Crossbow vs. Birdfeeder Rat

bird_dog · September 12, 2014, 08:28 AM

I live in NY state. Crossbows just became legalized here for specific seasons. I was always an archer, but never had interest in a crossbow since they weren't legal for hunting. Back and shoulder issues have lowered my enjoyment of bow shooting, so I bit the bullet and picked up a Barnett Jackal crossbow.

In just a few minutes, I had the red dot scope sighted in for 20. Within an hour, I was hitting at 45 yards with dead-on accuracy. I've been itching to get out small-game hunting with it, but haven't had the chance yet.

My house is near a creek, and a runway for all kinds of critters. The other night, my wife spotted a rat at the bird feeder. I went out the door, snuck around the house, and let the rat have it at 14 yards.

First kill of the year, such as it is. Can't wait to get out for some squirrels this weekend!

Doyle · September 12, 2014, 09:08 AM

Congrats on your purchase. This will be my 2nd season with a crossbow. It looks like that arrow doesn't have a tip on it. Please tell me you haven't been firing the bow with arrows lacking tips.

bird_dog · September 12, 2014, 09:36 AM

Hey Doyle....no....I've been at the archery game for a long time, but thanks for the concern.

The field tip remains embedded in a very large maple tree, to which the rat was pinned. I have photos of that, too, if you're interested. I knew I'd be sacrificing the bolt, and didn't mind it to be rid of a rat.

Due to the penetration into the tree trunk, I had to snap the tip off in order to remove it.

Doyle · September 12, 2014, 10:07 AM

I think I would have pulled out one of my wood chisels and dug the arrow out of the tree. Holes in trees grow back. Broken arrows don't.

Jack O'Conner · September 12, 2014, 11:59 AM

I've been hunting with a crossbow for many years, ever since an accident fractured my elbow badly. The modern crossbow is super accurate and quite fast which is a deadly combination in the deer woods. More brands to choose from than ever before but I still hunt with my older Hunt Master. This company changed it's name to Ten Point after a litigation issue.

This Maryland buck never knew what hit him!

Jack

Brian Pfleuger · September 12, 2014, 12:54 PM

Those arrows are WAY too expensive for me to use them on rodents.

There ain't a rat in the world worth me spending $10 on.

stephen426 · September 12, 2014, 01:07 PM

Yeah... Shooting rats with a crossbow seems like a waste of a good arrow. Nice shot though. I would use a air gun instead. Some of the new ones that have Nitro Pistons in them really pack a punch without making too much noise. If you get the .22 or .25 calibers, they will take out squirrels easily too.

Doyle · September 12, 2014, 01:09 PM

Quote:

If you get the .22 or .25 calibers, they will take out squirrels easily too

Back in the '70s, I took out a boatload of squirrels with my Crossman .177 pump. I can't even imagine what I could do with the more powerful ones available today.

buck460XVR · September 12, 2014, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brian Pfleuger;

Those arrows are WAY too expensive for me to use them on rodents. There ain't a rat in the world worth me spending $10 on.

^^^Same here. Just too many other options for me. Besides, if you see one rat....you got twenty. I'd invest in some rat poison Bird Dog.

Panfisher · September 12, 2014, 03:10 PM

Take that you dirty Rat!! Nice shooting. Whom among us has not shot at something similar, squirrel etc. and not considered until afterward that Hmmm that arrow is really gonna be hard to get out of that tree? Blunts and judo point work well too.

Brian Pfleuger · September 12, 2014, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Panfisher

Whom among us has not shot at something similar, squirrel etc. and not considered until afterward that Hmmm that arrow is really gonna be hard to get out of that tree?

The cost of the arrow is the only thing that's kept me from shooting untold numbers of obnoxious squirrels during deer season. Only twice have I given in, despite the cost.

Once because I was so sick of the squirrel that I didn't care, that arrow still (AFAIK) resides high enough in the tree you'd need a ladder to get it... might still have a squirrel skeleton hanging off it.

