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Old October 11, 2015, 12:09 PM   #26
Mobuck
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Back when my kids were in grade school, there was a "book bag" that folded out into a small but somewhat effective ballistic blanket. Trouble was- it only held one book.
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Old October 11, 2015, 12:38 PM   #27
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"...clipboard or bag insert..." Think in terms of a 115 grain 9mm bullet with an MV of 1100ish FPS and an ME of roughly 31,000 to 32,000 PSI. Think a clip board will help? And a Level 3, 9 x 14, ballistic, clip board runs $65.
A kid will not hump anything heavy. A bulletproof KID'S back pack starts at $300ish. No weights given.
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Old October 11, 2015, 07:43 PM   #28
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If you are that worried perhaps working or sending your kid dis to public school is not for you. And unlike someone who said they are responsible for your safety, hogwash. You CHOOSE to work there. If it is too dangerous for your liking go elsewhere. How many millions of key dis go to school everyday with no issues. If you want to worry about every possible what if scenario, then maybe barricading yourself in your home is the best choice for you.
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Old October 11, 2015, 08:38 PM   #29
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You CHOOSE to work there. If it is too dangerous for your liking go elsewhere.
Go where?

Show me a corporate manual these days, that does not restrict the carrying of firearms or weapons on company property or business.
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Old October 11, 2015, 08:46 PM   #30
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Boy thats a fact. Even my CEO has a CC permit ( he gives me his spent brass) but if I carried at work and some busy body dropped a dime on me.
I would be gone by the end of the day. Dope heads get treated better.
They at least get treatment before they are fired.
My place even forbids ammo.

It is what it is. I have to eat and pay for my Guns. soooo.

Now onto the back pack plates.
I have one at work right now.
Chip and a chair maybe gets me to the door.
Having it on my back is fine because thats what the bastage is gona see.
An old white guy running as fast as he can. They have taken away my ability to assist and effect. So I dont plan too.
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Old October 11, 2015, 09:12 PM   #31
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I can tell you first hand that Sears Catalogs, phone books and text books will stop a .30.06 at close range.
If you could keep the books in the right place no metal would be needed.
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Old October 12, 2015, 06:36 AM   #32
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Worth it? There are inserts, clipboards, bags, etc for kids and teachers. I am a faculty member and thought a clipboard or bag insert rated level 3a or 4 would be worth it because we are basically defenseless on campus because we cannot carry...Thoughts on this stuff?
Worth it? From a practical standpoint, not likely. From a piece of mind standpoint, it may make you feel better. I have a IIIA briefcase insert that I use when I travel on business and used to carry it to work when I worked by downtown Dallas. Never had a need. Then again, I never needed my gun either. See the parallelism?

If you have the money and such protection fits what you are doing, then why not not have the extra protection?
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Old October 12, 2015, 09:16 PM   #33
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I can tell you first hand that Sears Catalogs, phone books and text books will stop a .30.06 at close range.
If you could keep the books in the right place no metal would be needed.
6-8" of (3 or 4) old gunshop catalogs will stop most hollowpoint handgun rounds fired from 2-3 ft
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Old October 13, 2015, 02:30 PM   #34
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No you need one of these suits on this recent commerical...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZREGNvCCgM0

Last edited by peggysue; October 13, 2015 at 05:31 PM.
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Old October 13, 2015, 05:28 PM   #35
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Your child is much more likely to die in a fire (0.75 per 100,000), swimming pool (2 per 100,000), from food poisoning (2 per 100,000), or in a car wreck on the way to school (10 per 100,000) than be involved in a school shooting (0.15 per 100,000).

Allocate your resources wisely.
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Old October 14, 2015, 07:23 AM   #36
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You CHOOSE to work there. If it is too dangerous for your liking go elsewhere.

Go where?

Show me a corporate manual these days, that does not restrict the carrying of firearms or weapons on company property or business.
Dumb to advise somebody to break the law without reviewing the possible consequences. I don't know about your state, but in Ohio if you carry anywhere where prohibited it carries the penalty of law and you lose your carry permit, and if you do it in a school it carries some serious federal penalties as well. As much disdain as I have for "gun free zones", violating a school's weapons ban not only gets you fired, but may prevent you from ever working again in your chosen profession if it involves working in a school. We need to chip away at "gun free zones" but until those laws are fixed, you are advising people to take a lot of personal risk to prepare for a very unlikley threat.



