Jan 6th Protests in DC and the Gun Ban - Page 2

roscoe · January 7, 2021, 01:50 AM

I didn't see any sign that the pro-Trump looters had firearms - some seemed to have sticks. Apparently a long gun was found on the Capitol grounds. The woman that died seems to have been shot by law enforcement inside the Capitol.

All things being equal, the police showed a lot of restraint, considering the US Capitol was stormed by force - the first time since 1814. In slightly different circumstances, there would have been a lot of dead bodies.

shurshot · January 7, 2021, 06:28 AM

"We'll have to see what results, of course, one side is already almost foaming at the mouth and no doubt will push as hard as they can while the outrage is fresh."(44AMP)

ALL of us should be upset over what happened. This goes beyond politics. It was insurrection. Imagine if that was ANTIFA or BLM members who had breached and violated our Congressional halls... who would "foam at the mouth" then?

We ALL should foam at the mouth... especially those of us who belong to the supposed party of Law and Order.

We are a nation of LAWS. We are better than this.

Brit · January 7, 2021, 06:47 AM

Both NY City and Washington DC are not places I am about to go, anytime soon!
Because I can not carry my Glock 19. And looking at the riotous behaviour practised by these people, not being armed would make no sense. So never going there, made lots of sense, to me.

A good place to live, this Florida.

SIGSHR · January 7, 2021, 07:52 AM

The protestors showed a lot of restraint. Look at Minneapolis, Chicago, Portland.....

roscoe · January 7, 2021, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIGSHR

The protestors showed a lot of restraint. Look at Minneapolis, Chicago, Portland.....

You mean by smashing in the windows of the US Capitol and charging into the building as a mob?

Don P · January 7, 2021, 10:34 AM

Quote:

While I am not familiar with the specifics of DC law, I believe that carry is very restricted. What the Heller decision did was end DC complete prohibition on handguns, not much else in terms of regulation and carry.

I shoot with a friend, retired law enforcement. He has stated that even with LEOSA he has to abide by state laws for carry, ie: New York City, MA. He has told me he is better off with his concealment permit over the LEOSA and we live in Florida.
He also stated he would never even think of carrying in New England because of their gun laws

Mainah · January 7, 2021, 11:52 AM

Quote:

He also stated he would never even think of carrying in New England because of their gun laws

VT, NH, and ME have pretty good gun laws.

Quote:

The protestors showed a lot of restraint. Look at Minneapolis, Chicago, Portland.....

There's no difference between what happened in D.C. yesterday and what happened in those cities last summer. Rioting is rioting, no matter who does it.

Don P · January 7, 2021, 11:55 AM

Please explain to me how you can get to Vermont New Hampshire and Maine without going through New Jersey or New York State
Yes I should also added Massachusetts

**Aguila Blanca** · January 7, 2021, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don P

I shoot with a friend, retired law enforcement. He has stated that even with LEOSA he has to abide by state laws for carry, ie: New York City, MA. He has told me he is better off with his concealment permit over the LEOSA and we live in Florida.

Legally, he is incorrect. That's clearly established by the opening words of the LEOSA.

In practical terms, it may come down to, "You may beat the rap, but you can't beat the ride." Which means he might be arrested and have to win in court, and I can understand preferring not to become a test case.

Mainah · January 7, 2021, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Please explain to me how you can get to Vermont New Hampshire and Maine without going through New Jersey or New York State
Yes I should also added Massachusetts

Carefully. I was responding to the blanket statement about New England gun laws.

**44 AMP** · January 7, 2021, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Please explain to me how you can get to Vermont New Hampshire and Maine without going through New Jersey or New York State
Yes I should also added Massachusetts

Physically, I think by airplane is the most commonly used method. You can also do it by boat.

What went on at the Capitol yesterday was deplorable. We should all be upset about it, and I have the same opinion about not respecting the rule of law no matter which side of the political spectrum it comes from.

Both sides have let slip their fanatics this past year, to the detriment of us all.

roscoe · January 7, 2021, 01:23 PM

Anyone passing through NJ or NY should be protected by FOPA, but the gun has to be unloaded and in a locked case.

