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Old December 3, 2019, 11:43 PM   #26
stagpanther
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Seems like it's pretty common to see the range of bullets used as being from .355 to .357, and the occasional foray into .358. SAAMI chamber specs indicate a bore of .346 and groove of .355, I'm kind of interested what the implications on case flow might be since presumably you need to crimp the mouth which is also what the case headspaces off of.

I also have noticed some posts indicating people are using 9mm muzzle devices--shaw itself warns to use a 40 caliber device which makes sense to me.
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Old December 4, 2019, 12:04 AM   #27
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Stag,

Ok now you touched on a nugget that Winchester has really fouled up.

Yes it headspaces on the mouth.

Yes the brass must be the correct length.

Yes any crimp needs to be minimal.

Winchester has shipped a lot of target ammo with both under length and over length brass.

Under length brass can result in a FTF.

Over length brass causes the case to jam into the throat and hold onto the bullet instead of releasing it. Lots of flattened primers, split cases, etc.

With Winchester ammo, some are measuring case length on each new round. Any over length case is set aside, disassembled, trimmed and reassembled.

For my 357AR, I set my seating die for flare removal without really trying to crimp at all.

Early on you should probably make up some dummy rounds using once fired brass. If the bullets are easy to seat in the cases, they may be less secure than needed. If so, cycle the heck out of the dummies while checking the round for any change in OAL. Do this for each brand of brass you use and the smallest bullet diameter you will be using.

If you need to crimp, keep it to the least amount needed.
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Old December 4, 2019, 12:48 AM   #28
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Quote:
Early on you should probably make up some dummy rounds using once fired brass. If the bullets are easy to seat in the cases, they may be less secure than needed. If so, cycle the heck out of the dummies while checking the round for any change in OAL. Do this for each brand of brass you use and the smallest bullet diameter you will be using.

If you need to crimp, keep it to the least amount needed.
Good advice, thanks for that.
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Old December 4, 2019, 03:03 AM   #29
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I have been using cast in my guns. I actually do not have a 350 L, I have a 357AR (350 L with slightly shorter brass, 0.358 bore and uses 0.223 brass) and bunch of 357 Max.
That's the problem. You know what you have.
The .350 Legend guys generally don't. At best, they're leaning on SAAMI specs. (As is evident in the discussion link I posted.)

.350 Legend is loaded by Winchester with .355 bullets, which most people assume to be groove diameter.
But it isn't the case. People that have slugged their barrels have found .354-.359" groove diameters.

To make matters worse for cast bullet shooters, even properly made barrels, that actually meet SAAMI spec, have throats that taper from up to 0.359" to as small as 0.353". (Because the cartridge is supposed to take .357" bullets in the throat, but is spec'd for a .355" groove diameter, with +/-0.002" tolerance.)
So, even in most "proper" barrels, there will be blow-by with a .357" bullet, until it fully seals in the throat/leade. ...And the guys that size to .356" or .355" will just make things worse.
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Old December 4, 2019, 04:40 AM   #30
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How many folks in this discussion thread speak from actually having a 350 Legend ?
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Old December 4, 2019, 05:40 AM   #31
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I definitely value everyone's experience and opinions--that's why I solicit it when dipping my toes in something new to me. My previous straight wall case experience in AR's has been dealing with pistol cartridge carbines, and I certainly learned a lot from those--like P Flados says I get best results when I can seat a bullet with enough neck/case tension so that I don't need to crimp or minimally crimp if at all possible yet maintain headspace. However, the legend runs close to the same pressures as the 223 rem and is a DI lock-lug system, so it's potentially "sportier" as to the consequences when something goes sideways. Despite all the criticism blow-backs get, they do dump and dissipate their lower pressures almost immediately in the upper receiver once the carrier starts back.

The biggest question I have in my mind now--where's the load data?
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Old December 4, 2019, 06:30 AM   #32
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More thoughts I'm just throwing out into cyberspace: it appears that Winnie decided to make the legend "backward compatible" to accommodate conventional 9mm bullets, for which I've read posts of criticism directed at them. I'm not so sure that's a bad idea rather than expecting the market to genuflect to some new bullet spec that's so close to the 355 that they probably are not going to do it IMO. I've dabbled in the 9 x 25 Dillon for quite some time and have driven 9mm bullets up to nearly 3000 fps out of a Glock--the 9mm bullet can potentially be delivered with very good velocity and energy, as well as accuracy out to 100 yds and beyond but obviously the shooter needs to know when that bullet goes over the cliff performance-wise since it will bleed velocity and energy very quickly after a certain point. That said, most 9mm bullets are not designed to stabilize and stay together at those velocities.
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Old December 4, 2019, 06:44 AM   #33
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Just noticed that Hornady's 170 gr interlock popped back into available at midway and jumped on 4 boxes of those.
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Old December 4, 2019, 12:54 PM   #34
P Flados
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stagpanther View Post
The biggest question I have in my mind now--where's the load data?
There is data at:

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle
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Old December 4, 2019, 02:27 PM   #35
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I missed it first glance--thanks!
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Old December 5, 2019, 09:47 AM   #36
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Kudos to Joebob's--they got my parts to me yesterday before anyone else has even notified they are ready to ship. Shipping of orders has appeared to ground to a halt from about 3/4 of the orders I made--but this is SOP I've noticed over the years for this time of year. I expect the build to be complete sometime mid-January at this rate.

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Old December 6, 2019, 01:12 PM   #37
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Stupid is as stupid does--I just called EAB to ask about the barrel, it was listed on their site as "in stock, ships Dec 6!" when I ordered it--I just found out what that ACTUALLY means is Shaw has them and will be shipping them to EAB on the 6th.
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Old December 6, 2019, 07:35 PM   #38
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Pretty sure that's going 1000 miles in the wrong direction...
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Old December 6, 2019, 09:39 PM   #39
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Pretty sure that's going 1000 miles in the wrong direction...
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OMG! That's right, thanks for reminding me about what happened last year. The shortest direction between two shipping points in the US is the opposite direction of a straight line connecting them.
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If you’re ever hiking in the woods and you get lost, just look up and find the brightest star in the sky and you’ll know which way space is.
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Old December 7, 2019, 10:18 AM   #40
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Can Shaw tell you what groove diameter they are using?
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Old December 7, 2019, 10:35 AM   #41
stagpanther
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Can Shaw tell you what groove diameter they are using?
It's on their website, I believe. I'm not worried about it as long as they can say they are within SAAMI specs. I will do a cast of the chamber and the leade before I asemble.
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Old Yesterday, 09:59 AM   #42
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Since EAB didn't have the barrel or magazine in stock--I decided to cancel the order and go with a Faxon barrel instead. The Faxon is a lighter contour--and is also 20" instead of 18". Never tried Faxon before--kinda curious how they are. Interestingly, it too has a carbine gas system. The Faxon barrel also has an oddball thread pitch--1/2 x 28--so it took me a while to find a suitable comp--ended up selecting a .375 comp from Rex Silentium with a thread adaptor to fit the barrel muzzle.
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