M14 information, please

[Machineguntony]

Does anyone have an actual picture of the M14 receiver? Google images does not show a receiver with the stamping.

Here is this juicy M14 Springfield, which is an actual military gun, that claims to be uncut. But the receiver doesn't say M14. Is it supposed to say M14?

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=485436346

A lot of dealers recklessly call an M1 an 'M14', when the receiver says clearly, 'M1'. I DO NOT want an M1A. Here is one example of a dealer calling an M1 and 'M14': http://dealernfa.com/shop/springfiel...ellent-038759/

If I bid on the M14 and win it, it must be an M14 and I will have it tested and magnafluxed to see if it is cut.

Juicy.

[1stmar]

Tony the receiver says
US rifle
7.62MM M14
Springfield
Armory
101319

I'd research that serial number. Looks to be in exceptional condition.

That second link is confusing though it says m1a not m1. It says springfield armory geneso il, as far as I know they only made m1as ans nothing worth 17k. To call that an m14 is wrong.

[SR420]

There are some factory select fire M1As out there. Lee Emerson (Different) owns one.

If you really want a select fire M14, I would first speak with the guys at Smith Enterprise.
Ron and his crew has a great deal of experience with them, and can help you avoid mistakes.

Good luck!

[9x19]

Weren't most M14s used as semi-autos only?

I seem to remember my Dad (USMC Ret) telling me that all M14s were capable of being full auto, but required the change out of the sear which were in the hands of the armorers so the Unit NCOs could limit their number and better control fire discipline.

BTW, he was not a fan of magazine fed FA weapons, including the BAR. Too easy to run thru the ammo supply, and then too much time to replenish it. BARs meant a two man team, one on the trigger and another who sat behind cover and stuffed magazines.

He carried a (M1919?) Browning .30 MG during the Korean War. He says his was so well used it rattled like a bucket of bolts, until one day his squad walked past an Army Jeep with a pristine example mounted to a tripod in the rear. He exchanged his for theirs without anyone noticing as the Army MPs were busy at the nearby cross-roads directing traffic.

Good luck Tony...

[Machineguntony]

Strange. Maybe because I was up late last night. I didn't see the M14 mark on it.

[James K]

I would expect that real transferable Springfield Armory (government factory) M14 rifles are very rare, but that sure appears to be one. I know I couldn't afford it.

M14 rifles were issued with the selector lock installed (as that one has), and the selector switch in a cloth bag attached to the rifle. To convert the rifle to selective fire, the armorer drove out the little roll pin in the selector lock, removed the lock, and installed the switch. No other changes were needed. The idea, as 9x19 says, was so the company commander (not an NCO) could control who had selective fire capability. Most commanders opted for keeping all their unit's rifles semi-auto only. It was not so much about saving ammo, but about training and safety; at that time, few soldiers had any experience with full auto fire and the main concern was much more about preventing accidents with uncontrolled guns than with ammo savings.

Jim

[Machineguntony]

Would it be an abomination to turn this gun into an M21?

I've always wanted an awesome M21 made from an uncut M14, with camo stock, and QD scope.

Of course, I'd save the original items that come with the gun.

[RJay]

The first time I fired a M14 was an eye opener. I grabbed ahold, firm grip, settled it firmly in to my shoulder and squeezed off a 5 round burst. By golly, the first round hit the target, where the other 4 rounds went, no oone knows, I just know they went up in the sky and far far away, somewhere down wind.

[Machineguntony]

RJay, this is one of the myths of machine guns: that only the first shot is controllable. It all comes down to proper machine gun shooting technique.

[Willie Lowman]

^^^ Truth ^^^

[4V50 Gary]

Looks real to me.

BTW, I met a fellow who had a M-14 and with trigger control, could get a two round burst off and hit the target. He knew better than to go for more than two. The muzzle rise would be too much. I can do the same with SMGs.

[Dave P]

Looks like a virgin M14, to me!

[Machineguntony]

I'm going to see if the owner will let me magnaflux test the gun to see if it is really uncut.

If/when I buy this gun, I am going to post a video of me doing an entire mag dump into an 8x11 paper target.

I don't own an M1A or M14, but I've done it on someone else's gun.

