255gr cast 44 mag with lil gun load?

[Chainsaw.]

Hey guys so Im working up several loads with several powders all using my Lyman Thompson style 255 grain cast bullets. Im trying to find a starting load for lil gun, hodgons website has selection for loads in 240 grain bullets at 22.5 grains and 270 grain bullets at 19 grains, both starting loads. That doesnt put me close enough, given my experience to PICK a starting load.
IIRC I can use the starting load for a HEAVIER bullet on a lighter bullet but NOT the other way around,correct? Advise?

[TMD]

Advice?
Pick a different powder. Lil"Gun is known to cause sever throat erosion in revolvers. Didn't believe it myself and two pounds (only about 300 rounds) later I had to have the barrel in my .460 mag replaced.

[Chainsaw.]

Ive read complaints like yours as well as people saying its the best thing since sliced bread. Supposedly they've back ff the nitro content to alleviate that issue. Ill try a few...

[Tactical Lever]

Yes, you can use the data for heavier bullets for a lighter bullet. But not vice versa. Be sure you are using data for cast however.

[buck460XVR]

Be sure you are using data for cast however.

^^^This. Seems the info the OP is using is for a jacketed bullet. Hodgdon does not list Lil' Gun for use with 240 gr cast. I've heard from folks that have tried Lil' Gun with cast bullets is the same hi-temps that create the excessive forcing cone erosion, also melts the base of the bullet creating leading even in bullets that otherwise don't lead the barrel. I'm curious as to why the choice of Lil' Gun?

[Tactical Lever]

^^^This. Seems the info the OP is using is for a jacketed bullet. Hodgdon does not list Lil' Gun for use with 240 gr cast. I've heard from folks that have tried Lil' Gun with cast bullets is the same hi-temps that create the excessive forcing cone erosion, also melts the base of the bullet creating leading even in bullets that otherwise don't lead the barrel. I'm curious as to why the choice of Lil' Gun?

I'm not so sure that the heat has so much to do with it. The flame and pressure lasts for probably a millisecond. There no doubt is gas erosion and maybe some particulate cutting. Now if you are shooting long enough to heat treat your gun, that's another matter. You do have to match your bullet hardness to chamber pressure though.

I believe Lil Gun is meant to work better at higher pressures and velocities than cast pistol loads.

[Chainsaw.]

Just trying MANY different powders to see what produces the most desired results. Lil' gun haz been mentioned by many to be a good choice in thier mags. Ive yet to get my hamds on some 296, 2400 seems to have dried up, so, doing work ups. In fact I hust got back from shooting ~50 rounds. 4227 delivers a good punch (no chrono yet) with no flash but a bit of smoke and a fair amount of soot. Tite group in interesting for pussycat rounds but you cant take it much beyond that. Trying to get my mitts on other powders to try out with slow work ups.

[buck460XVR]

I'm not so sure that the heat has so much to do with it. The flame and pressure lasts for probably a millisecond. There no doubt is gas erosion and maybe some particulate cutting. Now if you are shooting long enough to heat treat your gun, that's another matter. You do have to match your bullet hardness to chamber pressure though.

I myself have never loaded lead bullets with Lil' Gun, I am only going by what others have told me. If there is enough heat and particulate cutting to eat a forcing cone, I assume there is enough to eat the base of a lead bullet as it passes thru the cylinder gap. I would also assume this would contribute to a poorer fit and thus leading. Not leading from just melted lead. I dunno. I do know there is relatively little if any published data using Lil' Gun with lead. That tells me something. If it were me and I wanted to push lead to max velocities with Lil' Gun, I'd probably use a GC. Again, JMHO.

Just trying MANY different powders to see what produces the most desired results. Lil' gun haz been mentioned by many to be a good choice in thier mags.

Half a dozen years ago, Lil' Gun was touted as the "Holy Grail" of powders for Magnum handgun calibers. Higher velocities than obtainable with H110/W296, 2400 or IMR/H4227 with considerably less pressure. I never found that to be true. What I did find was my guns got considerably hotter in considerably less time than when shooting any other powders. Didn't matter if they were my revolvers or handgun caliber carbines. When the reports of excessive premature forcing cone and top strap erosion came out, it was easy for me to believe. It was easy for me to walk away from Lil' Gun because it did not produce for me, any better velocities, or accuracy, in the calibers and bullets I was using. I never was one to load for highest velocity tho, only highest accuracy. In the last few years, you find few if any threads like this about using Lil' Gun in revolvers. This too, tells me something.

IMR4227 gives me my best accuracy in .44 mag and .460 mag with the projectiles I use. It is a tad dirty when not loaded to compressed or nearly compressed, but that does not matter to me. In .357 mag, the old standby H110/W296 gives me the velocities and accuracy I want for hunting, again, with the projectiles I use. I shot up the last of the loads I had using Lil' Gun in my carbines and I still have half a jug left. The cost of letting it sit, to me anyway, is much less than the cost of potential damage to my revolvers. Others are free to fell differently.

[Dufus]

I'll go along with what buck460XVR said.

Not only does it burn hotter (this has been proven) and corrodes the cone faster, it also creates gas cutting on the top strap faster than other powders.

I have discontinued use of Lil'Gun in hand guns and have solely used it in 22 Hornet. I can get close to 120 fps more velocity over the H110 loads with identical accuracy.

There are too many other suitable powders for handgun use.

[T. O'Heir]

There's one cast 250 grain Lil Gun load on Reloader's Nest. 250 will be close enough. Guys says 22 grains out of a Ruger 10" Flattop gives him 1451 fps. No idea how he decided it was below Max pressure. Reduce by 10%.

[Chainsaw.]

://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=338349

Here is the thread, read in other places about it use as well but given the input here Ill shelf (literally) the idea ISO a better powder.

[TimSr]

Hey guys so Im working up several loads with several powders all using my Lyman Thompson style 255 grain cast bullets. Im trying to find a starting load for lil gun, hodgons website has selection for loads in 240 grain bullets at 22.5 grains and 270 grain bullets at 19 grains, both starting loads.

Split the difference.

I too have heard lil gun doesn't work well with cast. I've also heard that about 110/296 which is baloney. I'm more concerned about the extra heat lil gun generates, and i's potential toll on the gun. From what I gather, it more of an issue of accumulated heat from fairing large strings without sufficient cooling time in between.

[GeauxTide]

The 296/H110/LilGun powders are designed for full case loads and hard crimped bullets for heavy bullet pulls to get maximum velocity with jacketed bullets. For cast bullets in 250 range, Unique or Power Pistol in the 8-10gr range will be excellent, low recoiling, accurate loads.