W-W 452AA for .45ACP?

tawakoni · November 22, 2000, 09:59 PM

Happy Thanksgiving, y'all. I have been READING the posts in this Forum on a daily basis for several months but never registered until today because of an "email restriction". Now I have an urgent question for this learned group.

I have been loading about 35,000 .45ACPs per year for the past eleven years, moving up from a single-stage RCBS to a Dillon SDB and a RL550B. I still use all three. (I have used the RCBS for nearly 40 years). My usual load is 4.6gr of W231 for the 200gr LSWC and 4.5gr of W231 for the 230gr LRN.

I have a 10lb keg of W452AA that has not been opened and another that is about half-full. This powder is about 15 years old but has been stored in a temperature-controlled bunker during that time. The opened keg shows no deterioration at all. Naturally, I would really like to use this stuff. So here (finally) is the question(s):

Can I use it? What loads would be equal to the W231 I have been using for so long? I plan to exceed 50,000 rounds in the coming year.

[Edited by tawakoni on 11-28-2000 at 01:00 AM]

LIProgun · November 27, 2000, 10:56 AM

15 pounds of WW452AA? You lucky guy! Great stuff. You should have no problem using the powder you have on hand, if it was stored as you described. (And if you don't want to chance it, send it to me. I'll pay shipping.

)

I used 452AA for years, until I ran out and local supplies dried up.

I used to use 5.6 grains 452AA with a 200 grain hard cast LSWC and a Fed 150 primer in commercial Federal brass. This chronographed at an average of 859 fps from a Colt Commander (4.25") barrel. Standard deviation (velocity) of these loads was a quite low 7.6, meaning they were pretty darn consistent.

Your 200 grain W-231 load is a considerably lighter load, so you may want to back off to something like 4.5 grains of 452AA to start.

tawakoni · November 28, 2000, 12:58 AM

LIProgun, I am very greatful for your superb reply to my post. You answered many questions I had and gave me a lot of confidence. Now I have a couple of loads to test at my weekly shoot on Thursday. I will post the results on Friday.

WIL TERRY · November 28, 2000, 06:31 PM

452AA IS PERHAPS THE FINEST ALL AROUND PISTOL POWDER FOR LEAD BULLET HANDLOADS AT STANDARD VELOCITIES I EVER TESTED. TRIED IT IN EVERYTHING FROM 32LONG TO 45COLT AND EVERY STOP IN BETWEEN, AND I DO MEAN ALL OF THEM.
I'D GIVE MY RIGHT ONE FOR THAT KEG OF 452AA. I'M DOWN TO 10 POUNDS OR SO.
WHOOPS, FORGOT TO TURN OFF THE CAPS. WE INPUT ALL DATA IN CAPS HERE AT THE PLANT AND I FORGET THEY'RE ON...
first mistake this year, guys. TM

tawakoni · December 2, 2000, 12:55 AM

Well guys, I promised to post the results of my first test of 452AA today. Unfortunately, as I was just getting started on the loading Wednesday morning, the shell plate bolt on my Dillon broke along with the ejector wire. I called the good folks at Dillon about noon and after some discussion, they said I would have the necessary parts plus extras in a week. This surprised me because the longest I have waited for a shipment from them was 5 days and that was wrapped around a Holiday weekend. These people are amazing. The parts arrived today (Friday). If all goes well I will be back in production late tomorrow or Sunday. Since the Dillon is pretty much disassembled, I will take this opportunity to give it a major cleaning and inspection. So now you know how I am going to spend MY weekend.

BillOH · December 2, 2000, 12:18 PM

If I remember correctly from loading 452AA in years past for IPSC, the velocity goes DOWN as the temperature goes up. That is the opposite of most powders. I think that is the main reason people stopped using it in competition. On a very hot day or if your ammo was left out in the sun you wouldn't make power factor. If you are going to shoot this ammo where it will be chronographed you can load accordingly. It is an accurate powder. Good luck
BillOH

tawakoni · December 8, 2000, 01:48 AM

I promised to post my test results and I just got back from the range, so here it is:

4.5gr 452AA, 200gr hard cast LSWC
4.3gr 452AA, 230gr hard cast LRN

The first load is mild but very accurate, like my W231 load. Thanks LIProgun.

The second load has a little more 'POP' but is still in the midrange category. Also very accurate.

I had a hard time deciding which gun to use for the test. At the last minute I chose a LW Commander. It shoots real good and is my latest acquisition.

I will chronograph both loads next time I shoot outdoors. There was no trace of leading and no problems in 50 rounds. I think it will be a sad day for me when I use the last grain of this stuff. My Dillon loves it.

This was fun. I haven't tried a new .45ACP load in many years. Many thanks to LIProgun, Terry Murbach and BillOH.

November 28, 2000, 12:58 AM	#3
tawakoni Member Join Date: November 22, 2000 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 68	WW452AA LIProgun, I am very greatful for your superb reply to my post. You answered many questions I had and gave me a lot of confidence. Now I have a couple of loads to test at my weekly shoot on Thursday. I will post the results on Friday.

