Thinking of a .38/.357 rifle - Page 2

Danny Creasy · October 19, 2011, 06:30 AM

Neat - more information:

http://www.gunblast.com/Ruger-M77-357.htm

I have a bolt action chambered for a pistol cartridge but mine is a .45 ACP:

Fun and I have shot 7/8ths inch five shot groups at 50 yards with handloads using Sierra Matchking bullets.

cmdc · October 19, 2011, 10:46 AM

Shotgun693, what would you estimate the max rounds for the Rossi to be? I don't shoot CAS, just out and about, target and maybe hunting, so I would imagine I would not put more than a couple hundred rounds a year through these guns, if that.

The thing is, they are not THAT much cheaper than a Marlin, maybe a couple hundred bucks, or so. As I stated in an earlier post, I wanted the Marlins, and I'm wondering when it will be safe to buy a new one. My LGS has had several 1894s in in the past year or so, and every one of them had to go back to Marlin before even being sold, for one reason or another.

Thanks

Dobe · October 19, 2011, 10:57 AM

If not Cowboy shooting, the Ruger 77/357 would be my choice.

sigshepardo · October 19, 2011, 11:47 AM

I've never fired one in .357, but I love the Marlin 1894SS in .44 Mag

briandg · October 19, 2011, 01:53 PM

RE capacity of the rossi, it's probably 10 .357 or more. I'd go check but my coffee would get cold.

Regarding the ruger bolts, I never could understand the purpose of a .357/.44 bolt. Accuracy isn't an issue at that distance limitation and intended game. The bolt (IMO) is a difficult repeat shot for close in semi dangerous game like hogs. The .357 rifle is a marginal deer/hog gun, and I'd sure want a better follow up. and with the standard 5 round magazine, why did they not go with a tube, just like the .22 lr platforms?

If I could have bought a .357 bolt with a ten round tube for a reasonable price, i'd have snapped it up in a heartbeat, cut the barrel to 18 inches, and had a new favorite casual shooting and hiking rifle. instead, now I have a rossi.

raceroch · October 19, 2011, 02:16 PM

100% ruger 77/357. $650 out the door at my local shop. to bad they dont have anything but the all weather setup. waiting for blued/wood setup...

Paladin7 · October 19, 2011, 02:47 PM

2damnold4this, you are definitely thinking in the right direction... the 357 Lever Action Carbine is a tremendous all around firearm.

I have a Marlin 1894CSS pre-Remington (the Remington made guns have had some quality issues) and recommend it very highly and it's one of the most fun and versatile guns I own. The 1894CSS is the Stainless version of the 1894C. This is a very high quality well made rifle...

You can load it mild to wild, it carries very well in the field, is reliable and can handle light plinking to deer sized game.

Check out 357 ballistics out of an 18" carbine barrel and you will be impressed.

Not sure how it would do on pigs, but with the right bullet and good shot placement it ought to do the job.

Buy one, you won't be sorry...

Water-Man · October 19, 2011, 02:59 PM

The capacity of my Rossi/Puma92 .357mag w/octagon barrel is 10+1.

ATW525 · October 19, 2011, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Based on 14 years of CAS I can tell you that the Puma/Rossi is ok but just doesn't stand up to extended use like a Marlin or Uberti. A Cowboy Shooter might well shoot 1000 rounds through a rifle in a year. We are not easy on our guns. We buy what shoots best and lasts.

How exactly are Rossi 92s not holding up? I've owned a couple in .357 magnum and shot some pretty heavy loads through them both without issue, and Rossi chambers their 92s in calibers up to and including .454. I'm not seeing how a thousand rounds a year of mouse fart cowboy loads are breaking guns... are these rifles that people have been tinkering with?

PunchinPaper · October 19, 2011, 05:14 PM

The Rossi 92s are great rifles IMO.
They are accurate.
They are available at decent prices & will handle some pretty hot loads.
There made to be used ,not sit an a safe.
That's what I like most about them.

PunchinPaper · October 19, 2011, 05:18 PM

Sheffield, what kind of rifle is your 45acp?
Not trying to hijack the thread here sorry...
I'm just wondering.

JACK308 · October 19, 2011, 06:07 PM

IMO I think the 357mag is a little light for hogs! if it was me I would look at either the 1895 in 45/70 or 44 mag. better nock down power! but it's your choise.

