newbie seeks advice on primer pocket cleaning

[Dave P]

Lets see - 100 posts on cleaning primer pockets. Incredible!

I bet you could get at least fifty more on your last question, about when to change the media. The right answer is: when it stops cleaning. Or, was it when it gets dirty? Or after every batch?

[Sevens]

The OP is new at this, gathering heaps of opinions from long time, hands-on and high round count hobbyist handloaders.

He has also been good enough to piggyback related, novice level questions all in the same thread which GREATLY serves the forum, keeps the topic list tidy and doesn't create a dozen small threads with basic questions. He even gave the thread a concise title which SHOULD only invite those willing to help.

All that to his benefit with only a couple worthless snark posts like the one above mine that took more energy to type than any possible usefulness from anyone who might read it.

In this thread and in the pictures of your brass:

Job well done, OP!

[polyphemus]

Yes, all true... and you are pointing that out because?

A:

I was hoping someone would weigh in on that, but all I got was a useless, cranky reply from one member...

[Frankly]

poly,

I appreciate the good folks here who have been patient and nice enough to educate a newbie. I believe I have thanked them numerous times throughout this thread...

Instead of taking my reference to one crank out of context to make me appear ungrateful, how about sharing some insight into the question itself? Why does my once-fired foreign made brass go through the resizer with significantly more resistance than the USA made brass?

Anyone?

[Sevens]

My guess...?

It's craptastic.
That is an industry term. Herter's is a classic and nostalgic American business from the golden age of shooting that went out of business decades ago. The Herter's name was purchased by God knows which offshore outfit and it is one of the very cheapest (low price, low cost, cheap materials, quality...?) products on the entire market.

I would venture a guess that they don't use the same quality or alloy of brass that makes up their cartridge case and the net result is that it simply doesn't act like the known quality brands on the market.

[polyphemus]

how about sharing some insight into the question itself?

ok,I am sure I'm gonna take flak( or flack like they say over there) but I don't buy foreign made guns,ammo or anything else if I can help it,I used to bend myself over backwards to find American made products,sadly I must say I lost
the struggle for the most part.
So,if you have good measuring tools and foreign made ammunition check the dimensions against domestic made samples,should you find significant differences then there's your answer,once they've been shot however it will be harder to tell because different alloys should expand at a different rate.

[Frankly]

if I can help it

That's the key phrase for me. MOST of what's in my many buckets-o-brass has an American company's headstamp. But when you go into Cabelas and all they have is the foreign crap...

My direct experience suggests the foreign made brass is not made to the same spec as the USA made brass. It always chambers loosely. I recall a few years ago having some loaded in my conceal carry sidearm and I couldn't take two steps in public without getting looks--- those six rounds were chattering in the wheel like a hundred-year-old man's original teeth...

[andywizard]

I'm a newb. and have been reloading for around a month. I have got most of the basics down, but I can not seem to find anywhere that it clearly states how to get the "burs" (tiny metal ring) inside the primer pocket shaved down.... I'm sure there is a tool for this and i'm just not fully comprehending the purpose. Can someone please inform me.

[Frankly]

Andy,

You are ahead of me in all this. I haven't even primed a shell yet; still decapping them (got buckets full to clean yet out in the garage).

Any particular issues you've had in your short tenure that you can share?



This came with my Press. Unopened. From the majority of posts here, don't know that there's any need to open it. Maybe someone will chime in...

[stagpanther]

I'm not trying to be snarky Frank--but if you read those manuals like you say you did it should be obvious what those tools are for. Again--my advice is simply pick something easy and go by the book step by step--not skipping or "improvising" anything. Reloading in general is fairly easy--but it's also easy to screw up, and the consequences of those screw-ups can vary.

@Andy--I'm not sure what you mean by rings--are you referring to possibly crimped primer pockets (do the cases you refer to have little circles with a cross in them stamped on the rim/head face and/or any colored dye--usually an indicator of military NATO grade ammo where crimping the primer is common)?

[snuffy]

I'm a newb. and have been reloading for around a month. I have got most of the basics down, but I can not seem to find anywhere that it clearly states how to get the "burs" (tiny metal ring) inside the primer pocket shaved down.... I'm sure there is a tool for this and I'm just not fully comprehending the purpose. Can someone please inform me.

