Shilen, Douglas, or ? for 6mm Remington

[wileybelch]

Looking for insights on choice for a 10" twist 6mm barrel. A #3 or #4 contour will work fine when used on a 1903 Springfield. In recent years barrel makers have been coming out of the woodwork and I haven't needed to rebarrel anything for a couple of decades. All previous barrels were Douglas (via Brownells). Thoughts on current barrels would be welcome.

[Jimro]

I like Lothar Walther, but the last three barrels I've purchased have been a Krieger and two Criterion.

Jimro

[Catfish]

For a hunting rifle there are a lot of barrel makers out there. I have had excellent luck with Douglas and Shillen. I have heard good reports about Green Mountain and Mc Gowen also.

[Buzzard Bait]

Douglas is the only after market barrel I have ever purchased. The first ten or fifteen shoots were disappointing and I was scared, then it tightened up with a few more shoots. Since then it has been a very pleasing very accurate barrel. I would defiantly buy another one It was one of his up grade barrels star gauge and select I believe is what it was called its been a few years.

[Scorch]

For a hunting rifle, get a Green Mountain. You will get a barrel that is far better than a factory barrel without the extra frills target shooters are looking for. Not that the others aren't good barrels, just that for a hunting rifle, a Green Mountain barrel is more than "good enough". I just finished a build using a Green Mountain barrel (444 Marlin on a Mauser action) and it puts 5 shots into under an inch at 100 yds. The other build I just finished (7X57on a Mauser) used a McGowen barrel, and it shoots 5 into about an inch as well. Last year I rebarreled a Rem 700 in 7mm Rem Mag using a Green Mountain barrel, and the customer shot a 1-1/2" group at 300 yds sighting it in.

[Clark]

In July 2015 I built a 6mmRem rifle on a 1903 Turk action with a Douglas barrel.
I made a combination recoil lug / front pillar from Aluminum.

It did not get to go hunting in the fall of 2015.
It suffered a bolt weld failure and did not recover fast enough to catch up with the other 2015 rifles.

[T. O'Heir]

What's your budget?
Shilen ready to install barrels start at $400.00. $314.00 for a Douglas No 2 or 3 contour.

[ripnbst]

I opted for Bartlein w/ 5R rifling and I am pleased with my decision.

Scorch, that sounds like poor advice to me. Factory rifles today put rounds into less than an inch. Unless a Green Mountain barrel is $150 or less I would go for the best barrel I could afford, community catered to be damned. Nearly every bench rest barrel mfg offers thinner profile hunting barrels.

Check out bugholes.com for about the widest selection of in stock barrels I'm aware of.

[MarkCO]

Yes, Budget and purpose matter when we talk about barrels.

I have bought blanks from Green Mountain for $22 and barrels that cost $600.

[Jimro]

ripnbst, Scorch actually gave very good advice from a money perspective. Green Mountain makes two types of rifled barrels, cut or button. All the other big names do either cut or button rifled barrels.

Unless you are looking for a custom rifling profile not offered by Green Mountain (radial, ratchet, polygonal) you are essentially buying a stress relieved barrel blank. Sure the double stress relief on a premium barrel is a good thing, but for a hunting rifle I'm not going to be shooting an 88 shot cross the course High Power match.

In terms of performance, even an out of true factory barrel can shoot sub-MOA for a group or two. As long as the shooter pays attention to the barrel heat load then it is possible to get very good accuracy. But it doesn't mean that a factory barrel, even from brands known for accuracy, are equal to an aftermarket barrel. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQMfwU52xtA

Jimro

[Scorch]

Scorch, that sounds like poor advice to me.

Not to offend, but I don't care. He asked for opinions and I gave him mine. You gave him yours. See how that works?

Factory rifles today put rounds into less than an inch.

If you had read my post before getting all puffed up, you would have seen that I recently used Green Mountain barrels on a couple of milsurp actions (like the OP is trying to use) and got sub-MOA performance.

Unless a Green Mountain barrel is $150 or less I would go for the best barrel I could afford

You should check before you go spouting off. Green Mountain barrels typically cost just over $100. They are generally considered a 1/4 MOA barrel, a good hunting or varminting barrel, not a benchrest or match barrel. In order to shrink that group by 50%, you have to spend 3-4 times as much on a barrel. In order to shrink it by 75%, you have to spend 6-7X as much.

Check out bugholes.com

That is a benchrester's forum. I don't believe the OP is a benchrester, otherwise he would probably not be rebarrelling a Springfield.

