Hard cast bullets .357

Inhimwelive · October 31, 2010, 03:55 AM

I want a woods load for my .357... I have pretty much settled on 180 grain hard cast bullets.. I feel these are my best choice for any 4 legged problems I might encounter. But what about two legged problems? The hard cast bullets are great for penetration but how effective are they on homosapiens?

dahermit · October 31, 2010, 07:34 AM

The bullets you mention IMO would be good for two-legged problems was well as four. Entrance hole and exit hole will let all the air out and they will deflate on the spot. They may, however fly around a bit like a balloon does when you release the neck.

How aggressive would they remain with a through and through hole?

**Unclenick** · October 31, 2010, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inhimwelive

I feel these are my best choice for any 4 legged problems I might encounter. But what about two legged problems?

Six of one, half dozen of the other.

GP100man · October 31, 2010, 09:15 AM

A good SWC of 150-180grs. accents the 357s power range nicely !

A Lyman 358429 will handle anything ya can do with a 357 , as long as it`ll fit in the cyl (Keith designs have long noses !!)

jmortimer · October 31, 2010, 09:40 AM

Your best bullet will be an LBT design or style and have a maximum meplat. If you are shooting paper it does not matter so much what bullet you choose but for carry in the woods you want the best possible and I would recommend Beartooth Bullets which come in around 22 bhn. The have a 173 grain Keith or better yet a 185 grain FN. The blunt wide meplat will smoke two legged and four legged creatures. Very effective which is why Buffalo Bore, Double Tap and other premium ammunition manufacturers load hard cast flat nose bullets especially the LBT style. You will get penetration measured in feet with the 185 grain FN. http://www.beartoothbullets.com/bulletselect/index.htm

GP100man · October 31, 2010, 09:24 PM

the noses are the same basic dia. it`s that a RNFP bullet is like a nose rider & is more forgiving at the forcin cone than a SWC , helping accuracy .

TXGunNut · October 31, 2010, 09:44 PM

What kind of four-legged critters are found in your neck of the woods? Hard cast boolits are good for punching holes, softer boolits generally transfer energy better and cause more tissue damage. Which boolit does your handgun like?

Inhimwelive · October 31, 2010, 11:21 PM

I live in Pa so the main concern would be people then bears.. Pa Bears get pretty big.. If I have a bear charging me and I am shooting head on I definitely want penetration.. But people in my opinion will always be the bigger danger.. If I am shooting at a person its going to mean they are shooting back.. So I want to feel confident in a one shot stop with proper shot placement..

TXGunNut · October 31, 2010, 11:30 PM

Can only imagine a head-on shot with a big blackie is a bit much to ask of a .357. Sounds like a job better suited for a shotgun loaded with slugs or a quick-handling rifle. Either would be an effective deterrent for two-legged predators.

Inhimwelive · November 1, 2010, 08:00 AM

Yep I'm sure that a rifle or shotgun would get the job done quicker.. However like most people I cant carry a long gun everywhere I go. I can however carry my 357.. So in this case the gun in the hand is worth loads more then the two left back at home... So with that said can we please stay with the topic...

GP100man · November 1, 2010, 10:38 AM

TGN , not really off subject just explorin different options .

If ya don`t cast your own I think these at MB co. would fill the ticket !!
I feel at revolver velocitys a GC really is`nt needed & especially when the 357 will only push these 180s in the 1000-1100 fps range anyways!

http://www.missouribullet.com/detail...ary=&keywords=

Besides the smaller meplat will offer deeper penatration on a big blackies cranial cavity !!

zxcvbob · November 1, 2010, 11:09 AM

I've been experimenting with 148 grain wadcutters in .357 and loaded hot. It's a good round; not sure that I'd want to trust it to stop a charging bear (that pretty much takes a .45-70, but you use what you've got.) It should give you a thru-and-thru hole with lots of tissue damage because the nose is so wide and has sharp edges.

Artover3 · February 20, 2011, 10:10 PM

cxcvbob, how fast do you push your 148gr wc's? I just loaded some test loads 357 wc. After some research found out best to keep them under 1000 fps. Loaded 357 for years, back before computers and now I am having fun looking up info for loading. Just got back into loading and never paid much attention to fps for the wc.

zxcvbob · February 20, 2011, 11:05 PM

I haven't chronographed them, but Quickload sez they are running about 1200 fps from a 4" barrel or almost 1300 from a 6". (by switching from Herco to Power Pistol and upping the pressure a little more, I should be able to get over 1450 fps from a 6" and 1650+ from a carbine)

I honestly haven't done much with them since last fall. I've been using lots of nice slow wadcutters for indoor bullseye shooting lately.

