Pietta revolvers,,,

jlv08 · April 1, 2009, 11:35 PM

I have since purchased two Pietta's in the form of a 1858 5 and 1/2 inch NMA, and a 1851 Brass frame round barrel.

I've got a Colt 1860 on the way in steel, also a Pietta.

So far I'm very happy with these guns. I have read recently that Pietta has retooled and is producing a much better weapon.

I am curious about the steels that Pietta's are made of and would like to hear from others about what grade of steel Pietta's are made of.

As I said, I'm very happy with my pistols but I am also a detail freak and love to know as much as I can.

Thanks for any replies.

Doc Hoy · April 1, 2009, 11:52 PM

80,

I think we may have the same round barreled Colt. (Griswold & Gunnison or Leech and Rigdson). Got it a couple of weeks ago when the sale was on.

I know nothing of the metalurgy but the pistol is nice and tight.

I am sure the experts on the blog will wade in with their wisdom.

Smokin_Gun · April 2, 2009, 01:05 AM

That Q on what metal has been a question since BP replicas began...all has been purely speculation no facts have been given to date that I know of on hardness or composition. Even had A. Uberti (Son, I think it was) in our Forum(Voy) so I am told, to no avail...
One a these days I'll get a harness testor and at least we'll kno that from Maker to maker and various models and years of Mfg...

jlv08 · April 2, 2009, 08:06 AM

Well, it probably is some kind if ordinance grade steel.

Probably more than adequate for blackpowder and possibly better than what was originally used in the actual revolvers given the technology of steels at that time.

I'm more curious than concerned and love my Pietta's regardless.

I'm looking forward to recieving the 1860.

I had an Armi San Marco a few years back and FOOLISHLY let it get away from me.

I won't let that happen again, provided Cabela's comes through and sends me a good one.

Thanks for your replies!!

mykeal · April 2, 2009, 08:21 AM

What is 'ordinance grade steel'?

A hardness tester will only tell you the surface hardness. To get any idea of the hardness of the frame, barrel or other parts you'd have to section them and test the internal material. And I'm not sure what that would tell you anyway. Hardness is only one of several relevant material properties. If the question is, "How strong is the steel?", determining hardness will probably mislead you; very hard or very soft does NOT necessarily mean very strong or very weak.

Dingoboyx · April 2, 2009, 08:22 AM

I like them, they shoot well. My first Bp wheel was a ROA stainless and I prefer their bulk and weght & balance, but I certainly dont knock the Piettas. They are just a lighter, sleeker gun. Very accurate and nice to shoot. I think mine are 7.5" or 8" barrels. Probably the only reason I like the ROA is, you know how you get used to your first gun (or car) you compare everything else to what you are used to... and had I got my Piettas first, I would possibly prefer them.... they are very even in accuracy. I have also a Euroarms of America .44 1858 clone (but it is a bit of a basket case, trigger/cocking issues)

As to the steel, no idea, nice finish and handles tho.

When I got mine I did a google search for Pietta (& ElliPietta which is stamped on the barrels) and found lots of info

I also have a Uberti Colt .45 Dragoon (weighs a ton 4.1 pounds to be precise) but it is new unfired, beautiful gun tho

Muzza

Dingoboyx · April 2, 2009, 08:27 AM

My guess is steel for making military hardware. Ordinence on aeroplanes is, as far as I know, things like bombs, guns etc. I think jlv just means good, suitable steel apropriate for making a gun with

rather than any old recycled tin cans cruddy stuff. I dont think Pietta would risk using substandard steel to make guns with, they have a good reputation, and I am sure they wouldnt make guns out of cruddy steel to save a buck, and then bugga up their reputation

Muzza

mykeal · April 2, 2009, 08:29 AM

You are using the brand name Pietta as though it were a model, such as 1851 Navy or 1860 Army. Pietta makes a Starr Single Action - I'm fairly sure you wouldn't say a Pietta Starr was 'just a lighter, sleeker gun' than an ROA. When you say your Piettas are lighter and sleeker than the ROA, what models are you referring to?

sundance44s · April 2, 2009, 08:32 AM

Remember all those steel beer and soda cans from the 60`s ?? I hear the Italians bought them up and started makeing guns out of them ..
J/K April fools ..

Really they went to Japan for makeing Honda motor bikes ....take the paint of an old Honda and you`ll see beer cans.

Doc Hoy · April 2, 2009, 08:48 AM

80,

A couple of weeks ago, some folks on the dicsussion board had a conversation regarding the issue of returning merchandise to a vendor.

It began with a story from one of our conversants in which he told us of a clear case of faulty merchandise (a rifle I think it was) followed by a request to store sales staff to make it right which was rebuffed.

Two philosophies emerged from the discussion and while all of the participants were not in complete agreement, two aspects seemed to pole vault into our consciousness.