For the OP, I think if people actually carried books in their book bags, most pistol rounds would have a hard time passing through.
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Old October 14, 2015, 07:51 AM   #37
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IMO, pretty useless to carry close to 10 lbs extra in your backpack with the off chance that one will be quick enough to use the backpack as cover in the event of an active shooter.

Better off carrying a P32 or P3AT in a pocket holster in your backpocket with the pocket buttoned down. Aren't allowed to carry on campus? Oh well . . .
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Old October 14, 2015, 09:47 AM   #38
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A touch off topic. I find having a can of hornet spray is better than pepper spray. Hornet spray will travel 20+feet with a healthy stream, completely legal and If hit in the face area. guarantied trip to the ER. The person will not shake that off. Also great for car carry
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Old October 14, 2015, 12:44 PM   #39
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A touch off topic. I find having a can of hornet spray is better than pepper spray. Hornet spray will travel 20+feet with a healthy stream, completely legal and If hit in the face area. guarantied trip to the ER. The person will not shake that off. Also great for car carry
That's a myth that's become popular.

It is illegal to use it in any manner not listed on the label, and there's no real evidence it's even a good deterrent

Keeping a can of anything pressurized in a car during the Summer is asking for trouble.

http://www.resistattack.org/Articles...st-An-Attacker
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Old October 14, 2015, 01:02 PM   #40
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The hornet sprays can be neurotoxins and lethal. Thus, using them is forbidden according to some state laws. If you use it at a longer range OC that is a no-go as it is an instrument of lethal force which might not be appropriate for a OC situation.

Better having a standard OC spray.
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Old October 14, 2015, 01:12 PM   #41
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No way to hornet/bear spray. I do already have pepper spray/mace.
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Old October 14, 2015, 07:35 PM   #42
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Dumb to advise somebody to break the law without reviewing the possible consequences.
We all have to decide whether or not our lives are worth anything or not. If your comfortable being told that you arent allowed to have a weapon to protect yourself, and believe that you will be magically protected, by who or what, I dont know, great, but so far, from what Ive seen, those have restricted things, havent been doing a very good job of protecting anyone. I choose to be a little more proactive, and Im also a little more realistic than some, about who has my best interests at heart.

Quote:
and if you do it in a school it carries some serious federal penalties as well.
Perhaps if you do so illegally. Luckily, I dont live in Ohio.

As with most restrictive "laws", there is almost always the "and any other lawful purpose" clause, usually at the end of all the cites.

This is PA's version.....

http://www.acslpa.org/Information_On...act_part_2.HTM

Title 18 – Crimes and Offenses
18 Pa CS 912 - Possession of weapon on school property
(a) Definition. – Notwithstanding the definition of “weapon” in section 907 (relating to possessing
instruments of crime), “weapon” for purposes of this section shall include but not limited to any
knife, cutting instrument, cutting tool, nunchuck stick, firearm, shotgun, rifle and any other tool,
instrument or implement capable of inflicting serious bodily injury.
(b) Offense defined. – A person commits a misdemeanor of the first degree if he possesses a
weapon in the building of, on the grounds of, or in any conveyance providing transportation to
or from any elementary or secondary publicly-funded educational institution, any elementary or
secondary private school licensed by the Department of Education or any elementary or
secondary parochial school.
(c) Defense. – It shall be a defense that the weapon is possessed and used in conjunction with a lawful supervised school activity or course or is possessed for other lawful purpose.


This is the federal version....

http://smartgunlaws.org/federal-law-on-guns-in-schools/

Federal Law on Guns in Schools
Posted on May 21, 2012

See our Guns in Schools policy summary for a comprehensive discussion of this issue.

Recognizing that guns have no place in our nation’s schools, the federal government has taken steps to make our elementary and secondary schools safer from gun violence by adopting: 1) The Gun-Free School Zones Act; and 2) The Gun-Free Schools Act. Establishing gun-free school zones – that prohibit possession of a gun within a school, on school property, or within a set distance of school property – helps to secure schools from gun-related violence and crime.