I opted for Bartlein w/ 5R rifling and I am pleased with my decision.

OK. So you opted for a $400+ barrel, and have every reason to be pleased with it. Since the OP says he wants to rebarrel a Springfield, I assume he is looking for a hunting rifle barrel. Most hunters don't want to buy a barrel that costs more than a new rifle. I know this, I build rifles for a living.

[hooligan1]

Not only does he need to pick a barrel, he needs a Smith that is capable of cutting a cone breech and an ejector groove...
Taylorce1 recommended to me Pac Nor, because they do all that for you. I opted not to rebarrel my 03 for now and just shoot the old barrel out.
The fellas at Pac Nor are decent to talk with..

[barnbwt]

"They are generally considered a 1/4 MOA barrel, a good hunting or varminting barrel, not a benchrest or match barrel. In order to shrink that group by 50%, you have to spend 3-4 times as much on a barrel. In order to shrink it by 75%, you have to spend 6-7X as much."

Wait, wait, wait; 1/16 MOA?! Does powder even burn consistently enough to realize that? How are you arriving at that number? I thought the fixture-mounted 'rail guns' operated with remote triggers only get like 1/4MOA, using every impractical trick there is.

One thing to note with GM barrels, is they are button rifled. In turning several, I have found that some warpage & chatter seems to occur in diameters under 5/8". Not something a 1/6MOA benchrest shooter would be interested in, but the distorted metal --even normalized/stress relieved afterward-- might make turning the profile very narrow a bit more difficult. I've not had the pleasure to mess with cut rifled or hammer-forged blanks, as they are $$$$, so I can't say if they'd suffer similar issues.

Regardless of barrel, the chamber, crown, and bolt engagement will have infinitely more impact on accuracy (as will selection of bullet/load for the twist rate).

TCB

[tobnpr]

I have been researching GM barrels to use for Mosin-Nagant project rifles, and called GM to speak with them about it.

Corresponded with several gunsmiths that use them as well- and all spoke highly of them for the price. I will be ordering several blanks shortly.

As mentioned, depends on the OP's intended use for the rifle and budget.
No reason to spend $350 for a barrel if it's intended for whitetail at 200 yards.

The other big deal is, that screwing a match barrel onto an '03 isn't going to wring all the accuracy possible out of it without doing all the other things that are required- trueing the receiver, locking lugs, etc....some more important than otheres. But to think that a Shilen is going to shoot 1/4 minute when screwed onto an '03 "because it's a Shilen" is a poor bet, IMO.

Without additional work to the receiver, stock, etc. I don't think a GM would shoot much worse than a barrel costing three or four times as much.

[Scorch]

Wait, wait, wait; 1/16 MOA?!

I don't want to argue whether it is possible for most shooters to shoot a 1/16 MOA group, but the world record for 5 shots at 100 yds is .009", nine one-thousandths of an inch, so it is possible. A couple of years ago, Jim Carmichael of Outdoor Life fame shot a .122" at 200 yds. Typical club shoots turn in groups of .150"-.200" routinely enough to not even raise eyebrows. I tuned a rifle I built for a shooter, and he went and shot 5 shots into .027". What you usually find is that the shooter limits the performance of the rifle more than the rifle limits the shooter.

[velocette]

In reply to some previous less than wonderful comments about Scorch's opinion.
IM(nv)HO, Scorch's advice has been spot on both with information here on this forum and privately. He is a seasoned and thoroughly professional gunsmith by trade.

[Jimro]

One thing to note with GM barrels, is they are button rifled. In turning several, I have found that some warpage & chatter seems to occur in diameters under 5/8". Not something a 1/6MOA benchrest shooter would be interested in, but the distorted metal --even normalized/stress relieved afterward-- might make turning the profile very narrow a bit more difficult. I've not had the pleasure to mess with cut rifled or hammer-forged blanks, as they are $$$$, so I can't say if they'd suffer similar issues.

5/8" = 0.625" in decimal. Which in my opinion is a bit on the thin side for a rifle barrel. I know there are plenty of hunting rifles out there with very thin barrels, but if you look at Douglas for example, the only barrel profile that even has a muzzle dimension under 0.625 is the Featherweight profile with a 0.560" muzzle. Even the next thinnest, the #3 profile is 0.625 at the muzzle, the rest of the barrel is thicker.

So unless you want a featherweight profile, chatter under 5/8 of an inch wouldn't concern me.

Jimro