1. The treatment received by our member was both unacceptable and not in keeping with standard support from Cabela's

2. The threshold for returning a weapon purchased from any reputable vendor whether online or in the store should rightfully be set relatively low, meaning that it should not take much to get the pistol to go back. Some said, "If it isn't perfect, I send it back." declaring that they had returned pistols twice before receiving a good one. Others seemed to say that a little tweeking is acceptable indeed in some cases almost welcomed) in order to get the weapon to function right.

I have bought two pistols from Cabela's (both Pietta manufactured) and both were well above my personal "swear and send back" threshold.

My next purchase will be the 1860 you bought. I am going to shop around but will probably wind up at the Cabela's site. It is available thirty dollars cheaper elsewhere but I am uncertain as to the service available. I wouldn't buy from a human unless it was down around 170.00 or unless it was something special.

That last statement might garner a parcel of criticism, but I have been called some pretty bad names by some pretty good people.

Dingoboyx · April 2, 2009, 09:01 AM

The thread topic is regarding "Pietta 1858 revolvers & 1851 revolvers" My reference to Pietta was not as if it were a model, I am ON topic and referring to the revolvers in question, as Piettas

I dont care if Pietta makes Tanks & automatic tampon removers as well, this thread is on their revolvers and the steel they might be made of

Muzza

madcratebuilder · April 2, 2009, 10:34 AM

At the start of the manufacturing process you want to have a steel that is machinable. In this country, 4140, 4150, 1045 and CC465 (Ruger only) are all common. After machining is completed there are various heat treating and surface hardening processes.
I have cut Italian and USA made fire arms on my mill, lathe and metal band saw. The biggest thing I see is the lack of surface hardening with the Italian guns. They cut similar to 1045.
I'm sure there are many other grade steels used in the fire arms industry. Understanding metallurgy is a science and an art, and I'm just a hobbyist that scratch the surface.

Hawg · April 2, 2009, 11:56 AM

Quote:

When you say your Piettas are lighter and sleeker than the ROA, what models are you referring to?

All of them.

jlv08 · April 2, 2009, 12:00 PM

I appreciate your comments!

My definition if ordinance grade steels is steel made to a milspec of hardness, ductility,elasticity, and shear threshold.

I have just so many brain cells and can only comprehend so much.

Now, milspec may not apply but there may be a commercial standard.

I think I'll do a search on google and share back what I find out.

Thanks for the replies and I will also report back on the 1860 Army from Cabela's.

mykeal · April 2, 2009, 06:20 PM

Quote:

My reference to Pietta was not as if it were a model, I am ON topic and referring to the revolvers in question, as Piettas

To make the point, since you chose to ignore it, I take it you feel that Pietta's Starr Single Action revolver is lighter and sleeker than the Ruger Old Army. Can you confirm that?

By the way, please reread my post a bit more carefully; I made no accusation about you being off topic. The thread title is not specific as to a particular Pietta model, and I was genuinely curious as to what models you were thinking about.

That was for Dingoboyx; I already know that Hawg thinks any revolver is lighter and sleeker than an ROA.

madcratebuilder · April 2, 2009, 07:10 PM

Quote:

So far I'm very happy with these guns. I have read recently that Pietta has retooled and is producing a much better weapon.

Most Pietta owners are very satisfied with their revolvers. I believe they installed new CNC mills around 2000-2001. There has been some speculation on the grade of steel the Italians use, as far as I know they have never reveled what they use.

To paraphrase Jamie Brockett in his song about the Titanic
"she has made of good Italian wood, good Italian iron, they said she'd never go down.

four hundred ninety seven and a half feet of rope.

Hawg · April 3, 2009, 02:01 AM

Quote:

I already know that Hawg thinks any revolver is lighter and sleeker than an ROA.

Fingers McGee · April 3, 2009, 11:54 AM

Quote:

I already know that Hawg thinks any revolver is lighter and sleeker than an ROA.

Something that Hawg & I agree on

Indian Outlaw · April 4, 2009, 11:29 AM

Both Pietta and Uberti use softer steel in their cap & ball guns. Their cartridge guns require better steel. The softer steel is adequate for black powder pressures, but a Pietta/Uberti bolt that is out of time will wreak havoc on the soft cylinder. I've seen brand new cap & ball guns in display cases that already had deep grooves near the cylinder locking notches. On some, the notches themselves were all buggered up. I have noticed this more with Colts than with Remingtons for some reason.

ClemBert · April 4, 2009, 11:49 AM

Quote:

I already know that Hawg thinks any revolver is lighter and sleeker than an ROA.

Quote:

Something that Hawg & I agree on

Wow, even a Walker.....

Hawg · April 4, 2009, 12:52 PM

Ok so a Walker isn't lighter but it's definitely sleeker and better looking.