Danny Creasy · October 19, 2011, 07:32 PM

I had this put together about 20 years ago. I was inspired by the experimental .45 ACP O3 Springfield that appears in Hatcher's Notebook. The .45 ACP cartridge case is identical to a .30-06, 8 mm, etc. at the base. So, I acquired a BRNO vz24 action, a 25 inch Douglas .45 ACP barrel blank (intended for a smith to make several pistol barrels from), a Choate stock, Burris 2.75X Scout Scope, a Burris scout mount, and sent it all to Broad Creek Rifle Works. He threw in a sweet Timney trigger and turned the bolt handle down.

I had several ideas of how to make it a repeater but ended up enjoying the heck out of it as a single shot. Just slap one of the Sugar Babies down at the rear of the magazine follower, closing the bolt snaps up the round with the controlled feed, then shoulder, aim, and shoot. Bringing the bolt back leaves the fired case sitting loose on the follower to be plucked up for reloading.

I always enjoyed pulling this out at the end of a IDPA or IPSC match and wowing the stragglers while feeding the big ole Mauser from my Dillon pistol ammo bag and making cans dance at 50 to 100 yards.

You have seen Funny Cars. This is a Funny Gun. No real reason to do it. Just cause. Although, I would not hesitate to hunt dear with my 200 grain Speer Hollow Point handloads. Really though, it is at its best as a plinker going to town with bulk cast 230 grain loads.

Alaska444 · October 19, 2011, 07:55 PM

I have a Marlin 1894c in .357 that works well. With Buffalo Bore cartridges, I get nearly 30-30 level power out of this .357 with 180 gr bullets at about 1900 fps. That is some serious power from a pistol round. That makes it a great woods rifle in almost all of the lower 48, with the exception of the grizzly areas in the western states.

briandg · October 20, 2011, 03:19 AM

Not all hogs are the same. A .357 carbine with full battle rounds of 296 behind 180 grain solid lead would drop any of the mid sized hogs I have seen. I'm not talking about the big boars that could kill and eat a black bear, but the average crop raiding pig. Unless you are out stalking, using weapons on the light side instead of a cannon doesn't really have any risks. Anything that can put down a 300 pound crackhead can certainly drop a hog. Remember, you're not blasting through heavy hard bones, and tons of hard muscle, you're punching through bacon and lard.

I have a friend that has dropped them with 12 gauge goose loads with a single round. Another uses a .300 whisper. Could a .357 seriously be considered inadequate when a subsonic .30 caliber round with only 40 more grains of bullet weight puts them down like a truckload of bricks was dropped on their skulls?

Dobe · October 20, 2011, 07:24 AM

We use to hunt them with .22s. The dogs would catch them, and a .22 to the head would finish them.

Deja vu · October 20, 2011, 07:43 AM

I know down south the hogs are bigger but when I was hog hunting in Oregon I brought 2 gun with me because I was unsure which to use. One was a 45/70 and the other was a 357 magnum. When the guide saw my 45/70 e asked if I was really going to use that and I told him I had a 357 in the car as well and he recommended the 357 because the 45/70 was "too much gun for hogs"

The 357 mag killed every hog but 1 with a single round. The one that took two shots was shot by my brother who asked to shoot my marlin and had never fired it before and ended up shooting too high and breaking the spin a little behind the the front shoulders. The hog could not move but it was clearly still alive. A second shot to the head worked well.

p.s. how big is an average hog in the south? The ones in Oregon where about 80-140 LBS with one that was about 170lbs...

Hunter Customs · October 20, 2011, 08:18 AM

Quote:

One rifle not yet mentioned is the Rossi (Puma). A popular version of the original Winchester model 92, this lever is available in .357/.38 as well as in other handgun calibers. New M92's run around $400-$450 and are well-built, attractive, accurate with many options available. Used levers of any make are difficult to find as most are kept by their owners.

Over the years I have owned levers by Winchester, Marlin and Henry and recently bought my first Rossi M92. Have only shot paper so far but will try on deer next month.

oldhunter

I agree with the above. I had a Rossi 357 lever gun and it was one of the best little rifles I ever owned.
It was accurate and I never had any trouble of any kind with it.
I shot some pretty stiff reloads through it and it handled them just fine.
If I was in the market for a lever gun it would be at the top of my list for consideration.
Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com

SteelChickenShooter · October 21, 2011, 05:52 PM

Did not notice if anyone mentioned the Henry 357 Mag. Mine arrived today so I plan to give a range report after some ammo testing in the morning. Will try some brands of 38 and 357 Mag. My intent is plinking bowling pins but I could use this rifle for deer if it works well. Anyone suggest a good distance for open sight accuracy testing? I was thinking 75 yards.

