Range Brass - Brands to avoid?

[mjrodney]

I am new to reloading and I have been picking up and using discarded range brass in .45ACP and .38 Special.

One fella I met said that he only picks up and reloads Winchester brass. All other brands remain where they fall. Huh?

Is there a reason I should avoid certain brands (other than non-reloadable Blazer)?

[donkee]

Avoid anything that has AMERC on it. Total trash. Other than that, I use just about anything.

[Hairtrigger]

I avoid all rifle brass.
I keep all of my brass to reload EXCEPT when it has been fired "X" times depending on the caliper. If a rookie would pick up my rifle brass for reloading and think it is once fired he could get a surprise in a few loadings.

[.499 BigBore]

being as i only reload 5.56, i pick up only GI brass once fired, i reload them no more than 5 times and dump them in the scrap brass bin, then sell it all when i get enough to take to the scrap dealer, spent brass is about 50 cents a pound !!

[caz223]

Although I haven't been to florida recently, it sounds like you met me.....
I only pick up win and starline (And most people who have starline pick it back up!!), and the other brands stay where they belong... in the dirt.

For the sake of accuracy I have standardized on one brand of brass for each caliber, and it seems that winchester pistol brass is the most consistant range brass I've found.
Why pick it up if I'm not going to use it? Only so I can sort it out, and have it take up space in my reloading area?
I'll let others pick up the other stuff...
I'm tired of breaking my decapping pin from off center flash holes, and clearing machine jams when the S&B sits funny because of the non-standard rim, and the poor feel when seating primers because of the different size primer pockets on different brands.
I just load WIN and starline now, my 550s downtime is way reduced, my accuracy is better, and I have less headaches.
YMMV, of course.

[mjrodney]

Thanks for all the responses.

It would appear to make sense to separate any found range brass by manufacturer; and to keep a record of how each brand performs over time.

I have to admit that, thanks to our local Wal-Marts, the Winchester white box brand seems to be most of what I am finding.

[gb_in_ga]

I avoid AMERC.

I've also found that military and Speer brass in .38 Spl seem to have cases that are tapered inside, and do not work with deeply seated wadcutter bullets, but they work fine for other "traditional" bullets that aren't seated as deep.

[Russ5924]

I shoot about all except A-MERC and WWC the WCC just seems to not go threw my press well seems to get stuck. It is all dated and it seems like some years are bad while other years seem OK???? But I do keep all my brands separated,gave up trying to keep them separated on how many time shot

[Benzene]

Based on what I've read on this forum (an awesome forum, I must say), I have been avoiding that A-MERC brand. But I'd be grateful to know what specifically is so objectionable about it.

[joneb]

When I was a kid my brother told me the pruple jelly beans were his least favorite, so I unwittingly paid more attention to the non-purple jelly beans, some how the purple ones managed to disappear

[Smokey Joe]

Benzene--That question has been asked before, a lot of times. Once by yrs truly.

Apparently A-merc brass is very carelessly spec'ed; wall thickness varies, location of flash hole varies, everything varies too much to be dependable.

One poster in response to my question said that he didn't believe that anything could be that bad so he loaded up some A-merc brass to try it. He reported that in his actual experience it was just as bad as everyone says it is.

So you don't have to re-invent the wheel; just avoid reloading A-merc brass.

Mr. J. Rodney--I think most pistol shooters use almost any brass EXCEPT A-MERC. At my level of skill, separating brass by manufacturer doesn't make any difference in accuracy. As a rifle reloader, when I began to reload for target pistol, I kept each lot of brass separate, kept records on how many times each lot had been reloaded, etc, etc.

Shooting pistol is SO dependent on operator skill, practice, and technique, as opposed to shooting rifle, that the differences introduced by using an assortment of brass to reload for the pistol are insignificant.

As to how many times to reload each case, target pistol shooters will reload each case until the case mouth splits, then recycle it.

Pistol shooters run through thousands of cases, wheras rifle shooters use a few dozen cases for each rifle. It just isn't practical for Joe Average Pistolshooter to keep the same level of records on each case.