Smokin_Gun · April 4, 2009, 10:51 PM

Pietta Never made a Walker or a Dragoon as far as I know... and I feel an ROA is more Equated to a Dragoon that anything size and weight wise.

Fingers McGee · April 5, 2009, 12:31 AM

Quote HH:

Quote:

Ok so a Walker isn't lighter but it's definitely sleeker and better looking.

+1

Nice picture of a Whitneyville Dragoon Clembert.

madcratebuilder · April 5, 2009, 09:55 AM

ClemBert, the Whitneyville in the photo. Is that a antiqued repro? The 1847/US stamp is not on photos I have seen of the Whitneyvilles. Beautiful gun.

45Marlin carbine · April 5, 2009, 10:36 AM

I've had good luck with the Pietta revolvers I've owned - even the brass framed but I didn't feed them a steady diet of hot loadings.

April 1, 2009, 11:35 PM	#1
jlv08 Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2008 Posts: 122	Pietta revolvers,,, I have since purchased two Pietta's in the form of a 1858 5 and 1/2 inch NMA, and a 1851 Brass frame round barrel. I've got a Colt 1860 on the way in steel, also a Pietta. So far I'm very happy with these guns. I have read recently that Pietta has retooled and is producing a much better weapon. I am curious about the steels that Pietta's are made of and would like to hear from others about what grade of steel Pietta's are made of. As I said, I'm very happy with my pistols but I am also a detail freak and love to know as much as I can. Thanks for any replies.

April 1, 2009, 11:52 PM	#2
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Same pistol 80, I think we may have the same round barreled Colt. (Griswold & Gunnison or Leech and Rigdson). Got it a couple of weeks ago when the sale was on. I know nothing of the metalurgy but the pistol is nice and tight. I am sure the experts on the blog will wade in with their wisdom. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 2, 2009, 01:05 AM	#3
Smokin_Gun Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 2005 Location: Mojave Desert, CA Posts: 1,195	That Q on what metal has been a question since BP replicas began...all has been purely speculation no facts have been given to date that I know of on hardness or composition. Even had A. Uberti (Son, I think it was) in our Forum(Voy) so I am told, to no avail... One a these days I'll get a harness testor and at least we'll kno that from Maker to maker and various models and years of Mfg... __________________ "I Smoke Black Powder" "Favor an 1858 Remington" SGT. Smokin' Gun, Mosby's Rangers 43rd Virginia Cavalry C.S.A. SASS# 19634, ... Admin:http://blackpowdersmoke.com/oldcoots/index.php

April 2, 2009, 08:27 AM	#7
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	mykeal My guess is steel for making military hardware. Ordinence on aeroplanes is, as far as I know, things like bombs, guns etc. I think jlv just means good, suitable steel apropriate for making a gun with rather than any old recycled tin cans cruddy stuff. I dont think Pietta would risk using substandard steel to make guns with, they have a good reputation, and I am sure they wouldnt make guns out of cruddy steel to save a buck, and then bugga up their reputation Muzza __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

April 2, 2009, 08:48 AM	#10
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Emerging philosophies 80, A couple of weeks ago, some folks on the dicsussion board had a conversation regarding the issue of returning merchandise to a vendor. It began with a story from one of our conversants in which he told us of a clear case of faulty merchandise (a rifle I think it was) followed by a request to store sales staff to make it right which was rebuffed. Two philosophies emerged from the discussion and while all of the participants were not in complete agreement, two aspects seemed to pole vault into our consciousness. 1. The treatment received by our member was both unacceptable and not in keeping with standard support from Cabela's 2. The threshold for returning a weapon purchased from any reputable vendor whether online or in the store should rightfully be set relatively low, meaning that it should not take much to get the pistol to go back. Some said, "If it isn't perfect, I send it back." declaring that they had returned pistols twice before receiving a good one. Others seemed to say that a little tweeking is acceptable indeed in some cases almost welcomed) in order to get the weapon to function right. I have bought two pistols from Cabela's (both Pietta manufactured) and both were well above my personal "swear and send back" threshold. My next purchase will be the 1860 you bought. I am going to shop around but will probably wind up at the Cabela's site. It is available thirty dollars cheaper elsewhere but I am uncertain as to the service available. I wouldn't buy from a human unless it was down around 170.00 or unless it was something special. That last statement might garner a parcel of criticism, but I have been called some pretty bad names by some pretty good people. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 2, 2009, 08:06 AM	#4
jlv08 Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2008 Posts: 122	Well, it probably is some kind if ordinance grade steel. Probably more than adequate for blackpowder and possibly better than what was originally used in the actual revolvers given the technology of steels at that time. I'm more curious than concerned and love my Pietta's regardless. I'm looking forward to recieving the 1860. I had an Armi San Marco a few years back and FOOLISHLY let it get away from me. I won't let that happen again, provided Cabela's comes through and sends me a good one. Thanks for your replies!!