Big Shrek · October 22, 2011, 05:14 PM

The problem with Marlins started around 2005, when they first got the word they were going to get sold.

So any 2005-2011 Marlins, I simply check carefully pre-purchase...much like I check a used rifle at a Gun Show.
If it has issues that I can't easily resolve within a few minutes of minor hand-fitting, I won't buy it.

I went to a local gun store & they had 3 XT-22's, one had a misalignment in the stock/action mating...and I pointed it out to the owner.
After he reset it in the stock, it was spot on. Heck, that could happen to any rifle. QC ain't what it used to be anywhere.

I can say that I've talked with one the new Managers at Marlin in Kentucky. He's one dedicated fella!!
I look forward to Rem-Lin finally smoothing out the Manufacturing processes and putting out some 1950's/1960's-quality rifles in the years to come.

Most folks know not to buy a Brand-New car or truck the First year its made.
Reason being, a new production line takes a MINIMUM of a year to get most of the bugs worked out...
get the people settled into a well-trained mode of operation...
get the QC up to snuff...
and respond to ALL the complaints the customers have of the product...

I honestly figure on about 3 years before all the Marlin lines are running smoothly again.
Or, at least, better than what the people of questionable skills that worked at Marlin-Connecticut from 2005-2010 put out...
(If anyone wishes to debate this, let me show you 4 Marlin rifles bought new from 2005-2010 that are badly out-of-spec)
Which is fine, because I've got two new Twin Sons and I probably won't be able to AFFORD a new Marlin for about that long...LOL
Even though they are rather inexpensive...good value

SteelChickenShooter · October 22, 2011, 09:11 PM

Without first range experience details at this moment, I can certainly see why there would be a following for rifles that shoot the .38/.357
Hindsight is 20/20 and my first firing of the Henry Big Boy shooting these pistol cartridges makes me wonder why I never had something like this years earlier. I've no doubt missed a few decades of some mighty fine fun shooting.

October 19, 2011, 06:30 AM	#26
Danny Creasy Senior Member Join Date: October 2, 2007 Location: Northwest Alabama Posts: 274	Neat - more information: http://www.gunblast.com/Ruger-M77-357.htm I have a bolt action chambered for a pistol cartridge but mine is a .45 ACP: Fun and I have shot 7/8ths inch five shot groups at 50 yards with handloads using Sierra Matchking bullets. Last edited by Danny Creasy; October 19, 2011 at 07:13 PM.

October 19, 2011, 10:57 AM	#28
Dobe Senior Member Join Date: June 28, 2004 Posts: 1,348	If not Cowboy shooting, the Ruger 77/357 would be my choice. __________________ What America needs is not a good 5 cent cigar. What America needs is a good source of cheap ammunition.

October 19, 2011, 02:47 PM	#32
Paladin7 Senior Member Join Date: July 11, 2002 Posts: 109	2damnold4this, you are definitely thinking in the right direction... the 357 Lever Action Carbine is a tremendous all around firearm. I have a Marlin 1894CSS pre-Remington (the Remington made guns have had some quality issues) and recommend it very highly and it's one of the most fun and versatile guns I own. The 1894CSS is the Stainless version of the 1894C. This is a very high quality well made rifle... You can load it mild to wild, it carries very well in the field, is reliable and can handle light plinking to deer sized game. Check out 357 ballistics out of an 18" carbine barrel and you will be impressed. Not sure how it would do on pigs, but with the right bullet and good shot placement it ought to do the job. Buy one, you won't be sorry... Last edited by Paladin7; October 19, 2011 at 02:53 PM.

October 19, 2011, 07:32 PM	#38
Danny Creasy Senior Member Join Date: October 2, 2007 Location: Northwest Alabama Posts: 274	Punchin Paper-Sheffield, what kind of rifle is your 45acp? I had this put together about 20 years ago. I was inspired by the experimental .45 ACP O3 Springfield that appears in Hatcher's Notebook. The .45 ACP cartridge case is identical to a .30-06, 8 mm, etc. at the base. So, I acquired a BRNO vz24 action, a 25 inch Douglas .45 ACP barrel blank (intended for a smith to make several pistol barrels from), a Choate stock, Burris 2.75X Scout Scope, a Burris scout mount, and sent it all to Broad Creek Rifle Works. He threw in a sweet Timney trigger and turned the bolt handle down. I had several ideas of how to make it a repeater but ended up enjoying the heck out of it as a single shot. Just slap one of the Sugar Babies down at the rear of the magazine follower, closing the bolt snaps up the round with the controlled feed, then shoulder, aim, and shoot. Bringing the bolt back leaves the fired case sitting loose on the follower to be plucked up for reloading. I always enjoyed pulling this out at the end of a IDPA or IPSC match and wowing the stragglers while feeding the big ole Mauser from my Dillon pistol ammo bag and making cans dance at 50 to 100 yards. You have seen Funny Cars. This is a Funny Gun. No real reason to do it. Just cause. Although, I would not hesitate to hunt dear with my 200 grain Speer Hollow Point handloads. Really though, it is at its best as a plinker going to town with bulk cast 230 grain loads. Last edited by Danny Creasy; October 19, 2011 at 07:38 PM.