The other time, it was on the ground and I was in a tree so I knew I'd get my arrow back and I have a near life-time supply of replacement blades for that particular broadhead.

Panfisher · September 12, 2014, 07:18 PM

In northern Missouri there is a tree with an offset truck about 6 feet off the ground, which was hollow. After a weekend of abysmal shooting on my part, missed 1 deer (twice) and a turkey, this big old red squirrel came out and was prancing around on the ground. I had an arrow with a field point and one of those star things that goes on behind it to fling at squirrels and such. OK Mr. Squirrell I bet I can make you run, twang - WHACK right square in the middle, I do the I got you little no good blankety blank dance in my stand, high fiving the air, fist pumping, you would have thought I had killed a P&Y buck. I look over at my trophy only to see it struggling to its feet, climb up the trunk and go down into the hole, I could hear the aluminum arrow shaft rattling around. OK so he got the last laugh, but at least he won't be coming back right. WRONG about 10 minutes or so later out of the hole come a red squirrell with a big red spot on his side, moving a little wobbly but making good time, and runs off down the creek. To this day I think the squirrels along that creek laugh at me as I go through the area.

Brotherbadger · September 13, 2014, 02:57 AM

I have really come to love crossbows over the past few months(just legalized for those under 65 here as well). They are just a joy to shoot. Nice shot on that rat, I'm sure he had it coming.

BumbleBug · September 13, 2014, 07:26 AM

I'm an old archer from way back, but I faded out of the sport. I just rifle hunt now. I understand the cost concern, as I remember thinking $$$ when I released one of my broadhead tipped aluminum arrows. But just like reloading, can't you make "bolts"? Seems like those shorty arrows could be made cheap enough for regular rat shooting. Just thinking out loud.

Nice shot on the rat - keep it up!! LOL

...bug

Brian Pfleuger · September 13, 2014, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BumbleBug

But just like reloading, can't you make "bolts"?

Almost no one has the tooling and skills necessary to make modern arrows.

You can make wooden arrows and lots of folks do but there's no way a wooden arrow holds up to the acceleration of a modern bow or xbow.

I suppose if you could buy the appropriately sized aluminium tube you could cut your own arrows from it. No one (well, hardly anyone) uses aluminium anymore though. Same with the carbon tube. If you can buy it, you could cut your own arrows. I doubt it would be cost effective but maybe. You can certainly buy all the necessary inserts and vanes. Some folks make their own vanes (fletchings).

psalm7 · September 13, 2014, 11:36 AM

I think it was worth the arrow , that's got my vote as kill of the week .

buck460XVR · September 13, 2014, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Almost no one has the tooling and skills necessary to make modern arrows.

For several decades I've made my own arrows by buying bare shafts(wood, aluminum and carbon), cutting them to length, attaching nocks and inserts/tips and fletching them. Even have an old Herter's jig for cresting wood arrows. Pretty simple with the right tools. I also used to repair arrows for a local sporting goods store. No different than buying reloading components and rolling your own ammo. I intend to do the same with cross-bow bolts, but understand it requires the use of a different jig.

Brian Pfleuger · September 13, 2014, 02:41 PM

Yes, as I said, you can buy the pieces and put them together. It's rarely cheaper, in fact they often cost more than buying them finished, and they're not really better either. Very often, the bare shafts cost as much as the finished arrow.

The only reason you'd need a different jig is if it doesn't accept the shaft size for your xbow arrows.

buck460XVR · September 13, 2014, 04:09 PM

Brian, I have a bunch of 2219 shafts left over from years of using them with a standard compound bow. Some have damaged fletching or splits on the insert end from shooting into something. Some are odd and ends left over from when I did another new batch and just put the old ones away. All I need to do is cut them down to 20'' from 31'', put nocks and inserts in them and refletch. I probably would have enough to last me till I die....for nuttin'. 'ell, I probably got enough 4'' feathers to do the same layin' around as I used to buy them in bulk when doing the arrow repair. I was under the impression that the profile of the fletching was different for crossbows than bows so my old fletching jig would not work.....maybe I'm mistaken? My jig is adjustable for shaft size and feather/vane angle.

