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Old December 6, 2017, 09:53 AM   #1
dvdcrr
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Thoughts on 260 Remington?

Helllo,
I was wondering about your thoughts on 260 Remington as a plains hunting cartridge.
Logically, on a short action platform, if you want to move up from 24 cal to shoot 120-130 gr. bullets, the next available 308 spawn is 260 Remington. Basically looking at the numbers 2800-2900 fps.with 130 gr. bullets. I would really like a 22" barrel, however it appears that 24" might be necessary to get to the 2900 fps mark. However with 120 gr. more speed is available. I like 130's, but if 120 gr. has acceptable BC and SD (to me acceptable would be equal to or better than 243 100 gr. SP.) then I would be OK with 120 gr.
Do you think this cartridge has the speed and flatness to be really good on plains game including 200lb deer, antelope to 375 yds? Or too slow/ not stellar performer?
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Old December 6, 2017, 11:33 AM   #2
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260 would be fine. The 6.5 Creedmoor is making the 260 obsolete. If you reload, it matters not. If you ever want to buy ammo off the shelf, 260 is going to be harder and harder to find.
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Old December 6, 2017, 11:38 AM   #3
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6.5 creedmore is the flavor of the decade. At the moment it seems like it will have more staying power than 260 remington, mostly because of the limitations of using 260 rem in a semi auto action.
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Old December 6, 2017, 12:22 PM   #4
dvdcrr
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Yes I do reload, so factory loadings are not an issue.
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Old December 6, 2017, 04:49 PM   #5
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Hunters are taking elk at 700+ yards with the 6.5 Creedmoor, no reason the 260 won't kill deer at 400. The 120's or 130's will have similar performance to 130's in a 270. It'll do anything a 270 will do and be a big step up over 243. That said, a 243 with 100+ gr bullets is just fine and is elk capable as well.

Unless you already own a 260 there is simply no reason to choose one over the 6.5 Creedmoor though.

Quote:
At the moment it seems like it will have more staying power than 260 remington, mostly because of the limitations of using 260 rem in a semi auto action.
That is partly right, but not just semi-auto's. The issue is that the 260 case is actually slightly longer than the 6.5 Creedmoor case. When shooting longer high BC bullets they must be seated deeper inside the 260 case in order to fit magazines and chambers. On paper the 260 should be faster since it has slightly more powder capacity. But when you seat bullets deeper it limits powder capacity. Or if you use shorter, lower BC bullets you get less performance. In the real world the 6.5 ends up shooting the best bullets faster in factory rifles.

Long range target shooters were getting around this by seating high BC bullets farther out in 260 cases and building custom 260 rifles with longer magazines and chambers to work with the non standard loads. The 6.5 Creedmoor solved both problems by offering both factory ammo and rifles made to work with the best bullets Hunters discovered that the round when loaded with 140 gr and heavier bullets was far more effective than 260 with 120-130 gr bullets and it has really taken off.

The 260 has never been popular outside of long range shooting crowd. And it will soon be obsolete. You can hand load 260 to do anything a 6.5 Creedmoor will do. But can't take advantage of the loads in factory rifles.
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Old December 6, 2017, 05:11 PM   #6
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Quote:
Long range target shooters were getting around this by seating high BC bullets farther out in 260 cases and building custom 260 rifles with longer magazines and chambers to work with the non standard loads.
Yea. My old hunting buddy had a long-range .260 built on a Mauser action. He loaded up some long VLDs for it. I couldn't even top-load them into my Remington Model 7 - much less think about fitting them into the magazine.
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Old December 6, 2017, 05:59 PM   #7
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I appreciate the 6.5 Creedmoor information, I as well have heard good things.
MY intention, i.e. what I intend to do is build a 260 Remington right, or wrong, rest of the world not withstanding. Then I would like to take said 260 Remington, point it at a Whitetail or Muledeer buck possessing a desireable set of horns and a satisfying amount of delectable venison. Such deer will likely be 180-375 yds distant, necessitating the question.
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Old December 6, 2017, 06:19 PM   #8
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I bought a new rem sps 700 in .260 with a 24" barrel for less than 500.00 and its a fine shooter and will do what you want at the ranges you posted. eastbank.
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Old December 6, 2017, 06:32 PM   #9
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260 Rem or 6.5 CM, both are great cartridges. I'm changing my .308 Savage bolt to 6.5 CM. After building a 6.5 CM AR10, I decided I like the caliber better due to less recoil and I shoot it better.
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Old December 6, 2017, 07:32 PM   #10
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I have a Tikka stainless in 260 and have hunted with it for maybe 5 years now. Super accurate rifle, and I normally use 120 gr Nosler Ballistic Tips in it. I call it a “270 Lite”, since the 120 gr MV is 2800 (20 inch barrel), versus a 130 gr bullet in the 270 at 3000 fps. My Sako 270 stays in the safe these days.