Andy, there's 2 things about primer pockets themselves, then there's the flashole that is where the flame travels through. Which of these are you asking about? The primer pocket of standard non-military brass,(commercial U.S.) should be ready to re-prime with no problem. The original poster, Frankly's question was whether to clean the primer residue from the bottom of the pocket. That's been hashed over pretty well.

If you're referring to the primer pocket of a crimped military case, the ring left after decapping is handled by various methods. There are cutter tools made by several reloading companies the only cut that ring off the very outside edge of the pocket. Then there's several more that are used in the press to "swage" or press the brass ring out of the way so a new primer can easily be inserted. Then there's another 2 bench mounted tools, one by Dillon called the super swage, the other is made by RCBS, similar to the Dillon, but about 20% cheaper. After all of that, the simplest is to use the inside chamfer tool to cut that ring away, but it leaves an ugly chamfer on the pocket edge, AND removes some of the support of the primer.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/804...ProductFinding

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/319...ProductFinding

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/235...ProductFinding

If your question is about the inside top of the flash hole, that ragged burr that's left after the flashole is drilled, there are tools that cut that away as well. It's called a flashole de-burring tool.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/729...ProductFinding

[snuffy]

I'm not trying to be snarky Frank--but if you read those manuals like you say you did it should be obvious what those tools are for.

Unless Frank is reading the reloading book by Richard lee, he wouldn't see those tools mentioned. Frank the top one is the cutter for the lee case trimmer tool. It needs the pilot that is caliber specific Like .223 or any other rifle. It will also trim handgun brass, but hardly anybody does that. The other part is the case spinner base that is used in partnership with the case trimmer. It can be hand turned but works best in a drill motor. The small tool is the blade type primer pocket cleaner. And the lee case chamfer tool.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/107...ProductFinding

[andywizard]

frankly,
I also got the lee case conditioning kit. It came with the Lee turret press kit that I am using... problems I ran into : 1.not buying recharging die, and double disk kit. They are parts used to assemble your powder measure. They obviously do not come with the kit and I racked my brain for about 10 min. trying to figure out how to assemble the powder measure on what "I thought" was the correct amount of parts.... 2. I bought CFE .223 powder with 55 gr. hornady v-max bullets. It took me a min to find the proper powder measures for this particular powder. It is fairly new and is not listed in the books. I currently run 25grains of powder behind the 55gr v-max....
Snuffy
[QUOTEIf you're referring to the primer pocket of a crimped military case, the ring left after decapping is handled by various methods. There are cutter tools made by several reloading companies the only cut that ring off the very outside edge of the pocket. Then there's several more that are used in the press to "swage" or press the brass ring out of the way so a new primer can easily be inserted. Then there's another 2 bench mounted tools, one by Dillon called the super swage, the other is made by RCBS, similar to the Dillon, but about 20% cheaper. After all of that, the simplest is to use the inside chamfer tool to cut that ring away, but it leaves an ugly chamfer on the pocket edge, AND removes some of the support of the primer.

That is exactly what I needed and im currently in the process of acquiring the Hornady Primer pocket reamer... I am reloading military surplus ammo and feel that it is diffently worth the purchase.... I sugest you do the same frankly. if you purchase once fired brass in bulk... you will most likely run across the same problem.

[Frankly]

I'm not trying to be snarky Frank--but if you read those manuals like you say you did it should be obvious what those tools are for.

And it is...

From the majority of posts here, don't know that there's any need to open it.

My point was not, "hmmm, what is this?" My point was that the aggregate wisdom of the folks who have participated in this thread suggests to me I really have no reason to even open the package...

Don't be so quick to assume people are stupid, incompetent, etc. Sometimes we're just being cheeky and you don't see the body language. I does has a college degree after alls...

[Frankly]

Snuffy,

"My bad" as the youngsters say these days. I have indeed read both the Lee and Lyman books and know what this kit is. Please see my reply to Stag for more...

The difference is in how you two processed my comment:

When we read a post and are tempted to respond, are we trying to expand the conversation or just make a "gotcha" point? We all should reflect on this from time to time... if we suspend judgment then we won't always be looking for weaknesses to exploit. Just a thought.

