CZ85 pre b (1988) jams up every 30 rounds or so

Don'tkillbill · August 20, 2013, 08:19 PM

As the title says my most accurate pistol is my least reliable

This board seems to have some strong gun knowledge and helped me along with my revolver.

Some say the old mags and other say its the ejectors. One even said its a tight bore. Seems to get worse as the gun gets warm. The first box of ammo is usually good or 1 failure to eject. Racking the gun the ejector picks up the empty easily. I tapped out the ejector and cleaned it and the spring seems fine.

Mags or Ejectors?

I guess I'll borrow some mags and put 100 through it.

I labelled my mags and it jams with either mag.

Roughedge · August 21, 2013, 03:55 PM

Is it jaming or failing to eject? Is the ammo clean and shinny? Is it the same round in the mag everytime or is it random? Sounds like your getting a weak round now and then or I know you cant be limp wristing now and then. Is it factory or reloads?

g.willikers · August 22, 2013, 12:36 PM

Ejector or Extractor?
The part that holds on to the case rim, or the part that punches the case out of the gun?
What kind of jam?
With the loaded round going in or the empty case coming out?
Under the back of the barrel or part way in the barrel?

Don'tkillbill · August 22, 2013, 08:20 PM

Its failing to extract a round. I don't think its limp wristing.

Both of my mags are old and they both have seen multible jams. I have them marked blue and red and it doesn't seem to have an affect.

I heard the first generation of 10 rounds round mags had issues and my mags are 1988.

I shoot both factory and reloads- That was my first thought. With 9 mm mostly factory and both jam.

This weekend I will put 50 through her with a new mag from my friend.

I cleaned the extractor and spring by removing them and getting the carbon out.

g.willikers · August 23, 2013, 08:40 AM

Generally, extraction issues aren't directly associated with mag problems, unless the outgoing case is being interferred with by the next round coming up from the mag.
If the new mag from your friend doesn't cure it, try chambering a loaded round, removing the mag, (if it has a mag safety, put an empty one back in the gun) and see if the fired case ejects.
If it still jams, describe exactly what the jam looks like, and where the empty brass winds up, in the gun.

Jim Watson · August 23, 2013, 09:46 AM

I would replace the extractor spring first.
My "pre B" had similar failures. CZ USA sold me an extractor and spring for $13 which fixed the problem. From what I have seen since, the spring might have been all that was really needed.

Wolff says: "Extra power extractor springs are available to correct extraction problems common in the CZ-75/85 series pistols - all calibers. Wolff springs are approximately 25% stronger than factory springs."

The Wolff extra power CZ extractor spring is only $3.49. Of course they will eat you up with "shipping and handling" on a single item, so make up a shopping list at Wolff or Midway.

http://www.gunsprings.com/Semi-Auto%...ID16/dID91#841

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/645...p9-extra-power

jmr40 · August 23, 2013, 11:38 AM

I would replace every spring in the gun and in every magazine while I'm at it. Common problem with CZ's.

Don'tkillbill · August 24, 2013, 04:29 PM

Gwilikers that sounds like the problem. The mag tries to feed too soon. What would cause that? bad mag lips?

g.willikers · August 24, 2013, 04:56 PM

If the mag is letting loose of the cartridges too soon, the lips could be a little too far apart.
Assuming the mags are generally ok, no actual damage anywhere, the lips could be squeezed together a little.
The trick is where along their length to squeeze.
Have you tried the new mag, yet?

Don'tkillbill · August 25, 2013, 01:27 PM

Tried a new factory mag today and it jammed at round 43 after it was warmed up a bit but not hot. ON the fifth mag it jammed and it had the spent case 1/2 out and the other round loading.

Sounds extractor-ish could it be the main recoil spring. For an old gun its still got stiff springs.

Jim Watson · August 25, 2013, 05:03 PM

I tried all that stuff for you.
Replace the extractor spring.
If that doesn't work, you have a gunsmith problem. The house mechanic at CZ USA is pretty good.