The Gun-Free School Zones Act

The Gun-Free School Zones Act (GFSZA) prohibits any person from knowingly possessing a firearm that has moved in or otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place the individual knows, or has reasonable cause to believe, is a school zone.1 The GFSZA also prohibits any person from knowingly, or with reckless disregard for the safety of another, discharging or attempting to discharge a firearm that has moved in or otherwise affects interstate or foreign commerce at a place the person knows is a school zone.2 The GFSZA defines “school zone” as: 1) in, or on the grounds of, a public, parochial or private school; or 2) within a distance of 1,000 feet from the grounds of a public, parochial or private school.3

Exceptions to the possession prohibition include:
Firearm possessors licensed by the state or locality to possess the gun, whose law requires that before the person obtains a license, state or local law enforcement verify that the person is qualified to receive the license;4
or
Where the firearm is:
Unloaded and in a locked container or locked firearms rack on a motor vehicle;5 or
Unloaded and possessed while traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.6

http://smartgunlaws.org/federal-law-on-guns-in-schools/

Last edited by AK103K; October 14, 2015 at 07:46 PM.
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Old October 14, 2015, 10:53 PM   #43
A pause for the COZ
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IMO, pretty useless to carry close to 10 lbs extra in your backpack with the off chance that one will be quick enough to use the backpack as cover in the event of an active shooter.
They are not ten pounds. The 8 x10 Lev3A fiberglass sheet I use is less than 1 pound and is 1/2 inch wide.
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Old October 15, 2015, 07:22 AM   #44
Onward Allusion
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The backpacks are 8 lbs and $300+.
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Old October 15, 2015, 09:02 AM   #45
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We all have to decide whether or not our lives are worth anything or not. If your comfortable being told that you arent allowed to have a weapon to protect yourself, and believe that you will be magically protected, by who or what, I dont know, great, but so far, from what Ive seen, those have restricted things, havent been doing a very good job of protecting anyone. I choose to be a little more proactive, and Im also a little more realistic than some, about who has my best interests at heart.
It's got nothing to do with being comfortable about it. I despise gun free zones, but I've considered the risk of getting shot in a school because I'm unarmed vs the risk of going to prison and/or losing my livelihood because I am armed in case someone tries to shoot me in a school. I'm not thrilled about either choice, but I've weighed the odds, and I wish you best in your evaluation of those odds. For me, I wouldn't illegally carry in a school or buy the backpack.

The federal penalties apply to PA as well as Ohio.

Quote:
Whoever violates the Act shall be fined not more than $5,000, imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or both.
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Old October 15, 2015, 10:47 AM   #46
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They are not ten pounds. The 8 x10 Lev3A fiberglass sheet I use is less than 1 pound and is 1/2 inch wide.


Ballistic fiberglass is typically used in construction. It might be used in a courthouse, for example. It isn't intended to be worn but it could work. It's rated differently than body armor intended to be worn. A panel might be rated UL752 level 3 which roughly corresponds to an NIJ level 3a armor. A square foot of ballistic fiberglass with this rating would be 4.8 lbs and 7/16" thick. That is heavier, bulkier and more rigid than a Kevlar 3a panel.

link

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Old October 15, 2015, 05:17 PM   #47
AK103K
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The federal penalties apply to PA as well as Ohio.
I guess you also missed the federal part about those licensed to carry, are exempted. PA has the "any lawful purpose" defense. I had put them both in bold, so you wouldnt miss them.


As much as these types of shootings seem to be occurring these days, "the odds" seem to be in flux. Im sure all those who have been caught up in the various incidents, felt the same, and believed "the law" would protect them, even from those who could care less about them, and who actually thank those who passed them, for making it so easy.
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Old October 16, 2015, 08:20 PM   #48
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IMO, pretty useless to carry close to 10 lbs extra in your backpack with the off chance that one will be quick enough to use the backpack as cover in the event of an active shooter.
As noted, the inserts aren't that heavy. Also it should be pointed out that if you aren't a victim in the first few shots fired, there is a strong possibility that you will have a considerable amount of time to enact defenses. Such shootings do not happen like an explosion, but as a progression, over time, with fits and starts, confusion, reloads, target selection, etc. In places like Columbine, some people had 10s of minutes (nearly 40 minutes). The save for Virginia Tech and several other school shootings.
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Old October 16, 2015, 08:53 PM   #49
FITASC
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Quote:
You CHOOSE to work there. If it is too dangerous for your liking go elsewhere.
Go where?

Show me a corporate manual these days, that does not restrict the carrying of firearms or weapons on company property or business.
Open your own company and dictate the rules.......
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Old October 16, 2015, 09:20 PM   #50
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Open your own company and dictate the rules.......
...and for those of us who cant?

Even if you cant, you still can choose to be your own boss. You just dont have to tell anyone.
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