Your point that hardly anyone trims handgun brass, for example, expands the conversation. Yes, I have read in the Lee book how the brass becomes stretched over time. And I read about the "need" to trim it. But then I have spoken to numerous experienced reloaders who say they have never had to do so. The book is one thing. Insights from folks like you put all the book learning into practical perspective. That's why I'm here.

Another thing I've read over and over again is not to touch primers as your skin oils will contaminate them and they won't go pop. "Nonsense," according to several experienced reloaders I have queried who say they have been handling them all their lives with no such failure. So the books are a great starting point, but I hope helpful folks like you will always be around to tell us newbies where the rubber meets the road...

Your insights have been helpful to me, and I am sure other newbies stumbling into this thread will concur.

Thanks again.
Frankly.

[Frankly]

Andy,

Did you buy the "Deluxe" Lee Turret Press Kit? That's what I have. When I finally got my bench built and went to set everything up, I embarrassed myself in front of my wife. "What's this rubber thing, a catheter?" Ouch. When I figured out it was the catcher for the spent primers, she said my face turned purple...

BTW, I ordered the Lee universal decapper which has reinvented the wheel for me. Fortunately I was still on my first set of tires at the time. Anyway, I have removed the decapping pins from all my turret die sets and will be decapping my brass dirty as my first prep step from now on. Just makes sense to me. Tomatos... tomahtos...

[Frankly]

About a thousand shells of each caliber ready to go then I will dive into the fun part. Here are a thousand or so 357 magnum ready to go after using the polish and spirits approach shared by the veterans of this thread. I love how easy it makes it on these tired old eyes to inspect the shells for damage/defects. Thanks for the great advice folks!

Now on to 40 S&W...

[Frankly]

Andy, or anyone else who might be buying these. Brown just delivered more of these and thought I'd share. Cheaper than Dirt (which usually does not come out the most cost effective vendor for me) has the best prices I can find on these 100-round storage cases. Up to a certain quantity the shipping will be around 4-5 bucks, then it suddenly jumps to about three times as much. Overall cost per case is best minimized by placing separate orders of lessor quantities. I did the math so you don't have to...

[Brotherbadger]

That is exactly what I needed and im currently in the process of acquiring the Hornady Primer pocket reamer... I am reloading military surplus ammo and feel that it is diffently worth the purchase....

It is. I'd also recommend putting the reamer into a drill and using the drill to ream out the pocket. The reamer bit itself unscrews from the handle, and easily fits into a drill. It makes quick work of it and your wrists don't get tired.

[Ou81200]

I'm new to reloading and have a question. I'm reloading .223 Rem. After tumbling the cases, depriming/sizing, cleaning primer pockets, I noticed that 49 out of my first 50 cases were showing being short. My Speer manual states that they should be at 1.760". But they are all between 1.470-1.700. I only had one cartridge that was over and needed to be trimmed. I zeroed my caliper appropriately. Is this going to be a problem or can I compensate when seating the bullet. Thanks in advance.

[WVMountaineer]

Frankly, you are ready brother. Keep doing what ever you are doing. that cleaned brass looked really good and it should ease your mind to know that the crud won't make it into the died or your gun.

Change the media only when it stops cleaning good. Don't over load the tumbler and it will clean it quickly. Another alternative to the wax is a drop of Hoppe's #9 instead. It works great. If you are looking for BRIGHT Brass, Just a drop of the Hoppes per batch or the brass will get a dark hue to it. I'm assuming you used Walnut media for the tumbler. It has a dark hue to the brass. Shiny but dark. Corn will brighten the brass better than Walnut too. I say that about Hoppes and the Media just FYI. There is ZERO wrong with what you have done so far. It looks great.

You are behind right now but, if you will work all the brass up to the primer pockets being cleaned, in the future you can keep up as you fire the brass. Little extra time is all it takes currently. After that, it won;t be noticed. It will be for you to decide if cleaning the PP is necessary. However, if you are priming with a hand primer, I'd say you'll see the benefits real quick. If you decide to clean the PP, let the tumbler do the work in getting most of the PP clean on your long tumble after sizing and depriming step.

You are doing great. You got a lot of conflicting info depending on how some approach cleaning their brass. In time, you'll develop your own methods. Just keep at it and enjoy. God Bless