Don'tkillbill · August 25, 2013, 07:17 PM

Jim did you have the same issue and if so was it just the spring?

Jim Watson · August 25, 2013, 07:23 PM

Yes, very similar behavior.
I replaced both the spring and extractor because it was only $13 at the time.
They had gotten tired of sending out freebies, not knowing if it was to replace a bad unit or somebody just wanting free spares.

From my reading since then, I think a fresh stiff spring would have been enough. But I no longer have the old extractor to test that with.

Don'tkillbill · August 25, 2013, 07:53 PM

Jim,

Thanks so much for the help. I just ordered some springs and will see. Hopefully the xp extractor springs will be enough to fix this old pistol. I had to make a 25 dollar order so I got new springs for most of the gun. Xtra stiff.

I just wish I could get mag drops out of her and this issue goes away then I will use it for our service shoots. The sights are old but I do like them a lot.

Jim Watson · August 25, 2013, 09:47 PM

When you change the mainspring, or just take off the grips and look, you will see how the magazine brake works. Either take it out and hammer it flat or order the one used in the CZ85 which comes flat. Do not just leave it out, that will let a fast reload jam against the grip screw bosses in the frame.

Don'tkillbill · August 26, 2013, 03:29 PM

My gun is a 85C made in 1988 and its not a free falling magazine. I did take it out and bend the brake it but it still catches. I tried it with my buddies' mag and its the same deal. I will order one when I get the other issue straightened out.

Jim Watson · August 26, 2013, 07:12 PM

Well, then, I don't know about that one, either.

You might paint a magazine with felt marker or lipstick and find where it is dragging.

August 20, 2013, 08:19 PM	#1
Don'tkillbill Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2013 Location: East Coast of Canada Posts: 121	CZ85 pre b (1988) jams up every 30 rounds or so As the title says my most accurate pistol is my least reliable This board seems to have some strong gun knowledge and helped me along with my revolver. Some say the old mags and other say its the ejectors. One even said its a tight bore. Seems to get worse as the gun gets warm. The first box of ammo is usually good or 1 failure to eject. Racking the gun the ejector picks up the empty easily. I tapped out the ejector and cleaned it and the spring seems fine. Mags or Ejectors? I guess I'll borrow some mags and put 100 through it. I labelled my mags and it jams with either mag.

August 21, 2013, 03:55 PM	#2
Roughedge Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2011 Location: Monroe,NC Posts: 669	Is it jaming or failing to eject? Is the ammo clean and shinny? Is it the same round in the mag everytime or is it random? Sounds like your getting a weak round now and then or I know you cant be limp wristing now and then. Is it factory or reloads? __________________ The man that die's with the most stuff win's!

August 22, 2013, 12:36 PM	#3
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Ejector or Extractor? The part that holds on to the case rim, or the part that punches the case out of the gun? What kind of jam? With the loaded round going in or the empty case coming out? Under the back of the barrel or part way in the barrel? __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

August 23, 2013, 08:40 AM	#5
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Generally, extraction issues aren't directly associated with mag problems, unless the outgoing case is being interferred with by the next round coming up from the mag. If the new mag from your friend doesn't cure it, try chambering a loaded round, removing the mag, (if it has a mag safety, put an empty one back in the gun) and see if the fired case ejects. If it still jams, describe exactly what the jam looks like, and where the empty brass winds up, in the gun. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

August 24, 2013, 04:56 PM	#9
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	If the mag is letting loose of the cartridges too soon, the lips could be a little too far apart. Assuming the mags are generally ok, no actual damage anywhere, the lips could be squeezed together a little. The trick is where along their length to squeeze. Have you tried the new mag, yet? __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

August 22, 2013, 08:20 PM	#4
Don'tkillbill Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2013 Location: East Coast of Canada Posts: 121	Its failing to extract a round. I don't think its limp wristing. Both of my mags are old and they both have seen multible jams. I have them marked blue and red and it doesn't seem to have an affect. I heard the first generation of 10 rounds round mags had issues and my mags are 1988. I shoot both factory and reloads- That was my first thought. With 9 mm mostly factory and both jam. This weekend I will put 50 through her with a new mag from my friend. I cleaned the extractor and spring by removing them and getting the carbon out.

