 PM	#44
603Country Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2011 Location: Thornton, Texas Posts: 3,998	I shoot em (deer, pigs, and coyotes) just behind the shoulder. That has always worked just fine, even on a 'godzilla' Boar I shot some 20 years ago (270, with 130 grain Ballistic Tips). I have always felt that the behind the shoulder shot, if you don't put the bullet too far back, gave me a larger kill zone - more of a vertical zone rather than horizontal. That's more forgiving (for me anyway) if you aren't sure of the range. I started doing it that way back when I had that old 35 Remington, which had a trajectory like a mortar round, and I just carried that approach over to my flatter shooting rifles.

February 21, 2012, 07:01 PM	#45
LSnSC Senior Member Join Date: January 5, 2010 Posts: 514	Looks live you've found a load thet works. I've used an 18.5" barreled Model 7 for years with 150 Speer Mag Tips. They got impossible to find locally, so I switched to Sierra 150 Pro Hunters over Varget or H4895 with very good results on deer and pigs. If you want to boost you velocity some and have a bullet that will expand and penetrate any hog or deer stem to stern, try the Barnes TTSX 130. I use the TTSX 95's in my 6.8 SPCII. They perform much better than you would think a light bullet at modest velocity should.

March 1, 2012, 11:03 PM	#46
langenc Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2007 Location: Montmorency Co, MI Posts: 1,551	Corelokts exploding,really!! They dont do that for me..

March 6, 2012, 08:08 AM	#47
bobnoffs Junior Member Join Date: March 6, 2012 Posts: 2	it's the BULLET! i will never shoot another deer with a rem, 150 gr corelock bullet again. i shot a 200 lb dressed buck this fall quartering at me at 150 yds with a .308. perfect shot placement in ''left front quarter' trailed him 2 hrs saturday, 6 hrs sunday, 5 hrs monday, of us outsmarted him and killed him tues. morning. his shoulder was obviouslt broken, bullet didn't exit. we had a fresh snow and he was hurt bad enough that he would bed every time i quit pushing. he would be where i left off the day before. he was also strong enough that out of 6-8 times i kicked him from his bed i only saw him once. i don.t know about a 30/30 but i know a .308 ahould have ventilated him left front shoulder to right ham. it never got to a vital organ. i posted this on another forum and asked for bullet recommendationsfor a better bullet. federal supreme[ or something like that] came up in 165 gr. one hunter said he has shot 30 deer with this load in .308 and never lost one. when i asked how the bullets expanded, did they breakup, his answer was he never shot a deer that the bullet stayed in! i have shot broadside deer with the remington and that is pretty easy kill for any bullet but i will never carry that load again. i never want to do that to another animal or myself again. bob noffs n. wi.

March 6, 2012, 08:35 AM	#48
MOshooter65202 Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2011 Posts: 471	All bullets are not constructed equally,with this statement I am still a bit confused with the performance of the corelokts? Most reviews of this bullet always seems to get good reviews for hunting thin skinned game? I personally hunt with 7mm rem mag and use Nosler Partition bullets with nothing but good results,I would try handloading with a better constructed bullet. Good luck

March 6, 2012, 08:53 AM	#49
GlockedNLoded32 Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2011 Location: Houston, Tx Posts: 129	I would come up with your own load using hornady sst's they are great i use them for my .308 and I also use Hornady Amax as well both 168 grain __________________ GLOCK 32 .357 SIG With Hogue Grip,Trijicon Ghost Ring Night Sight, 3.5 Ghost trigger, Weatherby Vanguard .308 1:12 twist with Blackhawk Bipod and a Barska 6x24x60 IR SWAT SCOPE. - 168 Hornady AMAX loaded at 46 gr Stoeger M2000 Max 4 SA 12 gauge

March 6, 2012, 09:21 AM	#50
dlb0412 Senior Member Join Date: March 4, 2012 Posts: 136	Remington might be making there bullets cheaper like they do everything else now. Get a bonded bullet that keeps most of its weight. If you want it to exit stay away from sst and ballistic tips. Try 168 grain barnes tipped tripple shock. Your .308 is plenty powerfull for anything in the lower 48. Its not the rifle its the bullet. Good luck.