Added: this is not necessarily a smart path that I'm on. Be careful if you decide to follow .

Bernieb90 · February 20, 2011, 11:37 PM

I shot a small pig a few years ago with a 180gr LBT hardcast from a 6" revolver. My shot placement was a bit off on the first shot, and I hit high through the fatty tissue by the spine. The pig ran oof, but I was able to shoot again, and made a good head shot at about 30yds.

As far as terminal performance goes I saw what looked like a slightly larger than .357 hole through the pig. Penetration was very good, and had the shot been placed well I have no doubt it would have put the pig down quickly.

That being said I think there are better choices if both 4, and 2 legged animals are a possibility. Nosler makes an excelent 180gr partition bullet that has been shown to perform very well. Expansion is excelent as it weight retention, and penetration. Barnes also makes a 140gr XPB bullet that is designed to expand, and penetrate well at .357 magnum velocities.

The biggest problem I see with 148gr wadcutters is that they are soft swaged lead, and will likely flatten, and expand limiting penetration on 4 legged animals. Soft lead may also not break heavy bone as well as a hardcast, or partitioned bullet.

Regardless of ammunition choice I would limit animal usage to hunting medium sized game. For defense against dangerous game I feel the .357 is too light, and .44 mag on up provides a better option as far as handguns go.

Big bears are best handled with shotguns loaded with Brenneke slugs, and big bore leverguns that have calibers starting in .4 or better yet .5.

October 31, 2010, 03:55 AM	#1
Inhimwelive Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2007 Location: NE Pennsylvania Posts: 137	Hard cast bullets .357 I want a woods load for my .357... I have pretty much settled on 180 grain hard cast bullets.. I feel these are my best choice for any 4 legged problems I might encounter. But what about two legged problems? The hard cast bullets are great for penetration but how effective are they on homosapiens?

October 31, 2010, 09:15 AM	#4
GP100man Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2007 Location: Tabor City , NC. Posts: 1,969	A good SWC of 150-180grs. accents the 357s power range nicely ! A Lyman 358429 will handle anything ya can do with a 357 , as long as it`ll fit in the cyl (Keith designs have long noses !!) __________________ GP100man Last edited by GP100man; October 31, 2010 at 09:28 AM.

October 31, 2010, 09:24 PM	#6
GP100man Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2007 Location: Tabor City , NC. Posts: 1,969	the noses are the same basic dia. it`s that a RNFP bullet is like a nose rider & is more forgiving at the forcin cone than a SWC , helping accuracy . __________________ GP100man

October 31, 2010, 09:44 PM	#7
TXGunNut Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: If you have to ask... Posts: 2,860	What kind of four-legged critters are found in your neck of the woods? Hard cast boolits are good for punching holes, softer boolits generally transfer energy better and cause more tissue damage. Which boolit does your handgun like? __________________ Life Member NRA, TSRA Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call Lonesome Dove My favorite recipes start out with a handful of used wheelweights.

October 31, 2010, 11:21 PM	#8
Inhimwelive Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2007 Location: NE Pennsylvania Posts: 137	critters I live in Pa so the main concern would be people then bears.. Pa Bears get pretty big.. If I have a bear charging me and I am shooting head on I definitely want penetration.. But people in my opinion will always be the bigger danger.. If I am shooting at a person its going to mean they are shooting back.. So I want to feel confident in a one shot stop with proper shot placement..

October 31, 2010, 07:34 AM	#2
dahermit Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2006 Location: South Central Michigan...near Posts: 6,501	The bullets you mention IMO would be good for two-legged problems was well as four. Entrance hole and exit hole will let all the air out and they will deflate on the spot. They may, however fly around a bit like a balloon does when you release the neck. How aggressive would they remain with a through and through hole?

