How Much Consideration do you give average people in your training?

[K_Mac]

This is always a fascinating discussion. At first glance it looks like there are two camps; one says getting out of harm's way if possible is the only reasonable choice; the other says allowing innocents to be killed and doing nothing to stop it is unacceptable. This is too simple though. The decision to try to save others in an active shooter situation, or who to feed in a limited food scenario depends on many factors, some of which can't be known before hand. We can wrestle with the moral and ethical issues and train to the best of our ability, but only when we are in the fight, based on the information we have in the moment, can we make those decisions.

I am a father and grandfather. I understand my responsibility to my family. I have been given the opportunity to learn to protect myself and others. I have the means to so. I take that very seriously. Whether I join the fight or slip out the back is a question I hope never to face.

[Moonglum]

I am by no means an expert on this topic but I have had some active shooter training as a result of my employment.

I work as an armed security contractor for the city government and even though active shooter response is part of my duties my primary mission in such an event is not to find and engage the shooter it's to hit the emergency alarm on my radio and get as many of the client employees out of the building as I can and if at all possible lock down what ever part of the building the shooter is in. The only time I am expected to engage the shooter is in direct defense of myself or the client employees.

This topic comes up frequently on gun forums. I've actually read responses that state that permit holders have a civic duty to respond and "protect the flock" if needed and some actually that permit holders have a duty to carry enough life insurance to support their family if they're killed while performing their "civic duty".

Obviously I disagree. I am not equipped to go hunting an active shooter through a Walmart, I'm not trained for it, I don't have qualified immunity if I shoot the wrong person. I don't have legal aid through my job (unless I'm at work) I don't have worker's comp or a police pension to support my family if I'm killed.

The odds that I'm going to be in a Walmart or a restaurant without my wife are almost nil. The odds of my being in a movie theater or mall are nil. If I'm with my wife my first duty is to get her for safety and I'm not going to leave my family to go rescue yours.

[JohnKSa]

When would I intervene in an active shooter situation?

If I or my family were being specifically targeted and evacuation/evasion was not a reasonable option.

OR

If all of the following were true:


If I were certain of the circumstances of the situation. (Knew for sure who the bad guy(s) was/were due to obvious circumstances--e.g. he's shooting kids randomly--or because I watched the situation develop from the beginning).

AND

If there were no one present to whom I had a primary duty to evacuate/get to safety. Wife/family/etc.

AND

If I believed that the circumstances were such that my intervention was reasonably likely to make a positive difference in the outcome. (i.e. I'm not going to start popping off shots with my subcompact carry gun at multiple bad guys armed with rifles who are at a significant distance and surrounded by innocents.)

[Skans]

So today I was asked what would I do regarding other people if a shooter starter randomly shooting people in the front of the grocery store while I was in the back.

Given the distance between me and the shooter, my answer is clear - I would leave through one of the store's rear exits. I am not a cop. I am not trained in how to close in on an active shooter who would be about 200 feet away from me. I have no backup. There is no way to distinguish me from a bad guy. Further, I am not responsible for the lives of people who choose not to protect themselves.

Heartless answer - perhaps. But, it's the correct one.