Now as to quality of different makers, Starline is as good as it gets for pistol brass. (Like Lapua and Norma for rifle brass.) Winchester is in the second level. Pretty much everything else is lumped in the 3rd level, except poor old A-merc all alone on the bottom.

Edited to add: I can not understand how a company that makes as poor a product as A-merc makes ammunition, is able to stay in business!

As a general rule, I come home from the range with more brass than I went with. The brass gets sorted, a lot of it gets recycled, and the gems get added to my usable brass collection. Last time I took 4-5 ice cream buckets of brass to my scrap buyer along with the Al cans, I got $32 for the brass IIRC. As free money, I'll take it, thank you!

[G56]

Over the years I've picked up thousands of abandoned cases, Amerc gets thrown away immediately, it's pure junk!

Last time I was out at the range there was a couple of guys shooting 1911's, we talked a bit, later they came over and asked me about a case that wouldn't chamber in either one of their pistols, it was Amerc, turned out that when shooting up that box of Amerc 45 acp they found about 3 rounds that wouldn't even chamber in their pistols, I filled them in on Amerc, I don't think they will make that mistake again!

[270Win]

As everyone else said, AMERC is trash.

I reload for rifles only currently... and sometimes I'll get really lucky and get some Lake City or Norma brass. Never seen Lapua - whoever is shooting that, keeps it. Almost always, though, I end up with Remington, Winchester. Just what people are shooting in .223, .270 or .30-06 around here, I guess.

Once I found a TON of PMC .270 cases, but only about half proved reloadable. Now I'm careful when I see PMC, but recently it's all been fine.

[gmeister]

I reload .45 ACP and 38 Spc moslty.

I don't have problems with any brands of .45 ACP (except Amerc).

38 Spc brass seems a little more sensitive to brand variations. I asked for advice and somebody (Moxie) on the S&W Forum sent me a list of "bad actor" headstamps about 3 years ago.

Here's his list:

- Any WCC xx, xx being a year such as 89 or 91, etc.
- Winchester 38 Spl +P+
- Impact 3D 38 Spl +P
- WCC +P+ 87, 89, 90 or 93
- CPM 90 38 Spl +P
- W-Super-W 38 Spl +P
- PMC 38 Spl +P
- Speer 38 Spl +P
- CCI 38 Spl +P

[dogfood]

OK, I have seen AMERC called bad, trash, junk, total trash and pure junk. All I can say is this:

These shooters have been way too kind.

I will typically reload any .45 ACP brass, but this AMERC stuff is hideous. In an effort to save my fellow reloaders, I pick it up when I see it, just to make sure it gets to the bottom of a garbage can ASAP.

The only minor issue I've had with .45 ACP brass is with Remington when using a jacketed bullet (0.451). I don't seem to get enough neck tension, but it may be particular to my die set-up. Seems to work great with cast bullets (0.452).

dogfood

[GRIZZ5675]

DONT JUST USE ANY BRASS YOU FIND AT THE RANGE .You should only use brass thats been fired once ,at least in my book. If your using anything you find at the range you could find yourself in trouble if the casing has been over streched from use it could blow your casing apart in the chamber in fact i know where there's a brittish 303 that will never be fired again because of that very problem.

[caz223]

With 9mm and .45 it's pretty safe.
Most 9mm you find on the ground IS once fired.
Most .45 is strong enough to load until you lose it.

[Smokey Joe]

Grizz--.303 Lee-Enfields are notorious for stretching brass, due to their single bolt lug, 'way at the back of the bolt. Most people who reload for them are aware of the problem and only neck-size the cases (or shoulder-bump if necessary). And .303 brass is rare enough that any reloader who shoots it will take it home with him--you'll never see it at the range.

Other than that, there's this technique called "case inspection," that you use to see if the brass has been unduly distorted before you picked it up. You know, things like looking for split necks, odd-shaped bulges, flattened primers, shiny spots on the bases, stretch rings just above the base, loose primer pockets, etc.

Honest, Grizz, I think you're being excessively cautions, and this from one who usually advises caution, moderation, go slow, walk before you run, read up on it before trying, etc, etc.

