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Old February 15, 2019, 10:14 PM   #26
ninosdemente
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Here is what I was able to do with the drill bit and tap. Not the prettiest but I was able make it. Although was put on a vice, I did not do it straight enough as I can see it wobbles a bit when screwing it on the gauge. Also not sure when placed on the vice, when tightened if it "deformed" the case a bit as well. Took me 4 tries, I started with a small bit and worked my way up to the last bit.

http://www.mentegraphics.com/pictures/91.jpg
http://www.mentegraphics.com/pictures/92.jpg
http://www.mentegraphics.com/pictures/93.jpg
http://www.mentegraphics.com/pictures/94.jpg
http://www.mentegraphics.com/pictures/95.jpg
http://www.mentegraphics.com/pictures/96.jpg
http://www.mentegraphics.com/pictures/97.jpg
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Old February 16, 2019, 12:07 PM   #27
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ninosdemente, you did great, when it comes to holding a case consider holding it with the die. I do not give it a second thought, I use the die to hold the case. I have presses that allow me to remove the shell holder without lowering the ram, after I have removed the shell holder and lowered the ram I screw the die out of the press, invert it and then screw the die in upside down with the case head up. On larger calibers I do not remove the die, I drill through the mouth of the case and if the mouth of the case is large enough in diameter for the tap, tap it.

From the beginning: I said all of the tools mentioned were not necessary. Why?

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Old February 16, 2019, 12:41 PM   #28
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What press are you using to do that? Curious if I can find something online showing a video of the steps you take, if there are any. I have a RCBS Rock Chucker.

I tried the block of wood with a drilled hole, split in half for holding the brass with the vice. The drilling of the brass was not bad, just the tap part went downhill as I tried doing it by hand. The brass kept rotating when I tried tapping. Ended up with cracked extractor groove on two separate occasions.
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Old February 16, 2019, 01:34 PM   #29
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What press are you using to do that? Curious if I can find something online showing a video of the steps you take, if there are any. I have a RCBS Rock Chucker.
I have 3 Rock Chuckers, not a one of Rock Chuckers will cam over, not a problem because I am not sensitive.

Raise the ram, do not lower the handle! And then rotate the shell holder to align the shell holder slot with the case and the slot is facing back' then pull the shell holder forward.

Without the case the shell holder can only be removed from the ram by pulling the shell holder forward.

F. Guffey



What it is? You are looking for; you want the shell holder to slide off the ram and the case at the same time.

Practice: Slide the shell holder onto the ram, you will notice it will only go on one way. You must align the slot in the ram and shell holder facing forward. And if one day you see a U-Tube video demonstrating the removal of a shell holder without lowering the ram make sure they give me credit for it. These guys are very stingy when it comes to sharing.

F. Guffey

Last edited by F. Guffey; February 16, 2019 at 01:43 PM. Reason: cchange c to d
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Old February 19, 2019, 07:40 AM   #30
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"well damn, I was just wrong about everything on that tap

here is a link on Amazon for a tap and drill combo $19. They do not even use a L, this one is a 7.3 MM which is which is between a 9/32 and a L . I wonder if Hornady could have found a stranger thread size ?"

Yeah, it sure does seem like they worked at it, but considering the relatively thin area to be threaded and the aluminum tool, I guess they went for all the threads they could get without the threads stripping off of the tool.

Guffy's advice about using the die to hold the case is spot on, I used a 3" chunk of 1-1/4 aluminum round bored and internal threaded 7/8x14 to hold the die in my lathe chuck. You do have to take the de-capping stem out of the size die.

Another way is to just use the "factory" modified case and just do the math.

Last edited by 1100 tac; February 19, 2019 at 07:51 AM.
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Old February 19, 2019, 10:20 AM   #31
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You do have to take the de-capping stem out of the size die.
I remove the primer punch/neck sizing ball assemble. One reason: there is a big chance the die can not be inverted with the case head protruding from the top op the die, and then there is the die being held in the press; the lock ring secures the die to the press when the die needs to be secured.