TunnelRat · January 7, 2021, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don P

I shoot with a friend, retired law enforcement. He has stated that even with LEOSA he has to abide by state laws for carry, ie: New York City, MA. He has told me he is better off with his concealment permit over the LEOSA and we live in Florida.
He also stated he would never even think of carrying in New England because of their gun laws

ME, NH, and VT all have constitutional carry. I get that MA is part of New England (New York and New Jersey are not part of New England btw) but I can’t help but roll my eyes at the number of times I’ve read this exact blanket comment about how New England has strict gun laws when it’s obvious the people making these comments don’t really know how diverse even New England is when it comes to gun laws.

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**Aguila Blanca** · January 7, 2021, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TunnelRat

ME, NH, and VT all have constitutional carry. I get that MA is part of New England (New York and New Jersey are not part of New England btw) but I can’t help but roll my eyes at the number of times I’ve read this exact blanket comment about how New England has strict gun laws when it’s obvious the people making these comments don’t really know how diverse even New England is when it comes to gun laws.

Maine's "constitutional" (permitless) carry has a "gotcha." Carry in state parks requires a Maine carry permit. Since carry in national parks defers to the law of the state in which the national park is located, that means carry in Acadia National Park requires a Maine permit.

https://www.maine.gov/dps/msp/sites/...%20Summary.pdf

http://legislature.maine.gov/statute...12sec1803.html

http://legislature.maine.gov/statute...e12sec756.html

TunnelRat · January 7, 2021, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aguila Blanca

Maine's "constitutional" (permitless) carry has a "gotcha." Carry in state parks requires a Maine carry permit. Since carry in national parks defers to the law of the state in which the national park is located, that means carry in Acadia National Park requires a Maine permit.

https://www.maine.gov/dps/msp/sites/...%20Summary.pdf

http://legislature.maine.gov/statute...12sec1803.html

http://legislature.maine.gov/statute...e12sec756.html

If that meets your definition of a state whose carry laws are so restrictive that you wouldn’t bother carrying there, then more power to you. As far as I’m concerned the remark to which I was responding is still a typical exaggeration caused by a stereotype that people don’t bother to investigate.

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shurshot · January 7, 2021, 08:21 PM

Truth be told, there are likely FAR more guns in the State of Maine than there are people. Laws are very lax up here... and it's one of the safest States in the USA. Very low crime rates. Funny how that works.

Mainah · January 7, 2021, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Maine's "constitutional" (permitless) carry has a "gotcha." Carry in state parks requires a Maine carry permit. Since carry in national parks defers to the law of the state in which the national park is located, that means carry in Acadia National Park requires a Maine permit.

Good point. I'd add that the land mass in all state parks and Acadia combined represents a tiny fraction of Maine. It's possible to visit, and have a great time without setting foot in a restricted park.

Lots of people imagine New England as a vast expansion of the gun politics they see in several Northeastern states. It's just not the case.

**Aguila Blanca** · January 7, 2021, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TunnelRat

If that meets your definition of a state whose carry laws are so restrictive that you wouldn’t bother carrying there, then more power to you. As far as I’m concerned the remark to which I was responding is still a typical exaggeration caused by a stereotype that people don’t bother to investigate.

I didn't say, "that meets [my] definition of a state whose carry laws are so restrictive that [I] wouldn’t bother carrying there." I didn't even imply that indirectly. I posted because to most people "constitutional carry" means you can carry pretty much everywhere without a permit. And that's not the case in Maine.

Maine is a big tourist state -- tourism is a major contributor to the state's economy. People go to Maine for a variety of reasons, but parks are a major draw: Acadia National Park, Baxter State Park (Mount Katahdin, the northern end of the Appalachian Trail), the Allagash Wilderness Waterway -- all of these draw large numbers of visitors to Maine every year. To carry legally in any of those -- as well as any number of other state parks around Maine -- you need a Maine carry permit. It happens that Acadia National Park used to be one of my favorite vacation destinations. For both financial as well as scheduling reasons I haven't been there in several years, but I obtained a Maine permit specifically so that I can be legal if I visit Acadia again in the future.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mainah

Good point. I'd add that the land mass in all state parks and Acadia combined represents a tiny fraction of Maine. It's possible to visit, and have a great time without setting foot in a restricted park.

Very true. When I was a young lad, our annual summer vacation was a trek to visit grandparents in coastal Maine. I love the state and, at one time, I had seriously considered retiring there. I'm not saying there aren't a LOT of great places in Maine where you can carry without a permit. But Acadia, Baxter, and other state parks are not among those places.

shurshot · January 7, 2021, 10:27 PM

Last I knew, you couldn't carry firearms in Baxter State Park even with a permit. No guns allowed... period.