Caz is correct--Most target pistol shooters re-use whatever brass they can lay their hands on until it splits. Some brag that they wear the headstamps off the cases, running them through their progressive reloaders. Serious target pistol shooters run through multiple thousands of rounds per year. If they all had to go on yr reccommendation to use only once-fired brass, all but the sponsored shooters would be broke!

Rifle brass needs more care, but here, too, there is much saving of $$ to be had by re-using brass, and the more you shoot the more saving. I don't know of ANY shooters who reload, who re-use rifle brass just once and then toss it.

Now, having said all that, I'll add that if using each case a total of 2 times then tossing it, is what makes you happy, and you can afford it, go for it, man! It's a hobby, not a religion. There is no dogma. But I don't think it's good advice to hand out generally.

[dogfood]

SJ:

Correct on those .303 Enfields ... but there is another problem as well. It seems the Brits were really generous on chamber dimensions. Since the round headspaces on the rim, giving extra room in the body and shoulder area seems to have been a common practice.

Surely brass life was of zero concern (provided it lasted for the first firing) in battle. And I guess they figured that in the trenches, various dirt, debris, dead rats, etc. might end up in an empty chamber. And you wouldn't want any of that to prevent chambering a round.

So this makes the brass stretch even more, which further explains why us
.303 guys have gone to neck sizing or shoulder bumping only, as you stated.

dogfood

[garryc]

All brass goes home with me.....all of it!! Brass casings as scrap are selling at $.56 a pound right now

On the 303, I won,t use winchester. It's harder and fails sooner

[dodgestdshift]

I avoid the Wolf steel stuff. When depriming it once, I broke two decapping pins on two separate cases, which got stuck in a small flash hole and pulled out of the decapping stem tieing up the press. Just to be sure, these cases were Boxer primed not Berdan primed.

[Smokey Joe]

Dodgestdshift--If you want to talk "other than BRASS," then the answer is easy: Don't try reloading any of it. Scrap it.

Blazer Al cases weren't made to reload, and IIRC, they are Berdan primed, which adds to the problem.

Steel cases, if Boxer primed, can be reloaded--it has been tried successfully and reported on--but the question is, WHY would you bother--It's that much harder on yr dies and equipment, requires that much more force from you on the press handle, and good BRASS cases aren't THAT expensive.

Any Berdan-primed case, be it steel or brass, will be a hassle to reload, requiring extra equipment and a supply of the Berdan primers (Berdans are a different size than Boxers, and are built differently--definitely NOT interchangeable!)

The ones I find most annoying are the "copper-washed steel" 7.62x39 cases, which look a bit like brass and can be picked up by mistake. They are simply steel cases in disguise.

The best thing to do with any of these, of course, if you collect a quantity of them and keep the different metals separate, is to take them to a recycler or scrap-metal dealer and sell them for cash money. With the cash money you can buy nice clean new brass to load!

[Dilbert]

I agree with the recyclers here. When I go, I pick up everything, brass, steel, aluminum, whatever. It's like stopping to pick up a nickel in the street except there are a lot more of them.

[Lycanthrope]

With AMERC brass I've found primer holes drilled at an offset so that decapping pins were trashed. In addition, the cases are weak at the base and even though you have resized you can bulge the case at the base when bullet seating......causing the dreaded AMERC death jam when your pistol locks up just short of full battery.

[gmeister]

I pick up all the brass I find and recycle the calibers and headstamps I don't use (Sold the recycler about 200 lbs. last time at $.63/lb.)

I have about 10K pieces of .45 ACP brass, all cleaned and deprimed, that I've found at local ranges. I usually come home with more useable brass than I shot. I never buy any brass for target loads. Light load .45 ACP brass usually lasts for 10 or more uses.

I also have about 200 rounds of Wolf steel case .45 ACP reloads for use at the occasional ranges that make it difficult to recover brass. I only reuse the Wolf cases once but I have a friend who has reused them 5 or more times. My dies are tungsten carbide and a few steel cases don't hurt them at all. The additional force required with lubed steel cases is insignificant.