What about using hardcast LBT .475 or .500 pistol bullet in rifled SG with Sabot?

Glamdring · December 3, 2002, 06:32 AM

Just wondering if this would work? Has anyone tried it yet? If so what were your results? Think this would work, bullet wts would be about the same as regular slugs. And IIRC sabot loads are usually using a .50" slug.

labgrade · December 3, 2002, 08:22 PM

Winchester & Remington both make a sub-caliber saboted slug.

Impressive accuracy reports from the flower shirts ....

I did try one of Win's super duper sabot round from a smooth bore & it tubled as expected.

An ounce .45 cal at 1900 pfs? ... had to try it out.

Dave McC · December 4, 2002, 05:21 AM

Sure, it'll work. I'm sure it'd work as well as the stuff available off the shelf. Just what do you want to do that the present ammo will not do?

labgrade · December 4, 2002, 10:16 AM

Well, in my case, seeing the 1900fps & trajectory figures, I just had to see if I could get some extra range out of the smooth bore.

Dropped the $5+ per 5 shells & grabbed an screw-in rifled choke - prolly another $40. Forgot to mention that these were fired through that rifled choke.

Didn't matter. They were tumbling by 25 yds.

Gun rag article I saw on the Wins said something about 3" groups at 100+ yds, flat trajectory, yada - what's not to like? But this out of a fully rifled barrel. Like I said, had to try it with that screw-in.

Tried to turn my smooth bore into something it isn't - a rifle.

Read a bunch more here in gool ol' TFL - actually researched the archives (do I get a prize?

) & tried some Brennekes.

Haven't looked back.

(BTW, anybody want to buy a screw-in rifled choke tube?

)

Glamdring · December 14, 2002, 10:19 PM

AFAIK only Sauvestre/BFS slugs would come close to the performance of a 430+ grain hard cast LBT .475 bullet fired from rifled SG.

The remington copper sabot might give similar performance (I think it would be between other factory slugs and the BFS), but I am looking for something that will allow performance similar to 45-70 with hardcast flat tipped bullets for large game like Elk, Moose, and also for trusting when going after semi dangerous game like big pigs and bears.

The other thing is all factory sabot loads are very expensive compared to Foster or Brenneke slugs that I use in my smoothbore. So I am looking for a fairly economical "solid" for a rifled SG. I think the Barnes X HP is best (expensive) "soft" for rifled SG's.

labgrade · December 15, 2002, 01:56 AM

Sorry for my implied flipant responses earlier. Just that I've spent a # of $s looking at this "thing." Really wish I hadn't as it's cost me plenty in shooting up various slugs 'n stuff.

Chock up my responses as a "bad hair day."

I've tried BRI-types in smooth barrels & they do seem to be pretty darned accurate & who could argue with a .50 caliber, 1 oz slug at fairly hefty velocities? = not me, & if they pattern in yours = go in peace & shoot well. I've had excellent results w/'em, but can't find them any more. (sigh)

The sub-caliber rounds are purported to be the cat's a$$ regards trajectory, etc. from a rifled barrel, but then again, you're shooting a "rifle," no? I've had zip good results with 'em in smoothies and rifled chokes.

And, giving up everything a shotgun is supposed to be = an all-purposes/do everything kinda-gun ..... with any of the "extra" chokes installed.

Brennekes seem to pattern better than anything else I've tried - short-barreled/open chokes to 21"+/modifieds .... YMMV

Dedicated rifled barrel for sabots? I betcha you could approximate a .45-70 load, but you'd also lose eveything "shotgun-wise" regards versatitlity.

If I was gonna do that, I'd just use a rifle.

If I still wanted a shotgun, I'd go with a known & dedicated slug-round I'd proven out beforehand.

(yup. waxing philosophical ..... )

Glamdring · December 15, 2002, 05:18 PM

Where I live you have to use shotguns, or handgun, for deer hunting. Rifles are not allowed. It is slug only, buckshot is not legal.

Rifles are not a legal option here. Or I would use a rifle. Regular slugs work fine for deer. With my long guns I try to have a selection of bullets that have basically same trajectory, so I can use same zero's, but of different construction to allow use on different game or targets.

My thinking is that with the big bore pistol bullets and handloads I can make the bullet trajectory of the "solid" match, more or less, the trajectory of the "soft" I use most of the time. The main use I am looking at is for hogs and black bear hunts. Also want something more economical than the factory sabots.