And then there are cases that get stuck in the die. I do not drill little bity tiny holes in the case head for little bitty tiny threads for little bitty tiny bolts when using a case puller. I go for the 3/8 inch drill, tap and bolt for pulling: BUT! there are primer punch/neck sizing assembles that can not be removed from the top of the die; with the large hole in the case head I can drop the assemble out the bottom. Removing the assemble give the reloader more room to operate and it reduces the chance of damaging the assemble.

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Old February 19, 2019, 12:50 PM   #32
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I did another modified case for the 30-06... after many brass later I finally got one clean and centered drilled/tap. Felt good up until I saw the bad ones on the trash. Lol, was going to happen regardless. Drilled hole from the inside.

Then proceeded to make the .223 once again. No luck yet. Gotta keep trying.

I was planning on making two of each but after the battles, I better make sure I don't lose either one as only making 1 of each instead.
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Old February 19, 2019, 12:51 PM   #33
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Or just buy the factory ones?
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Old February 19, 2019, 01:47 PM   #34
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I was contemplating on that, but since I purchased the bit/tap I am just hard headed and refuse to go this route. Lol. I might just do that for the .223 though.

I have one made for the .223 from the link above. Just stubborn.
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Old February 19, 2019, 02:13 PM   #35
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if you have a drill press for a .223 case take a scrap of 2 x 4 and drill a size U bit or a 3/8ths hole about a inch and a quarter into the wood and use that as holder for your case, place the case into it drill the pilot hole for the tap. Leave the case in the homemade 2 x 4 case holder and chuck the tap into the drill press but DO NOT TURN ON DRILL PRESS. Instead use the feed mechanism to put downward pressure on the tap while turning the spindle or chuck of the drillpress by hand. That should give you a reasonably straight, it does not have to be perfect for the comparitor to work
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Old February 19, 2019, 04:05 PM   #36
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I have one made for the .223 from the link above. Just stubborn.
I won't say that I am not, but as I get older and the end is closer than the beginning you being to wonder if you should spend you time on something more important! (shooting, beer (ice cream for me) motor cycles (though that has brought the end closer than I liked a few times but then some guy tried to prang me driving home int he Wagon last night so.....
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Old February 19, 2019, 11:28 PM   #37
ninosdemente
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I did try the wood block method... only that it was mentioned elsewhere not here to cut it in half... Unfortunately don't have a drill press, just a simple vice. Darn... sucks when you don't have friends that have the tools you need. Lol.
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Old February 20, 2019, 11:07 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by 100 Tac
"well damn, I was just wrong about everything on that tap

here is a link on Amazon for a tap and drill combo $19. They do not even use a L, this one is a 7.3 MM which is which is between a 9/32 and a L . I wonder if Hornady could have found a stranger thread size ?"
Hornady didn't do it. They bought the design from Stoney Point.

7.3 mm is wrong, IMHO. Letter L is right. Letter L, at 0.2900" falls between the maximum minor (inside) diameter of the female thread (0.2890") and its minimum pitch diameter (halfway up the thread, 0.2945") to guarantee you get at least 50% thread (plenty for this low load application). The tap maker probably aims between the minimum and maximum minor diameter somewhere, which means it is possible for it to exceed 7.3 mm. 7.3 mm, at 0.2874", is between the minimum and maximum minor diameter numbers, if the drill is actually that size. I've never measured a standard drill that was oversize. Most seem to be between about -0.001" and -0.003" from the nominal drill diameter. That way, unless you wobble the drill, they won't ever make an oversize hole. You are expected to use a reamer to finish a hole if you want it exact.

Bottom line, the 7.3 mm drill bit could actually be leaving enough brass that the tap is both cutting threads and final reaming the hole size. That would make the tap hard to cut threads with and it will put a lot of torque on the case in its holder. If the cases are not slipping during drilling but during tapping, it would explain all the scoring of Ninosdemente's cases. Bottom line, see if you can pick up a letter L drill, then after the 7.3 mm drilling is done, run the L in for final clean-up. It will make the tapping easier to do and less likely to cause slipping. The tap will also start in more easily.