As for not being any better, I dunno. Kind like saying reloads are no better than factory either. Nice thing about fletching your own is when you shoot off a feather/vane when target practicing, you can make it new again for just the cost of one feather/vane and a little cement. Once you find a combo that works well for you, you can continue to make that combo for years to come with little or no variance. It's also kinda nice to take an animal with something you made yourself. Like reloading, you don't really save anything, just get to shoot more for the same price.

Art Eatman · September 13, 2014, 04:41 PM

Summer of '48 I went on an Indian kick. I cut and shaped pieces of barrel hoop for points. Nylon thread and airplane glue and store-bought bow string. Everything else came from the farm. Turkey wing feathers, heart cedar...

After many mess-ups and false starts in the learning curve, it all came together pretty well. A fox, two jackrabbits, a rattlesnake and one poor little nubbin buck.

So: At my level of ignorance about crossbows, why wouldn't a home-made dart of, say, 3/16" welding rod work for "rat shots" and such?

Brian Pfleuger · September 13, 2014, 06:21 PM

Quote:

I was under the impression that the profile of the fletching was different for crossbows than bows so my old fletching jig would not work.....

Maybe for some xbows but every arrow I've ever bought for mine use the same 2" Blazers that all my regular arrows use.

bird_dog · September 14, 2014, 04:09 AM

To the posters, first it was a cheap bolt -- 4 bucks.

As for the rats, we had a family move into the space below our chicken coop. 4 were killed in plain old rat traps. This one managed to evade the traps and one night wandered out to the bird feeder, which happens to be exactly 14 yards from my shooting bench, and I happened to have the crossbow handy.

Since that rat-fateful day, no more rats. Again, to me, it was well worth the 4 bucks.

Art Eatman · September 14, 2014, 08:50 AM

And more satisfaction than from a four-dollar highball at the local cabaret.

buck460XVR · September 14, 2014, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Maybe for some xbows but every arrow I've ever bought for mine use the same 2" Blazers that all my regular arrows use.

While I know they use similar feathers/vanes, I was under the impression the the position on the shaft was different so the feathers did not drag on the rail. Further inquiry to the manufacturer of my jig tells me all I need is a crossbow bolt adapter.

This is the fletching jig I have used for 30 years......

Brian Pfleuger · September 14, 2014, 11:09 AM

Ah. Nope, they're all at 120dg for 3 or 90dg for 4.

That's a sweet jig. I thought about buying one but I just don't need it enough. Plus, now I've tried shrink wraps and they're so much easier. Plus plus, as soon as xbows are legal for all of archery I won't have a regular bow.

September 12, 2014, 08:28 AM	#1
bird_dog Senior Member Join Date: May 26, 2004 Posts: 225	Crossbow vs. Birdfeeder Rat I live in NY state. Crossbows just became legalized here for specific seasons. I was always an archer, but never had interest in a crossbow since they weren't legal for hunting. Back and shoulder issues have lowered my enjoyment of bow shooting, so I bit the bullet and picked up a Barnett Jackal crossbow. In just a few minutes, I had the red dot scope sighted in for 20. Within an hour, I was hitting at 45 yards with dead-on accuracy. I've been itching to get out small-game hunting with it, but haven't had the chance yet. My house is near a creek, and a runway for all kinds of critters. The other night, my wife spotted a rat at the bird feeder. I went out the door, snuck around the house, and let the rat have it at 14 yards. First kill of the year, such as it is. Can't wait to get out for some squirrels this weekend! Last edited by bird_dog; September 12, 2014 at 08:33 AM.