August 23, 2013, 09:46 AM	#6
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	I would replace the extractor spring first. My "pre B" had similar failures. CZ USA sold me an extractor and spring for $13 which fixed the problem. From what I have seen since, the spring might have been all that was really needed. Wolff says: "Extra power extractor springs are available to correct extraction problems common in the CZ-75/85 series pistols - all calibers. Wolff springs are approximately 25% stronger than factory springs." The Wolff extra power CZ extractor spring is only $3.49. Of course they will eat you up with "shipping and handling" on a single item, so make up a shopping list at Wolff or Midway. http://www.gunsprings.com/Semi-Auto%...ID16/dID91#841 http://www.midwayusa.com/product/645...p9-extra-power

August 23, 2013, 11:38 AM	#7
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,808	I would replace every spring in the gun and in every magazine while I'm at it. Common problem with CZ's.

August 24, 2013, 04:29 PM	#8
Don'tkillbill Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2013 Location: East Coast of Canada Posts: 121	Gwilikers that sounds like the problem. The mag tries to feed too soon. What would cause that? bad mag lips?

August 25, 2013, 01:27 PM	#10
Don'tkillbill Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2013 Location: East Coast of Canada Posts: 121	Tried a new factory mag today and it jammed at round 43 after it was warmed up a bit but not hot. ON the fifth mag it jammed and it had the spent case 1/2 out and the other round loading. Sounds extractor-ish could it be the main recoil spring. For an old gun its still got stiff springs.

August 25, 2013, 05:03 PM	#11
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	I tried all that stuff for you. Replace the extractor spring. If that doesn't work, you have a gunsmith problem. The house mechanic at CZ USA is pretty good.

August 25, 2013, 07:17 PM	#12
Don'tkillbill Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2013 Location: East Coast of Canada Posts: 121	Jim did you have the same issue and if so was it just the spring?

August 25, 2013, 07:23 PM	#13
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	Yes, very similar behavior. I replaced both the spring and extractor because it was only $13 at the time. They had gotten tired of sending out freebies, not knowing if it was to replace a bad unit or somebody just wanting free spares. From my reading since then, I think a fresh stiff spring would have been enough. But I no longer have the old extractor to test that with.

August 25, 2013, 07:53 PM	#14
Don'tkillbill Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2013 Location: East Coast of Canada Posts: 121	Jim, Thanks so much for the help. I just ordered some springs and will see. Hopefully the xp extractor springs will be enough to fix this old pistol. I had to make a 25 dollar order so I got new springs for most of the gun. Xtra stiff. I just wish I could get mag drops out of her and this issue goes away then I will use it for our service shoots. The sights are old but I do like them a lot.

August 25, 2013, 09:47 PM	#15
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	When you change the mainspring, or just take off the grips and look, you will see how the magazine brake works. Either take it out and hammer it flat or order the one used in the CZ85 which comes flat. Do not just leave it out, that will let a fast reload jam against the grip screw bosses in the frame.

August 26, 2013, 03:29 PM	#16
Don'tkillbill Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2013 Location: East Coast of Canada Posts: 121	My gun is a 85C made in 1988 and its not a free falling magazine. I did take it out and bend the brake it but it still catches. I tried it with my buddies' mag and its the same deal. I will order one when I get the other issue straightened out.

August 26, 2013, 07:12 PM	#17
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	Well, then, I don't know about that one, either. You might paint a magazine with felt marker or lipstick and find where it is dragging.