Ninosdemente,

I have used drilled 2×4 and hot melt glue to hold cases for sectioning on my bandsaw. I think, though, that if you put the 2×4 in your vice and drill about a 15/32 hole through it, you will find you can tap the 30-06 case into it for a tight enough grip. If that fails, the hot melt glue will anchor it. The only thing is, you will likely have to split the wood to get it out peel and scrape the hotmelt off of it afterward. Without it, you just knock the case out. It's not that hard to get the glue off. It is just an extra bother.

To get the pilot hole and tap in straight while the case is in the 2×4, wrap a wide strip of paper around the protruding part of the case to make a tube that sticks up an inch or so above it and use a rubber band to hold it in place. This will give you a visual reference for staying centered, letting you see if the drill or tap are leaning very much to one side. The human eye is good at seeing true concentric centering, so this makes you more accurate than you might expect.
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Old February 20, 2019, 11:28 AM   #39
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UncleNick is correct it is a letter L drill. I do mine in my lathe so I don't have all the other problems.
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Old February 20, 2019, 02:53 PM   #40
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To get the pilot hole and tap in straight while the case is in the 2×4, wrap a wide strip of paper around the protruding part of the case to make a tube that sticks up an inch or so above it and use a rubber band to hold it in place. This will give you a visual reference for staying centered, letting you see if the drill or tap are leaning very much to one side. The human eye is good at seeing true concentric centering, so this makes you more accurate than you might expect
.

I do not expect anyone to do as I do because there is not as much drama associated with my methods and or techniques. I have purchased large batches from Pat's reloading. Knowing I am going to need the cases for different projects I start by necking 300 cases up to 338/06 or 35 Whelen for JIC as in just in case.

And then there is the off the land thing. For years reloaders shredded the necks of the case to reduce tension; not me, I want all the bullet hold I can get so I neck size the case for bullet hold. And then there is off the lands and to the lands. When I go for all the lands I want my bullets to have 'the running start, on occasion the running start is called the jump start. I want my bullets to start running before they hit the lands.

When I want my bullet to have that jump I make transfers, I make transfers to transfer the dimensions of the chamber to the seating die.

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Old February 21, 2019, 12:22 AM   #41
ninosdemente
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I did the 30-06 successfully. Unfortunately the .223 still giving me a hard time. Just when trying to tap, its when I run into trouble. Will have to try the die method.
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Old February 21, 2019, 11:05 AM   #42
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ninosdemente, In the beginning I said the modified case was not necessary meaning the Hornady straight or bent tool is not necessary; when it comes to 'not necessary' that includes all of the trappings and rigging for the dial caliper.

I make transfers to transfer the dimension of the chamber to the seating die. There is something about starting over everyday that is not necessary.

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Old February 24, 2019, 06:00 PM   #43
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FG, do you think ND is going to be able to "make transfers"??
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Old February 25, 2019, 09:29 AM   #44
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FG, do you think ND is going to be able to "make transfers"??
1100 tac, "Going to be able to...?", yes sir. Individuals with shop skills have been making transfers since the beginning. A reloader closes the bolt, the chamber goes dark and then? The light in the mind goes out. It does not have to be that way but we have many reloaders with limited skills.

Many years ago I decided I would build a rifle, the advise I got was unbelievable. I was told I had to do this, I could not do that and "no one knows where they are when starting and finishing a chamber so the chamber must be measured often".

I did not win friends and or influence people by asking them why they did not know the length of the chamber or why they could not keep up from start to finish; and then they started with "You got to have 3 head space gage" and I asked what is it they can do with the shortest gage that they could not do with the longest gage.

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Old February 25, 2019, 12:08 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Ninodesmente
I did the 30-06 successfully. Unfortunately the .223 still giving me a hard time. Just when trying to tap, its when I run into trouble.
Did you get the letter L drill? That will make it easier. If you are really stuck for a holder, you can super-glue a case into a hole in wood and dissolve it off with acetone (nail polish remover) later.
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Old February 25, 2019, 06:39 PM   #46
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Yes, did get the L drill bit. At least for me... wasn't any easier with that bit.
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Old February 25, 2019, 06:51 PM   #47
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but we have many reloaders with limited skills.
THAT IS ME, SO I DO IT SIMPLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now I could not only talk but work you ear off on a Transfer Switch. But that transfers electricity and not chambers.

Nor am I machinist (nor ever was 98% of the country ever)
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