I can belt dump on my M60 into a small target, but I took down the video because it'll create the inevitable counter argument that the M60 weighs 3x an M14/M1. Whether on an M14/M1 or M60, the principle is the same: stance and body positioning.

Done right, there's almost no muzzle rise.

Granted, if I'm wrong and I find myself unable to control the M14, I will walk away from the M14 in great shame, having been bested by wood and metal.

[44 AMP]

The first time I fired a M14 was an eye opener.

Absolutely!

this is one of the myths of machine guns: that only the first shot is controllable. It all comes down to proper machine gun shooting technique.

It's a myth, only in the fact that it is not 100% true. For most people, it is 100% true, simply because most people don't know, or get to learn the techniques to compensate for the recoil.

Another myth, one so entrenched that it is "common knowledge" is how the muzzle of a Tommygun climbs, no matter what you do...

it does not. Muzzle climb (and drift to the side) is the result of the SHOOTER, not the gun itself.

I was in the last class USAOC&S trained on the M14 rifle (1975). Our "final exam" was to draw one of the test weapons (which had known defects), inspect, repair, and test fire them. 15rounds, 5 semi auto, 10 full auto.
The test range was a firing port in the wall about a foot square, at about knee height, so you had to be kneeling or sitting to get the rifle in the port.

I was not the first one finished, and listened to 3 or 4 others firing, and noted that on full auto, they were all firing 2 shot bursts. I was young, had owned a couple of .308Win bolt guns, (lighter than the M14 by a considerable amount) and figured I could handle the recoil. I had fired the m16A1 on full auto, and the M60 in basic training.

I was cocky, and decided I would pull off a 3 round burst, when my turn came. When it was my turn, I was given a mag with 15 rnds, and told 5 rounds semi, 10 full auto, short bursts.

My "3 rnd" burst was 6 rounds. Despite what I thought I knew, I got taught a lesson. My "short burst" moved me from the kneeling to the sitting position! However, my rifle NEVER left the firing port. The instructor glared at me, and said "SHORT BURSTS!!!". My remaining 4 rnds were two 2rnd bursts.

The M14 got a reputation (actually deserved) for being uncontrollable in FA fire, because of the people using it, its light weight (for FA fire in that caliber), and its high cyclic rate.

"Experts" couldn't keep it on a 25M target on full auto. True. But remember that at the time, there were very, very few "experts" that had experience firing that light a weapon in that heavy a caliber full auto.

While I no longer remember who did it, I did see a "modified" M14 gas system that brought the cyclic rate down to around 600RPM or so, and the gun was quite controllable in full auto. And, of course, it was civilians who came up with it. The military never had an interest in it, because the powers that be (at the time) committed us to the M16, from now, and henceforth, forever...
(or until someone comes up with something demonstrably better & cheaper...)

[RJay]

Odd that, your saying that there was no problem with controllability of the M14 in full auto. I was wearing the Army green when the M14 was the servicer rifle and was able to put a few rounds thru one. Fired one quite a bit in RVN in 66 and 67. With practice I could squeeze off a 4-6 round burst, but anything more was beyond my capabilities to control. Perhaps I was just doing it wrong? I betcha that was the problem! we just needed an expert to show us how to shoot one. Next tour I was given a M16, have to admit that was a joy to shoot.

[44 AMP]

I just had a thought about the "controlablilty" of the M14. If you have the cash, why not get it, and fit it with a .243Win barrel?

I'd expect shooting a 100gr out of an M14 on full auto would be more controllable.

Maybe .260 Rem?

[Machineguntony]

I do not see any bids on this gun. Strange because at $29,500, it isn't a bad deal, if the gun is what it appears to be. Maybe other people know something we don't know.

I emailed the owner once and called him. Now he's not calling me back.

Gosh, I would love an uncut military M14.

[Willie Lowman]

While I no longer remember who did it, I did see a "modified" M14 gas system that brought the cyclic rate down to around 600RPM or so, and the gun was quite controllable in full auto. And, of course, it was civilians who came up with it. The military never had an interest in it, because the powers that be (at the time) committed us to the M16, from now, and henceforth, forever...

This?

http://www.crazyhorserifles.com/m14k%20article.htm