November 28, 2000, 06:31 PM	#4
WIL TERRY Senior Member Join Date: July 6, 2000 Location: BLACK HILLS Posts: 1,322	WW452AA IS ONE FINE PISTOL PROPELLENT 452AA IS PERHAPS THE FINEST ALL AROUND PISTOL POWDER FOR LEAD BULLET HANDLOADS AT STANDARD VELOCITIES I EVER TESTED. TRIED IT IN EVERYTHING FROM 32LONG TO 45COLT AND EVERY STOP IN BETWEEN, AND I DO MEAN ALL OF THEM. I'D GIVE MY RIGHT ONE FOR THAT KEG OF 452AA. I'M DOWN TO 10 POUNDS OR SO. WHOOPS, FORGOT TO TURN OFF THE CAPS. WE INPUT ALL DATA IN CAPS HERE AT THE PLANT AND I FORGET THEY'RE ON... first mistake this year, guys. TM

December 2, 2000, 12:55 AM	#5
tawakoni Member Join Date: November 22, 2000 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 68	WW452AA Well guys, I promised to post the results of my first test of 452AA today. Unfortunately, as I was just getting started on the loading Wednesday morning, the shell plate bolt on my Dillon broke along with the ejector wire. I called the good folks at Dillon about noon and after some discussion, they said I would have the necessary parts plus extras in a week. This surprised me because the longest I have waited for a shipment from them was 5 days and that was wrapped around a Holiday weekend. These people are amazing. The parts arrived today (Friday). If all goes well I will be back in production late tomorrow or Sunday. Since the Dillon is pretty much disassembled, I will take this opportunity to give it a major cleaning and inspection. So now you know how I am going to spend MY weekend.

December 8, 2000, 01:48 AM	#7
tawakoni Member Join Date: November 22, 2000 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 68	W452AA I promised to post my test results and I just got back from the range, so here it is: 4.5gr 452AA, 200gr hard cast LSWC 4.3gr 452AA, 230gr hard cast LRN The first load is mild but very accurate, like my W231 load. Thanks LIProgun. The second load has a little more 'POP' but is still in the midrange category. Also very accurate. I had a hard time deciding which gun to use for the test. At the last minute I chose a LW Commander. It shoots real good and is my latest acquisition. I will chronograph both loads next time I shoot outdoors. There was no trace of leading and no problems in 50 rounds. I think it will be a sad day for me when I use the last grain of this stuff. My Dillon loves it. This was fun. I haven't tried a new .45ACP load in many years. Many thanks to LIProgun, Terry Murbach and BillOH.

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November 22, 2000, 09:59 PM	#1
tawakoni Member Join Date: November 22, 2000 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 68	Happy Thanksgiving, y'all. I have been READING the posts in this Forum on a daily basis for several months but never registered until today because of an "email restriction". Now I have an urgent question for this learned group. I have been loading about 35,000 .45ACPs per year for the past eleven years, moving up from a single-stage RCBS to a Dillon SDB and a RL550B. I still use all three. (I have used the RCBS for nearly 40 years). My usual load is 4.6gr of W231 for the 200gr LSWC and 4.5gr of W231 for the 230gr LRN. I have a 10lb keg of W452AA that has not been opened and another that is about half-full. This powder is about 15 years old but has been stored in a temperature-controlled bunker during that time. The opened keg shows no deterioration at all. Naturally, I would really like to use this stuff. So here (finally) is the question(s): Can I use it? What loads would be equal to the W231 I have been using for so long? I plan to exceed 50,000 rounds in the coming year. [Edited by tawakoni on 11-28-2000 at 01:00 AM]

November 27, 2000, 10:56 AM	#2
LIProgun Senior Member Join Date: August 27, 2000 Location: Hudson Valley, NY Posts: 489	15 pounds of WW452AA? You lucky guy! Great stuff. You should have no problem using the powder you have on hand, if it was stored as you described. (And if you don't want to chance it, send it to me. I'll pay shipping. ) I used 452AA for years, until I ran out and local supplies dried up. I used to use 5.6 grains 452AA with a 200 grain hard cast LSWC and a Fed 150 primer in commercial Federal brass. This chronographed at an average of 859 fps from a Colt Commander (4.25") barrel. Standard deviation (velocity) of these loads was a quite low 7.6, meaning they were pretty darn consistent. Your 200 grain W-231 load is a considerably lighter load, so you may want to back off to something like 4.5 grains of 452AA to start.

December 2, 2000, 12:18 PM	#6
BillOH Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: OHIO Posts: 77	If I remember correctly from loading 452AA in years past for IPSC, the velocity goes DOWN as the temperature goes up. That is the opposite of most powders. I think that is the main reason people stopped using it in competition. On a very hot day or if your ammo was left out in the sun you wouldn't make power factor. If you are going to shoot this ammo where it will be chronographed you can load accordingly. It is an accurate powder. Good luck BillOH