As for the round becoming obsolete, I doubt it. I see articles saying the 280 and the 220 are obsolete. I was out last evening with my 220. And why would anyone need a 257 Roberts or a 250 Savage. And, a lot of the guys that were saying the 6.5 Creedmore was perfect for long range target shooting have switched to the 7-08 or 6 mm Creedmore or the 6.5-284. Maybe the 6.5 CM is becoming obsolete. There will always be 308 brass to neck down, but will there always be 6.5-250 Savage Ackley Improved (6.5 CM)brass? OR, if you insist that the 6.5 CM is a necked down 30 TC, the same question applies.
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Old December 6, 2017, 09:14 PM   #11
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While it may not be optimum for certain users, the 6.5x55 has a lot to offer. it is built in long actions with fast twist barrels and should handle any reasonable bullet. The guns will be a bit heavier, but companies like Kimber offer light actions for long cartridges. I see more 6.5x55 ammo than 260 on the shelves. Kinda odd but that is my limited observation.

Nothing compares to the sky rocketing popularity of the 6.5 creed. Pretty amazing really.

For hunting (not playing sniper) if you like one than any other should do fine.
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Old December 6, 2017, 10:41 PM   #12
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Quote:
Maybe the 6.5 CM is becoming obsolete.
The 6.5 Creedmore was 10 years getting where it is now, so I would say it is just getting started.
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Old December 7, 2017, 07:10 AM   #13
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Is the 260 about 10 yrs old also? Give or take. I liked the 260 better, but; I was wrong. I also liked the 458 socom over the 450BM, wrong again. Moving forward buyers can go with the flow, ammo and gun availability or hand load and custom build.

The 6.5 CM round is doing amazing. The 6.5 bore size is hot too. I think the future not so bright for the .277 rounds. The .277 was a bore that we never needed. It will never go away, but; the honeymoon is over. An american abomination no longer needed. Me thinks, but as you know... I have been wrong before!

I was really surprised to join this forum and read about the so-called 6.8! Nice try - metric pretend. I am thinking this garbage just wont go away. Ie the 277 bore diameter. Now, the 6.5 creed, I hope the final nail. We have the gindell and a few oldies & moldies. The 270 win will never go away, to many old guns and eventually it will be a nostalgia round with our grand children long after we are gone.

The op's question was will the 6.5 do this or that. Obviously yes, if it was previously done with a 270win it can be done today with one of the comparable 6.5mm. Take your pick.
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Old December 7, 2017, 10:09 AM   #14
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There are new bullets/powders available for the .270 Win now that let it shine as a great hunting cartridge. The new Winchester Deer Season XP 130 grain seems to work especially well and I just tried it in my 24" barreled Rem 700.

I chrono-ed it yesterday at 3,100 fps and the bullet shape makes it hold trajectory quite well. Can't wait to shoot something with it.

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Old December 7, 2017, 11:39 AM   #15
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I've got a 6.5x55 and a 6.5x06, no need of a 260 or a 6.5 CM. If I was looking for a new 6.5, I think I would go with the 260. Simple reason. I reload and there's a bunch of different case's they can be made from with one stroke of the press handle. The Creedmoor is supposed to be able to make fro the 308 case but that's not what it was developed from. May not matter but I just don't know. I'll stick with what I know!
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Old December 7, 2017, 01:57 PM   #16
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I mentioned that I had a 260 and was real happy with it. The only thing more i’d Want from the caliber would be 3000 fps MV. That would really put it in 270 territory. Of course I could always just take the 270 out of the safe, but I rarely do. The 260 just plain does all I need it to do.

If I got another 6.5 caliber, I think I’d get a 6.5-284 Norma.
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Old December 7, 2017, 02:26 PM   #17
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My first, and favorite Precision rig is a .260 Rem. Started as a 24" bull barrel and is currently 22" (Set-back a few times). I have shot Mule Deer and Pronghorn out to 1K with it. While it is better cartridge than the 6.5CM for bolt guns, the marketing hype makes the CM more popular. I have been using 120 and 130 grain bullets for hunting and 140, 142 and 150 grain bullets for targets.

400 yards is a cake walk for the .260Rem.
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Old December 7, 2017, 04:47 PM   #18
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The op mentioned "moving from 24 caliber" to shoot 120-130 gr. (264.) bullets; you might want to consider sticking with 24 cal.

Berger makes hunting bullets of 105 and 115 gr. that can be launched faster than a 260 or 6.5 Creedmoor can push the 130 gr. 6.5 bullets. That might be a bit better on the plains.

To stabilize them, of course, you would need a rifle with a quicker twist than your average 243 Win. That most likely will bring you to the new darling of shooters, the 6mm Creedmoor. All the same old arguments of 260 v. 6.5 CM will apply to 243 v. 6 CM but the bottom line is, a factory issue 243 with a common 1 in 10 twist won't stabilize those long heavy bullets with their very high BCs and SDs.
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Old December 7, 2017, 04:59 PM   #19
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260, etc.