October 20, 2011, 07:24 AM	#41
Dobe Senior Member Join Date: June 28, 2004 Posts: 1,348	We use to hunt them with .22s. The dogs would catch them, and a .22 to the head would finish them. __________________ What America needs is not a good 5 cent cigar. What America needs is a good source of cheap ammunition.

October 19, 2011, 10:46 AM	#27
cmdc Senior Member Join Date: April 1, 2010 Location: Florida Gulf Coast Posts: 721	Shotgun693, what would you estimate the max rounds for the Rossi to be? I don't shoot CAS, just out and about, target and maybe hunting, so I would imagine I would not put more than a couple hundred rounds a year through these guns, if that. The thing is, they are not THAT much cheaper than a Marlin, maybe a couple hundred bucks, or so. As I stated in an earlier post, I wanted the Marlins, and I'm wondering when it will be safe to buy a new one. My LGS has had several 1894s in in the past year or so, and every one of them had to go back to Marlin before even being sold, for one reason or another. Thanks

October 19, 2011, 11:47 AM	#29
sigshepardo Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2011 Location: Indiana Posts: 150	I've never fired one in .357, but I love the Marlin 1894SS in .44 Mag

October 19, 2011, 01:53 PM	#30
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	RE capacity of the rossi, it's probably 10 .357 or more. I'd go check but my coffee would get cold. Regarding the ruger bolts, I never could understand the purpose of a .357/.44 bolt. Accuracy isn't an issue at that distance limitation and intended game. The bolt (IMO) is a difficult repeat shot for close in semi dangerous game like hogs. The .357 rifle is a marginal deer/hog gun, and I'd sure want a better follow up. and with the standard 5 round magazine, why did they not go with a tube, just like the .22 lr platforms? If I could have bought a .357 bolt with a ten round tube for a reasonable price, i'd have snapped it up in a heartbeat, cut the barrel to 18 inches, and had a new favorite casual shooting and hiking rifle. instead, now I have a rossi.

October 19, 2011, 02:16 PM	#31
raceroch Member Join Date: October 5, 2011 Location: RI Posts: 51	100% ruger 77/357. $650 out the door at my local shop. to bad they dont have anything but the all weather setup. waiting for blued/wood setup...

October 19, 2011, 02:59 PM	#33
Water-Man Senior Member Join Date: March 23, 2008 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 2,126	The capacity of my Rossi/Puma92 .357mag w/octagon barrel is 10+1.

October 19, 2011, 05:14 PM	#35
PunchinPaper Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2011 Posts: 148	The Rossi 92s are great rifles IMO. They are accurate. They are available at decent prices & will handle some pretty hot loads. There made to be used ,not sit an a safe. That's what I like most about them.

October 19, 2011, 05:18 PM	#36
PunchinPaper Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2011 Posts: 148	Sheffield, what kind of rifle is your 45acp? Not trying to hijack the thread here sorry... I'm just wondering.

October 19, 2011, 06:07 PM	#37
JACK308 Junior member Join Date: July 10, 2011 Posts: 377	IMO I think the 357mag is a little light for hogs! if it was me I would look at either the 1895 in 45/70 or 44 mag. better nock down power! but it's your choise.

October 19, 2011, 07:55 PM	#39
Alaska444 Junior member Join Date: April 3, 2010 Posts: 1,231	I have a Marlin 1894c in .357 that works well. With Buffalo Bore cartridges, I get nearly 30-30 level power out of this .357 with 180 gr bullets at about 1900 fps. That is some serious power from a pistol round. That makes it a great woods rifle in almost all of the lower 48, with the exception of the grizzly areas in the western states.