September 12, 2014, 09:36 AM	#3
bird_dog Senior Member Join Date: May 26, 2004 Posts: 225	Hey Doyle....no....I've been at the archery game for a long time, but thanks for the concern. The field tip remains embedded in a very large maple tree, to which the rat was pinned. I have photos of that, too, if you're interested. I knew I'd be sacrificing the bolt, and didn't mind it to be rid of a rat. Due to the penetration into the tree trunk, I had to snap the tip off in order to remove it. Last edited by bird_dog; September 12, 2014 at 09:42 AM.

September 12, 2014, 11:59 AM	#5
Jack O'Conner Senior Member Join Date: July 11, 2005 Location: Manatee County, Florida Posts: 1,976	I've been hunting with a crossbow for many years, ever since an accident fractured my elbow badly. The modern crossbow is super accurate and quite fast which is a deadly combination in the deer woods. More brands to choose from than ever before but I still hunt with my older Hunt Master. This company changed it's name to Ten Point after a litigation issue. This Maryland buck never knew what hit him! Jack __________________ Fire up the grill! Deer hunting IS NOT catch and release. Last edited by Jack O'Conner; September 12, 2014 at 12:08 PM.

September 12, 2014, 12:54 PM	#6
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Those arrows are WAY too expensive for me to use them on rodents. There ain't a rat in the world worth me spending $10 on. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

September 12, 2014, 01:07 PM	#7
stephen426 Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2005 Posts: 3,840	Yeah... Shooting rats with a crossbow seems like a waste of a good arrow. Nice shot though. I would use a air gun instead. Some of the new ones that have Nitro Pistons in them really pack a punch without making too much noise. If you get the .22 or .25 calibers, they will take out squirrels easily too. __________________ The ATF should be a convenience store instead of a government agency!

September 12, 2014, 09:08 AM	#2
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	Congrats on your purchase. This will be my 2nd season with a crossbow. It looks like that arrow doesn't have a tip on it. Please tell me you haven't been firing the bow with arrows lacking tips.

September 12, 2014, 10:07 AM	#4
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	I think I would have pulled out one of my wood chisels and dug the arrow out of the tree. Holes in trees grow back. Broken arrows don't.

September 12, 2014, 03:10 PM	#10
Panfisher Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2010 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,337	Take that you dirty Rat!! Nice shooting. Whom among us has not shot at something similar, squirrel etc. and not considered until afterward that Hmmm that arrow is really gonna be hard to get out of that tree? Blunts and judo point work well too.

September 12, 2014, 07:18 PM	#12
Panfisher Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2010 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,337	In northern Missouri there is a tree with an offset truck about 6 feet off the ground, which was hollow. After a weekend of abysmal shooting on my part, missed 1 deer (twice) and a turkey, this big old red squirrel came out and was prancing around on the ground. I had an arrow with a field point and one of those star things that goes on behind it to fling at squirrels and such. OK Mr. Squirrell I bet I can make you run, twang - WHACK right square in the middle, I do the I got you little no good blankety blank dance in my stand, high fiving the air, fist pumping, you would have thought I had killed a P&Y buck. I look over at my trophy only to see it struggling to its feet, climb up the trunk and go down into the hole, I could hear the aluminum arrow shaft rattling around. OK so he got the last laugh, but at least he won't be coming back right. WRONG about 10 minutes or so later out of the hole come a red squirrell with a big red spot on his side, moving a little wobbly but making good time, and runs off down the creek. To this day I think the squirrels along that creek laugh at me as I go through the area.