I'll throw in my personal favorite...the 7x30 Waters. Fires 120, 130, and 140gr bullets and has minimal recoil with great accuracy.
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Old December 7, 2017, 06:10 PM   #20
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While the .260 Rem may not be the end all be all of target rounds it will most certainly handle deer sized critters at the ranges you describe with out any problems. Find a load and hunting type bullet it limes and go forth, be sure your camera is ready and knife sharpened.
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Old December 7, 2017, 06:24 PM   #21
Sure Shot Mc Gee
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Short action cartridges only appeal to short action likers. I prefer long actions cartridges due to their ability to hold more powder. I shoot a 1/4 bore 06 and like it allot.
Although, the 260 is a Remington design. 6.5 Creedmoor being Hornady's. I've never seen Hornady slam dunk a popular cartridge of their design into obsolescent's over night like Remington seems to have done. >Allot.<
My advice: Buy the creedmoor.
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Old December 7, 2017, 06:46 PM   #22
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I don't think there is much of any ballistic difference between a 6.5 Creedmore, 260 Rem, or for that matter, my 6.5 Swede. Loaded to similiar pressures whatever differences are hair splitting. That being said, these sub 30 caliber cartridges need barrel. Lots of long barrel, short barrels really reduce the velocity. I would not go less than 24 inches, and would recommend more if you can get it. Look at the velocities I have gotten with a service rifle and a 22 inch M70. I cannot get the published velocities you see in magazines and reloading manuals with the 22 inch barrel. However, it is easy to get respectable velocity with a 29 inch barrel, even at 46,000 psia.

Quote:

M1896 Infantry Rifle 29' barrel Carl Gustafs mfgr 1903




17-Aug-06 T = 85 °F
143 gr FMJ 1986 Swedish Ball

Ave Vel = 2610
Std Dev = 14.38
ES = 45.59
High = 2633
Low = 2587
N = 8





M70 Featherweight 22" Barrel




143.5 gr FMJBT Swedish 1986 ball. OAL 3.065" 47.4 grs powder average
13 Oct 2017 T=72 °F

Ave Vel = 2460
Std Dev = 21
ES = 30
High = 2474
Low = 2444
N = 5

Very good group


140 gr Hornady Spire Point 43.0 grs AA4350 R-P new brass CCI-200 OAL 2.990"
18 Nov 2007 T = 75 °F

Ave Vel =2428
Std Dev =29
ES =95
High =2480
Low =2385
N =24

easy bolt life,nice rounded primers


140 gr Hornady Spire Point (0.264") 46.5 grs WC852 wtd NNY cases Fed 210S OAL 3.050"
loaded 1999

13 Oct 2017 T=72 °F

Ave Vel = 2464
Std Dev = 18
ES = 50
High = 2492
Low = 2442
N = 5

Terrible group, blown with wild flyers


140 gr Hornady SP greased 45.0 grs IMR 4831 wtd lot 2-22-2014 new R-P cases CCI 200 OAL 3.065"


2 Nov 2017 T=72 °F

Ave Vel = 2419
Std Dev = 19
ES = 43
High = 2439
Low = 2396
N = 5


140 gr Sierra Matchking greased 45.0 grs IMR 4831 wtd lot 2-22-2014 new R-P cases CCI 200 OAL 3.065"

2 Nov 2017 T=72 °F

Ave Vel = 2438
Std Dev = 12
ES = 30
High = 2448
Low = 2418
N = 5

140 gr Hornady SP (0.264") greased 47.0 grs IMR 4831 wtd lot 282 NNY cases Fed 210S OAL 3.050"
13 Oct 2017 T=72 °F

Ave Vel = 2633
Std Dev = 24
ES = 81
High = 2680
Low = 2599
N = 10


140 gr Hornady SP (0.264") greased 48.0 grs IMR 4831 wtd lot 282 NNY cases Fed 210S OAL 3.050"

13 Oct 2017 T=72 °F

Ave Vel = 2688
Std Dev = 16
ES = 44
High = 2705
Low = 2661
N = 10


Overmax load, primer cupping around firing pin, shiny rub marks on case heads

140 gr Hornady SP greased 45.0 grs H4831 wtd lot 01-06-2014 new R-P cases CCI 200 OAL 3.065"


2 Nov 2017 T=72 °F

Ave Vel = 2289
Std Dev = 9
ES = 16
High = 2296
Low = 2280
N = 5
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Old December 7, 2017, 06:49 PM   #23
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Agree Slamfire
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Old December 7, 2017, 07:58 PM   #24
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6.5x284 is the way to go.
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Old December 7, 2017, 07:59 PM   #25
dvdcrr
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This may finally be the caliber that forces me to buy a chrono.
But other than that, 260 is a pretty straightforward, well designed cartridge?
No known loading sensitivities, dangers?
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