October 20, 2011, 03:19 AM	#40
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	Not all hogs are the same. A .357 carbine with full battle rounds of 296 behind 180 grain solid lead would drop any of the mid sized hogs I have seen. I'm not talking about the big boars that could kill and eat a black bear, but the average crop raiding pig. Unless you are out stalking, using weapons on the light side instead of a cannon doesn't really have any risks. Anything that can put down a 300 pound crackhead can certainly drop a hog. Remember, you're not blasting through heavy hard bones, and tons of hard muscle, you're punching through bacon and lard. I have a friend that has dropped them with 12 gauge goose loads with a single round. Another uses a .300 whisper. Could a .357 seriously be considered inadequate when a subsonic .30 caliber round with only 40 more grains of bullet weight puts them down like a truckload of bricks was dropped on their skulls?

October 20, 2011, 07:43 AM	#42
Deja vu Senior Member Join Date: March 14, 2010 Location: Border of Idaho & Montana Posts: 2,584	I know down south the hogs are bigger but when I was hog hunting in Oregon I brought 2 gun with me because I was unsure which to use. One was a 45/70 and the other was a 357 magnum. When the guide saw my 45/70 e asked if I was really going to use that and I told him I had a 357 in the car as well and he recommended the 357 because the 45/70 was "too much gun for hogs" The 357 mag killed every hog but 1 with a single round. The one that took two shots was shot by my brother who asked to shoot my marlin and had never fired it before and ended up shooting too high and breaking the spin a little behind the the front shoulders. The hog could not move but it was clearly still alive. A second shot to the head worked well. p.s. how big is an average hog in the south? The ones in Oregon where about 80-140 LBS with one that was about 170lbs... __________________ Shot placement is everything! I would rather take a round of 50BMG to the foot than a 22short to the base of the skull. all 26 of my guns are 45/70 govt, 357 mag, 22 or 12 ga... I believe in keeping it simple. Wish my wife did as well...

October 21, 2011, 05:52 PM	#44
SteelChickenShooter Senior Member Join Date: May 12, 2011 Posts: 863	Did not notice if anyone mentioned the Henry 357 Mag. Mine arrived today so I plan to give a range report after some ammo testing in the morning. Will try some brands of 38 and 357 Mag. My intent is plinking bowling pins but I could use this rifle for deer if it works well. Anyone suggest a good distance for open sight accuracy testing? I was thinking 75 yards.

October 22, 2011, 05:14 PM	#45
Big Shrek Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: NorthWest Florida Posts: 1,358	The problem with Marlins started around 2005, when they first got the word they were going to get sold. So any 2005-2011 Marlins, I simply check carefully pre-purchase...much like I check a used rifle at a Gun Show. If it has issues that I can't easily resolve within a few minutes of minor hand-fitting, I won't buy it. I went to a local gun store & they had 3 XT-22's, one had a misalignment in the stock/action mating...and I pointed it out to the owner. After he reset it in the stock, it was spot on. Heck, that could happen to any rifle. QC ain't what it used to be anywhere. I can say that I've talked with one the new Managers at Marlin in Kentucky. He's one dedicated fella!! I look forward to Rem-Lin finally smoothing out the Manufacturing processes and putting out some 1950's/1960's-quality rifles in the years to come. Most folks know not to buy a Brand-New car or truck the First year its made. Reason being, a new production line takes a MINIMUM of a year to get most of the bugs worked out... get the people settled into a well-trained mode of operation... get the QC up to snuff... and respond to ALL the complaints the customers have of the product... I honestly figure on about 3 years before all the Marlin lines are running smoothly again. Or, at least, better than what the people of questionable skills that worked at Marlin-Connecticut from 2005-2010 put out... (If anyone wishes to debate this, let me show you 4 Marlin rifles bought new from 2005-2010 that are badly out-of-spec) Which is fine, because I've got two new Twin Sons and I probably won't be able to AFFORD a new Marlin for about that long...LOL Even though they are rather inexpensive...good value __________________ Marlin Specialist Calico Specialist A gun should be a tool in the hands of a deadly weapon, not a deadly weapon in the hands of a tool.

October 22, 2011, 09:11 PM	#46
SteelChickenShooter Senior Member Join Date: May 12, 2011 Posts: 863	Without first range experience details at this moment, I can certainly see why there would be a following for rifles that shoot the .38/.357 Hindsight is 20/20 and my first firing of the Henry Big Boy shooting these pistol cartridges makes me wonder why I never had something like this years earlier. I've no doubt missed a few decades of some mighty fine fun shooting.