September 13, 2014, 02:57 AM	#13
Brotherbadger Senior Member Join Date: November 10, 2010 Posts: 1,149	I have really come to love crossbows over the past few months(just legalized for those under 65 here as well). They are just a joy to shoot. Nice shot on that rat, I'm sure he had it coming. __________________ Once Fired Brass, Top quality, Fast shipping, Best prices. http://300AacBrass.com/ -10% Coupon use code " badger "

September 13, 2014, 07:26 AM	#14
BumbleBug Senior Member Join Date: March 11, 2013 Location: Near Heart of Texas Posts: 870	I'm an old archer from way back, but I faded out of the sport. I just rifle hunt now. I understand the cost concern, as I remember thinking $$$ when I released one of my broadhead tipped aluminum arrows. But just like reloading, can't you make "bolts"? Seems like those shorty arrows could be made cheap enough for regular rat shooting. Just thinking out loud. Nice shot on the rat - keep it up!! LOL ...bug

September 13, 2014, 11:36 AM	#16
psalm7 Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2014 Location: Middle TN Posts: 543	I think it was worth the arrow , that's got my vote as kill of the week .

September 13, 2014, 02:41 PM	#18
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Yes, as I said, you can buy the pieces and put them together. It's rarely cheaper, in fact they often cost more than buying them finished, and they're not really better either. Very often, the bare shafts cost as much as the finished arrow. The only reason you'd need a different jig is if it doesn't accept the shaft size for your xbow arrows. __________________ Nobody plans to screw up their lives... ...they just don't plan not to. -Andy Stanley

September 13, 2014, 04:09 PM	#19
buck460XVR Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 2006 Posts: 4,342	Brian, I have a bunch of 2219 shafts left over from years of using them with a standard compound bow. Some have damaged fletching or splits on the insert end from shooting into something. Some are odd and ends left over from when I did another new batch and just put the old ones away. All I need to do is cut them down to 20'' from 31'', put nocks and inserts in them and refletch. I probably would have enough to last me till I die....for nuttin'. 'ell, I probably got enough 4'' feathers to do the same layin' around as I used to buy them in bulk when doing the arrow repair. I was under the impression that the profile of the fletching was different for crossbows than bows so my old fletching jig would not work.....maybe I'm mistaken? My jig is adjustable for shaft size and feather/vane angle. As for not being any better, I dunno. Kind like saying reloads are no better than factory either. Nice thing about fletching your own is when you shoot off a feather/vane when target practicing, you can make it new again for just the cost of one feather/vane and a little cement. Once you find a combo that works well for you, you can continue to make that combo for years to come with little or no variance. It's also kinda nice to take an animal with something you made yourself. Like reloading, you don't really save anything, just get to shoot more for the same price.

September 13, 2014, 04:41 PM	#20
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	Summer of '48 I went on an Indian kick. I cut and shaped pieces of barrel hoop for points. Nylon thread and airplane glue and store-bought bow string. Everything else came from the farm. Turkey wing feathers, heart cedar... After many mess-ups and false starts in the learning curve, it all came together pretty well. A fox, two jackrabbits, a rattlesnake and one poor little nubbin buck. So: At my level of ignorance about crossbows, why wouldn't a home-made dart of, say, 3/16" welding rod work for "rat shots" and such?

September 14, 2014, 04:09 AM	#22
bird_dog Senior Member Join Date: May 26, 2004 Posts: 225	To the posters, first it was a cheap bolt -- 4 bucks. As for the rats, we had a family move into the space below our chicken coop. 4 were killed in plain old rat traps. This one managed to evade the traps and one night wandered out to the bird feeder, which happens to be exactly 14 yards from my shooting bench, and I happened to have the crossbow handy. Since that rat-fateful day, no more rats. Again, to me, it was well worth the 4 bucks.

September 14, 2014, 08:50 AM	#23
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	And more satisfaction than from a four-dollar highball at the local cabaret.

September 14, 2014, 11:09 AM	#25
Brian Pfleuger Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 25, 2008 Location: Austin, CO Posts: 19,578	Crossbow vs. Birdfeeder Rat Ah. Nope, they're all at 120dg for 3 or 90dg for 4. That's a sweet jig. I thought about buying one but I just don't need it enough. Plus, now I've tried shrink wraps and they're so much easier. Plus plus, as soon as xbows are legal for all of archery I won't have a regular bow.

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