Technical question about bumpfire systems

[Rangerrich99]

This is a technical question concerning bump/slide fire systems. Isn't it true that to operate these systems you must essentially push forward on the forearm while simultaneously pulling back on the trigger to get it to function?

[SC4006]

On the models ive seen, your trigger finger will remain stationary. The forward pressure of your support hand will move the gun and trigger forward into your stationary trigger finger.

[MarkCO]

It takes a few tries to make it work on most standard ARs. With a Mil-spec trigger it does need a little float, but I would not say push forward. With an aftermarket match trigger, it is actually pretty easy. DD rifles can have a few different triggers in them FWIW. They utilize a shelf next to the trigger that is integral to the stock and then the rest of the gun moves back and forth in that stock. Has to be shouldered pretty tight with the strong hand and loose with the support hand, almost opposite of what a skilled shooter would naturally do.

I have one AR that I can bump fire that has a standard stock, but a pretty light trigger with a short reset. I imagine if that a bumpfire style stock on that would be pretty easy to get the hang of. With something like a 22/45, holding with one hand and the trigger pressed into the finger of the other hand while not otherwise touching the gun, also pretty easy. I was shown that when I was maybe 15 years old.

[JoeSixpack]

Pretty much yes, there was a ruger 10/22 bump stock called the Atkins Accelerator.

At first it got ATF approval but later was revoked, It had a spring in the stock and the ATF tried tracking them down telling people to send the springs in.

Then the slide fire stock came out no spring.. you have to push forward.. YOU are the spring.

[TXAZ]

On many rifles you can bump fire without an attachment if you have the right touch.

Some AK's in particular (and other rifles in general) will bump fire if you softly held the weapon against your shoulder (hold it to where the butt is just touching your shoulder but not pulled in hard) then stiffen your finger in your hand and slowly pull your hand back, trying to keep your finger from moving relative to your hand. The gun will move back on the recoil releasing the trigger, as the resiliency in your shoulder will push it back forward into your stiff finger causing it to fire again.

It's not the 'full auto' rate, but it's faster than you can pull the trigger.

So what some clever mechanically inclined person did was to replicate a soft shoulder and a stiff finger for $200+ so you can make the ammo manufacturers happy by wasting more ammo than you ever thought possible.

[stagpanther]

On many rifles you can bump fire without an attachment if you have the right touch.

Or wrong touch. I've unintentionally ripped through a mag or two with a "limp grip."

[Nanuk]

I have a couple problems with bump fire. After a career in LE/Military I have shot a lot of automatic weapons, was a M-60 gunner in the Army. It is very fun to shoot machine guns, I cannot afford the ammo like I could when Uncle Sam gave it to me and would soon be broke. It is so much more accurate to fire semi auto. Now a properly set up gun in a mount or tripod is a different matter.

[ligonierbill]

I had been pretty much ignoring "bump fire" stocks until now. I watched one of the dozens of videos online, basically an ad for one company's version. The guy demonstrated single round, double, and what can only be called full auto to show how controllable it was. Impressive.

For years, we have been fighting the image of the AR-15 as an assault rifle, pointing out that an assault rifle in its true form is a select fire weapon. The AR is not, it cannot easily be converted. It is not a machine gun. Go watch one of the videos, or just wait for it on 60 Minutes, and tell me we can still make that argument with a straight face. One of the comments to the video I watched was "It will be legal until someone uses one in a mass shooting."

Guys, if you use, own, like, make or sell bump fire stocks for ARs, I can only say, "Repent!" Or watch the anti-gun crowd start picking off more states. And the SCOTUS? Fuhgetaboutit.

[stagpanther]

Given recent events--I wouldn't be buying any such devices any time soon. Anyone who knows their way around fire control groups can fairly easily figure this out for themselves anyway. I wouldn't do it unless you want to risk an all-expenses paid one way ticket to the big house--or worse.

[TrueBlue711]

I own one for my AK. Like already mentioned, yes, you just hold the stock like a normal AR/AK rifle and rest your trigger finger on the block next to the trigger. Push forward with the non-firing hand and that combined with the recoil creates a very fast firing gun. Not as fast as an actual full auto, but I can go through a 30-round mag in about 2-3 seconds. Very fun, but not friendly on ammo budget.

I wouldn't do it unless you want to risk an all-expenses paid one way ticket to the big house--or worse.

Until bills/laws are passed and ATF deems the bumpstock illegal like the Atkins on the 10/22, it is still legal to buy/own a bumpstock. Buying one now will not earn you a knock on the door by big brother down the road.

[carguychris]

Do bumpfire stocks normally have serial numbers or other individual identifying marks?

(Yes, I'm asking due to conjecture that these may wind up becoming NFA items.)

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Originally Posted by jag2

If they simply said you can not alter the weapon to make it shoot faster than when it left the factory. Doesn’t that kind of cover it?

Just for the AR15, you've now dragged ATF into making rulings on buffers, bolt carriers, adjustable gas ports and anything else that effects the cyclic rate (such as gas port erosion that happens via use). Not to mention rulings on lighter triggers or shorter trigger resets, etc.

As much as ATF can annoy, drafting rulings is harder than it looks and often has a lot of unintended consequences.

[TrueBlue711]

Do bumpfire stocks normally have serial numbers or other individual identifying marks?

Mine does not. Unless that has changed in the past 4 years (that's when I bought mine), they are un-serialized parts just like a normal buttstock or handguard.

[JoeSixpack]

Until bills/laws are passed and ATF deems the bumpstock illegal like the Atkins on the 10/22, it is still legal to buy/own a bumpstock. Buying one now will not earn you a knock on the door by big brother down the road.

Maybe.. Didn't the ATF also try to contact people via sells records on the Atkins?
I remember they wanted the spring out of the stocks sent in to them.

I never bought a bump stock like the slide fire for 3 reasons

1# Can't afford the ammo
2# It seems like accuracy would suffer to much even from a full auto perspective.. the gun is moving in your hand in order to accomplish this.
3# I just assume the ATF would reverse course and repeal their approval.. it took a few years for the atkins.

I do agree this is the only sort of ban I see being able to move thru at the federal level.. I suspect some states will ban them though.

A lot of people see bump stocks as worthless and we shouldn't defend them, I agree they are a nitch item, crude.. But I don't see why we should forfeit.

[Evan Thomas]

I've edited or deleted several posts.

The subject of this thread is "Technical question about bumpfire systems." If your comment is not directly relevant to this -- don't post it. Notice will be taken and consequences will follow.

[thallub]

How the Slide Fire Bump Fire stock works:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...il&FORM=VIREHT

i have one of these. My technique does not match that of the Las Vegas shooter. Mine has a malfunction every 10-30 rounds.

[ThomasT]

I have never wanted one of these and still don’t but I looked on the Bump Fire site and it says there are not taking anymore orders because of high demand.

Once again thanks to media hype a gizmo most would never consider buying is selling like hot cakes. Good thing there are lots of YouTube videos showing how to make your own or how to shoot without an added stock.

[noelf2]

Pretty much yes, there was a ruger 10/22 bump stock called the Atkins Accelerator

It was the Akins Accelerator, and was invented by Bill Akins, who frequents this forum. Bill pretty much invented the bump stock.