October 31, 2010, 09:40 AM	#5
jmortimer Junior member Join Date: January 24, 2010 Location: South West Riverside County California Posts: 2,763	Your best bullet will be an LBT design or style and have a maximum meplat. If you are shooting paper it does not matter so much what bullet you choose but for carry in the woods you want the best possible and I would recommend Beartooth Bullets which come in around 22 bhn. The have a 173 grain Keith or better yet a 185 grain FN. The blunt wide meplat will smoke two legged and four legged creatures. Very effective which is why Buffalo Bore, Double Tap and other premium ammunition manufacturers load hard cast flat nose bullets especially the LBT style. You will get penetration measured in feet with the 185 grain FN. http://www.beartoothbullets.com/bulletselect/index.htm

October 31, 2010, 11:30 PM	#9
TXGunNut Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: If you have to ask... Posts: 2,860	Can only imagine a head-on shot with a big blackie is a bit much to ask of a .357. Sounds like a job better suited for a shotgun loaded with slugs or a quick-handling rifle. Either would be an effective deterrent for two-legged predators. __________________ Life Member NRA, TSRA Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call Lonesome Dove My favorite recipes start out with a handful of used wheelweights.

November 1, 2010, 08:00 AM	#10
Inhimwelive Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2007 Location: NE Pennsylvania Posts: 137	Yep I'm sure that a rifle or shotgun would get the job done quicker.. However like most people I cant carry a long gun everywhere I go. I can however carry my 357.. So in this case the gun in the hand is worth loads more then the two left back at home... So with that said can we please stay with the topic...

November 1, 2010, 10:38 AM	#11
GP100man Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2007 Location: Tabor City , NC. Posts: 1,969	TGN , not really off subject just explorin different options . If ya don`t cast your own I think these at MB co. would fill the ticket !! I feel at revolver velocitys a GC really is`nt needed & especially when the 357 will only push these 180s in the 1000-1100 fps range anyways! http://www.missouribullet.com/detail...ary=&keywords= Besides the smaller meplat will offer deeper penatration on a big blackies cranial cavity !! __________________ GP100man

November 1, 2010, 11:09 AM	#12
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	I've been experimenting with 148 grain wadcutters in .357 and loaded hot. It's a good round; not sure that I'd want to trust it to stop a charging bear (that pretty much takes a .45-70, but you use what you've got.) It should give you a thru-and-thru hole with lots of tissue damage because the nose is so wide and has sharp edges. __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

February 20, 2011, 10:10 PM	#13
Artover3 Junior Member Join Date: October 21, 2010 Location: california Posts: 11	cxcvbob, how fast do you push your 148gr wc's? I just loaded some test loads 357 wc. After some research found out best to keep them under 1000 fps. Loaded 357 for years, back before computers and now I am having fun looking up info for loading. Just got back into loading and never paid much attention to fps for the wc.

February 20, 2011, 11:05 PM	#14
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	I haven't chronographed them, but Quickload sez they are running about 1200 fps from a 4" barrel or almost 1300 from a 6". (by switching from Herco to Power Pistol and upping the pressure a little more, I should be able to get over 1450 fps from a 6" and 1650+ from a carbine) I honestly haven't done much with them since last fall. I've been using lots of nice slow wadcutters for indoor bullseye shooting lately. Added: this is not necessarily a smart path that I'm on. Be careful if you decide to follow . Last edited by zxcvbob; February 20, 2011 at 11:21 PM.

February 20, 2011, 11:37 PM	#15
Bernieb90 Member Join Date: December 25, 2010 Posts: 34	I shot a small pig a few years ago with a 180gr LBT hardcast from a 6" revolver. My shot placement was a bit off on the first shot, and I hit high through the fatty tissue by the spine. The pig ran oof, but I was able to shoot again, and made a good head shot at about 30yds. As far as terminal performance goes I saw what looked like a slightly larger than .357 hole through the pig. Penetration was very good, and had the shot been placed well I have no doubt it would have put the pig down quickly. That being said I think there are better choices if both 4, and 2 legged animals are a possibility. Nosler makes an excelent 180gr partition bullet that has been shown to perform very well. Expansion is excelent as it weight retention, and penetration. Barnes also makes a 140gr XPB bullet that is designed to expand, and penetrate well at .357 magnum velocities. The biggest problem I see with 148gr wadcutters is that they are soft swaged lead, and will likely flatten, and expand limiting penetration on 4 legged animals. Soft lead may also not break heavy bone as well as a hardcast, or partitioned bullet. Regardless of ammunition choice I would limit animal usage to hunting medium sized game. For defense against dangerous game I feel the .357 is too light, and .44 mag on up provides a better option as far as handguns go. Big bears are best handled with shotguns loaded with Brenneke slugs, and big bore leverguns that have calibers starting in .4 or better yet .5.

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