April 2, 2009, 08:21 AM	#5
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	What is 'ordinance grade steel'? A hardness tester will only tell you the surface hardness. To get any idea of the hardness of the frame, barrel or other parts you'd have to section them and test the internal material. And I'm not sure what that would tell you anyway. Hardness is only one of several relevant material properties. If the question is, "How strong is the steel?", determining hardness will probably mislead you; very hard or very soft does NOT necessarily mean very strong or very weak.

April 2, 2009, 08:29 AM	#8
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	You are using the brand name Pietta as though it were a model, such as 1851 Navy or 1860 Army. Pietta makes a Starr Single Action - I'm fairly sure you wouldn't say a Pietta Starr was 'just a lighter, sleeker gun' than an ROA. When you say your Piettas are lighter and sleeker than the ROA, what models are you referring to?

April 2, 2009, 08:32 AM	#9
sundance44s Senior Member Join Date: February 6, 2006 Location: Hernando , Ms. Posts: 579	Remember all those steel beer and soda cans from the 60`s ?? I hear the Italians bought them up and started makeing guns out of them .. J/K April fools .. Really they went to Japan for makeing Honda motor bikes ....take the paint of an old Honda and you`ll see beer cans.

April 2, 2009, 09:01 AM	#11
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	mykeal The thread topic is regarding "Pietta 1858 revolvers & 1851 revolvers" My reference to Pietta was not as if it were a model, I am ON topic and referring to the revolvers in question, as Piettas I dont care if Pietta makes Tanks & automatic tampon removers as well, this thread is on their revolvers and the steel they might be made of Muzza __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs Last edited by Dingoboyx; April 2, 2009 at 09:01 AM. Reason: typo

April 2, 2009, 10:34 AM	#12
madcratebuilder Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2007 Location: Northern Orygun Posts: 4,923	At the start of the manufacturing process you want to have a steel that is machinable. In this country, 4140, 4150, 1045 and CC465 (Ruger only) are all common. After machining is completed there are various heat treating and surface hardening processes. I have cut Italian and USA made fire arms on my mill, lathe and metal band saw. The biggest thing I see is the lack of surface hardening with the Italian guns. They cut similar to 1045. I'm sure there are many other grade steels used in the fire arms industry. Understanding metallurgy is a science and an art, and I'm just a hobbyist that scratch the surface.

April 2, 2009, 12:00 PM	#14
jlv08 Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2008 Posts: 122	I appreciate your comments! My definition if ordinance grade steels is steel made to a milspec of hardness, ductility,elasticity, and shear threshold. I have just so many brain cells and can only comprehend so much. Now, milspec may not apply but there may be a commercial standard. I think I'll do a search on google and share back what I find out. Thanks for the replies and I will also report back on the 1860 Army from Cabela's.

April 4, 2009, 11:29 AM	#19
Indian Outlaw Senior Member Join Date: December 16, 2008 Location: Behind a computer Posts: 100	Both Pietta and Uberti use softer steel in their cap & ball guns. Their cartridge guns require better steel. The softer steel is adequate for black powder pressures, but a Pietta/Uberti bolt that is out of time will wreak havoc on the soft cylinder. I've seen brand new cap & ball guns in display cases that already had deep grooves near the cylinder locking notches. On some, the notches themselves were all buggered up. I have noticed this more with Colts than with Remingtons for some reason. Last edited by Indian Outlaw; April 4, 2009 at 11:42 AM.

April 4, 2009, 12:52 PM	#21
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	Ok so a Walker isn't lighter but it's definitely sleeker and better looking.

April 4, 2009, 10:51 PM	#22
Smokin_Gun Senior Member Join Date: December 4, 2005 Location: Mojave Desert, CA Posts: 1,195	Pietta Never made a Walker or a Dragoon as far as I know... and I feel an ROA is more Equated to a Dragoon that anything size and weight wise. __________________ "I Smoke Black Powder" "Favor an 1858 Remington" SGT. Smokin' Gun, Mosby's Rangers 43rd Virginia Cavalry C.S.A. SASS# 19634, ... Admin:http://blackpowdersmoke.com/oldcoots/index.php

April 5, 2009, 09:55 AM	#24
madcratebuilder Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2007 Location: Northern Orygun Posts: 4,923	ClemBert, the Whitneyville in the photo. Is that a antiqued repro? The 1847/US stamp is not on photos I have seen of the Whitneyvilles. Beautiful gun.

April 5, 2009, 10:36 AM	#25
45Marlin carbine Junior member Join Date: January 26, 2007 Location: South-Western North Carolina Posts: 1,124	I've had good luck with the Pietta revolvers I've owned - even the brass framed but I didn't feed them a steady diet of hot loadings.