Kirrich · January 8, 2021, 12:40 AM

How about pipe bombs? Those were found.
How about, now FIVE people have died from this attempted insurrection/coup by domestic terrorists. The latest was a Capitol policeman who died from his injuries...

MurBob · January 8, 2021, 01:16 AM

Some of these people who stormed the building are now posting video's on social media.

Interviews with the protesters by other protesters..

Great way to make the FBI's job a lot easier.. Stupid is as stupid does I guess.

I'm uncomfortable with the media calling it an insurrection as these people didn't have guns. They broke a couple windows, beat their chests, and gave their best battle cry.. but beyond that, it seems to me it was just a run of the mill riot with a bit of property destruction. They didn't try to burn the place down, rape women, or anything like that.

I think anyone who entered that building should be charged with the appropriate crime and go to prison, but the punishment should fit the crime, not be amped up because of the building it took place in or the over dramatization of those affected.

Most of these protestors seem to be doing the wrong thing for what they ignorantly thought was the right reason.

Now I'm worried about my own weapons. When one political party or the other has control of the House, Senate, and the White House, bad things tend to happen.

5whiskey · January 8, 2021, 01:28 AM

I’m going to be viewed as a traitor to gun rights, but I’ll say it. This hopefully will all end in 12 days now. I, for one, am glad. I do wish that the GA elections would have turned out differently, but I personally feel we have our commander in chief to thank for that as well.

I’m not going to say trump is responsible for what happens at the capital building. He didn’t in any specific terms call for that. But he was more than pleased there was a protest in DC that day, and was probably quite pleased his fans adored him enough to commit to civil disobedience. Unfortunately, storming the capital building is not just a simple act of civil disobedience...

I like some (heck probably even most) of his policies, hated his Twitter, and now I’m just done with him. I will forever believe we have DJT and his antics the past month to thank for the pro gun control party holding all the reigns of power to make laws.

Radny97 · January 8, 2021, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5whiskey

I’m going to be viewed as a traitor to gun rights, but I’ll say it. This hopefully will all end in 12 days now. I, for one, am glad. I do wish that the GA elections would have turned out differently, but I personally feel we have our commander in chief to thank for that as well.

I’m not going to say trump is responsible for what happens at the capital building. He didn’t in any specific terms call for that. But he was more than pleased there was a protest in DC that day, and was probably quite pleased his fans adored him enough to commit to civil disobedience. Unfortunately, storming the capital building is not just a simple act of civil disobedience...

I like some (heck probably even most) of his policies, hated his Twitter, and now I’m just done with him. I will forever believe we have DJT and his antics the past month to thank for the pro gun control party holding all the reigns of power to make laws.

100% agree

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Pathfinder45 · January 8, 2021, 02:15 AM

I believe that it is harmful to gun rights to have a pro-2nd amendment leader that otherwise exhibits alarming character defects and scandalous behavior. Those who value the right to keep and bear arms cannot afford to have someone disgraceful to lead their cause.

**Tom Servo** · January 8, 2021, 03:53 AM

This protest didn't go so well. Things happened that shouldn't have.

The fundamental question of this thread has been answered. I'm going to close this because it's likely to go off-topic at this point.

January 7, 2021, 06:28 AM	#27
shurshot Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2006 Posts: 1,819	"We'll have to see what results, of course, one side is already almost foaming at the mouth and no doubt will push as hard as they can while the outrage is fresh."(44AMP) ALL of us should be upset over what happened. This goes beyond politics. It was insurrection. Imagine if that was ANTIFA or BLM members who had breached and violated our Congressional halls... who would "foam at the mouth" then? We ALL should foam at the mouth... especially those of us who belong to the supposed party of Law and Order. We are a nation of LAWS. We are better than this. Last edited by shurshot; January 7, 2021 at 06:33 AM.