December 3, 2002, 06:32 AM	#1
Glamdring Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2000 Location: MN Posts: 1,388	What about using hardcast LBT .475 or .500 pistol bullet in rifled SG with Sabot? Just wondering if this would work? Has anyone tried it yet? If so what were your results? Think this would work, bullet wts would be about the same as regular slugs. And IIRC sabot loads are usually using a .50" slug. __________________ "A traveler has no protection besides his fire-arms; and the constant habit of carrying them is the main check to more frequent robberies" --Charles Darwin from The Voyage Of The Beagle

December 14, 2002, 10:19 PM	#5
Glamdring Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2000 Location: MN Posts: 1,388	AFAIK only Sauvestre/BFS slugs would come close to the performance of a 430+ grain hard cast LBT .475 bullet fired from rifled SG. The remington copper sabot might give similar performance (I think it would be between other factory slugs and the BFS), but I am looking for something that will allow performance similar to 45-70 with hardcast flat tipped bullets for large game like Elk, Moose, and also for trusting when going after semi dangerous game like big pigs and bears. The other thing is all factory sabot loads are very expensive compared to Foster or Brenneke slugs that I use in my smoothbore. So I am looking for a fairly economical "solid" for a rifled SG. I think the Barnes X HP is best (expensive) "soft" for rifled SG's. __________________ "A traveler has no protection besides his fire-arms; and the constant habit of carrying them is the main check to more frequent robberies" --Charles Darwin from The Voyage Of The Beagle

December 15, 2002, 05:18 PM	#7
Glamdring Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2000 Location: MN Posts: 1,388	Where I live you have to use shotguns, or handgun, for deer hunting. Rifles are not allowed. It is slug only, buckshot is not legal. Rifles are not a legal option here. Or I would use a rifle. Regular slugs work fine for deer. With my long guns I try to have a selection of bullets that have basically same trajectory, so I can use same zero's, but of different construction to allow use on different game or targets. My thinking is that with the big bore pistol bullets and handloads I can make the bullet trajectory of the "solid" match, more or less, the trajectory of the "soft" I use most of the time. The main use I am looking at is for hogs and black bear hunts. Also want something more economical than the factory sabots. __________________ "A traveler has no protection besides his fire-arms; and the constant habit of carrying them is the main check to more frequent robberies" --Charles Darwin from The Voyage Of The Beagle

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December 3, 2002, 08:22 PM	#2
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	Winchester & Remington both make a sub-caliber saboted slug. Impressive accuracy reports from the flower shirts .... I did try one of Win's super duper sabot round from a smooth bore & it tubled as expected. An ounce .45 cal at 1900 pfs? ... had to try it out.

December 4, 2002, 05:21 AM	#3
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Sure, it'll work. I'm sure it'd work as well as the stuff available off the shelf. Just what do you want to do that the present ammo will not do?

December 4, 2002, 10:16 AM	#4
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	Well, in my case, seeing the 1900fps & trajectory figures, I just had to see if I could get some extra range out of the smooth bore. Dropped the $5+ per 5 shells & grabbed an screw-in rifled choke - prolly another $40. Forgot to mention that these were fired through that rifled choke. Didn't matter. They were tumbling by 25 yds. Gun rag article I saw on the Wins said something about 3" groups at 100+ yds, flat trajectory, yada - what's not to like? But this out of a fully rifled barrel. Like I said, had to try it with that screw-in. Tried to turn my smooth bore into something it isn't - a rifle. Read a bunch more here in gool ol' TFL - actually researched the archives (do I get a prize? ) & tried some Brennekes. Haven't looked back. (BTW, anybody want to buy a screw-in rifled choke tube? )

December 15, 2002, 01:56 AM	#6
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	Sorry for my implied flipant responses earlier. Just that I've spent a # of $s looking at this "thing." Really wish I hadn't as it's cost me plenty in shooting up various slugs 'n stuff. Chock up my responses as a "bad hair day." I've tried BRI-types in smooth barrels & they do seem to be pretty darned accurate & who could argue with a .50 caliber, 1 oz slug at fairly hefty velocities? = not me, & if they pattern in yours = go in peace & shoot well. I've had excellent results w/'em, but can't find them any more. (sigh) The sub-caliber rounds are purported to be the cat's a$$ regards trajectory, etc. from a rifled barrel, but then again, you're shooting a "rifle," no? I've had zip good results with 'em in smoothies and rifled chokes. And, giving up everything a shotgun is supposed to be = an all-purposes/do everything kinda-gun ..... with any of the "extra" chokes installed. Brennekes seem to pattern better than anything else I've tried - short-barreled/open chokes to 21"+/modifieds .... YMMV Dedicated rifled barrel for sabots? I betcha you could approximate a .45-70 load, but you'd also lose eveything "shotgun-wise" regards versatitlity. If I was gonna do that, I'd just use a rifle. If I still wanted a shotgun, I'd go with a known & dedicated slug-round I'd proven out beforehand. (yup. waxing philosophical ..... )