January 7, 2021, 11:55 AM	#33
Don P Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 2005 Location: Swamp dweller Posts: 6,187	Please explain to me how you can get to Vermont New Hampshire and Maine without going through New Jersey or New York State Yes I should also added Massachusetts __________________ *NRA Life Member, NRA Chief Range Safety Officer, NRA Certified Pistol Instructor,, USPSA & Steel Challange NROI Range Officer, ICORE Range Officer, ,MAG 40 Graduate* *As you are, I once was, As I am, You will be.*

January 8, 2021, 01:28 AM	#47
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,657	I’m going to be viewed as a traitor to gun rights, but I’ll say it. This hopefully will all end in 12 days now. I, for one, am glad. I do wish that the GA elections would have turned out differently, but I personally feel we have our commander in chief to thank for that as well. I’m not going to say trump is responsible for what happens at the capital building. He didn’t in any specific terms call for that. But he was more than pleased there was a protest in DC that day, and was probably quite pleased his fans adored him enough to commit to civil disobedience. Unfortunately, storming the capital building is not just a simple act of civil disobedience... I like some (heck probably even most) of his policies, hated his Twitter, and now I’m just done with him. I will forever believe we have DJT and his antics the past month to thank for the pro gun control party holding all the reigns of power to make laws. __________________ Support the NRA-ILA Auction, ends 03/09/2018 https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=593946

January 8, 2021, 03:53 AM	#50
Tom Servo Staff Join Date: September 27, 2008 Location: Foothills of the Appalachians Posts: 13,059	This protest didn't go so well. Things happened that shouldn't have. The fundamental question of this thread has been answered. I'm going to close this because it's likely to go off-topic at this point. __________________ Sometimes it’s nice not to destroy the world for a change. --Randall Munroe

January 7, 2021, 01:50 AM	#26
roscoe Senior Member Join Date: July 16, 2002 Location: AZ Posts: 575	I didn't see any sign that the pro-Trump looters had firearms - some seemed to have sticks. Apparently a long gun was found on the Capitol grounds. The woman that died seems to have been shot by law enforcement inside the Capitol. All things being equal, the police showed a lot of restraint, considering the US Capitol was stormed by force - the first time since 1814. In slightly different circumstances, there would have been a lot of dead bodies.

January 7, 2021, 06:47 AM	#28
Brit Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2005 Location: Orlando FL Posts: 1,934	Both NY City and Washington DC are not places I am about to go, anytime soon! Because I can not carry my Glock 19. And looking at the riotous behaviour practised by these people, not being armed would make no sense. So never going there, made lots of sense, to me. A good place to live, this Florida.

January 7, 2021, 07:52 AM	#29
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 4,700	The protestors showed a lot of restraint. Look at Minneapolis, Chicago, Portland.....

January 7, 2021, 01:23 PM	#37
roscoe Senior Member Join Date: July 16, 2002 Location: AZ Posts: 575	Anyone passing through NJ or NY should be protected by FOPA, but the gun has to be unloaded and in a locked case.

January 7, 2021, 08:21 PM	#41
shurshot Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2006 Posts: 1,819	Truth be told, there are likely FAR more guns in the State of Maine than there are people. Laws are very lax up here... and it's one of the safest States in the USA. Very low crime rates. Funny how that works.

January 7, 2021, 10:27 PM	#44
shurshot Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2006 Posts: 1,819	Last I knew, you couldn't carry firearms in Baxter State Park even with a permit. No guns allowed... period.

January 8, 2021, 12:40 AM	#45
Kirrich Member Join Date: December 21, 2020 Location: N. Nevada Posts: 32	How about pipe bombs? Those were found. How about, now FIVE people have died from this attempted insurrection/coup by domestic terrorists. The latest was a Capitol policeman who died from his injuries...

January 8, 2021, 01:16 AM	#46
MurBob Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2016 Posts: 167	Some of these people who stormed the building are now posting video's on social media. Interviews with the protesters by other protesters.. Great way to make the FBI's job a lot easier.. Stupid is as stupid does I guess. I'm uncomfortable with the media calling it an insurrection as these people didn't have guns. They broke a couple windows, beat their chests, and gave their best battle cry.. but beyond that, it seems to me it was just a run of the mill riot with a bit of property destruction. They didn't try to burn the place down, rape women, or anything like that. I think anyone who entered that building should be charged with the appropriate crime and go to prison, but the punishment should fit the crime, not be amped up because of the building it took place in or the over dramatization of those affected. Most of these protestors seem to be doing the wrong thing for what they ignorantly thought was the right reason. Now I'm worried about my own weapons. When one political party or the other has control of the House, Senate, and the White House, bad things tend to happen.

January 8, 2021, 02:15 AM	#49
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	I believe that it is harmful to gun rights to have a pro-2nd amendment leader that otherwise exhibits alarming character defects and scandalous behavior. Those who value the right to keep and bear arms cannot afford to have someone disgraceful to lead their cause.