Ruger 77/22 Hornet bolt

M14 · January 25, 2010, 07:01 PM

I've been reading that the accuracy of my Ruger 77/22H can be improved by eliminating the "slop" in the 2 piece bolt. I've read of cures by shimming the bolt, expanding the portion of the neck not used to grip the bullet to 6mm, etc. Knowing nothing of which I speak, couldn't the same thing be accomplished by setting the barrel back & rechambering to either standard hornet or k hornet?

Scorch · January 26, 2010, 03:46 AM

How bad does it shoot? Most problems with 22 Hornets can be fixed with good handloads.

M14 · January 26, 2010, 03:51 PM

Let me try rephrasing this. I would like to eliminate the generous headspace on this rifle. Not being a gunsmith, my "tunnel vision" question is: Can't the barrel merely be setback to eliminate the excessive headspace?

Scorch · January 27, 2010, 11:53 AM

Yes, you can set the barrel back. 77/22H receivers and barrels are threaded.

twice barrel · January 27, 2010, 01:00 PM

Why not just fireform your cases in your own gun's chamber and start working up some good loads with necksized cases?

TB

M14 · January 28, 2010, 07:02 AM

Thanks for the info. I'm already only neck sizing my brass. I previously had a k hornet & I think the shoulder on the k hornet helps a lot in maintaining headspace even though it's a rimmed cartridge. I wonder if this guy's idea has merit?

http://www.centerfirecentral.com/brad22h.htm

Scorch · January 28, 2010, 02:29 PM

Interesting article, bulging out the shoulder area to form a headpsacing area on the shoulder. It sounds to me like he was bumping his shoulder back every time he loaded, a sure way to have case issues with a Hornet. Neck sizing is the way to go if that is your issue. BTW, the poor headspacing of the Hornet is what caused me to sell my Krico 22 Hornet 25 years ago. The guy who bought it from me messed around with it for a while then recut the chamber to K Hornet, and did away with all the nonsense. In your case, I would recommend sending the rifle back to Ruger for a headspace repair, or have the chamber recut to K Hornet and quit worrying about it.

M14 · January 28, 2010, 04:28 PM

While neck sizing is a good idea, I wonder how well it helps in maintaining headspace on the Hornet with its almost non existent shoulder. My Ruger delivers 1 1/2" groups which is still okay for chucks out to 150 yds. My old Winchester M43 in k-hornet could still beat it, & I consider the M43 a cheap (at the time) rifle,

Scorch · January 28, 2010, 05:17 PM

Agreed, the hornet has almost no shoulder, but if you are just neck sizing, you should be able to get better groups than that. Things to try:

* Use small pistol primers instead of small rifle primers. The case volume of the Hornet and the small volume of powder do not need as much OOMPH as a small rifle primer provides. This usually takes care of any erratic velocity issues, too.

* While I have read about people loading the Hornet with LilGun powder, and many recommend IMR4227 for accuracy, my best results were with a 40 gr bullet and 11.0 gr of W296.

* Seat the bullets out just a little further than you are currently, reducing jump to the lands.

* Check your rifle's throat: by using a Sharpie, blacken a bullet, then use it to load a dummy round to make sure you are not seating against the lands. If you touch the lands, it will show up as light scratches on the bullet all the way around. Best accuracy will be when seating slightly off the lands.

cal74 · January 28, 2010, 05:29 PM

Why don't you try just shimming your bolt like the majority of other people do?

Lots cheaper and if it doesn't work you can try other options.

Heard good things about these guy as well
http://www.ct-precision.com/

M14 · January 28, 2010, 08:05 PM

I am using small pistol primers. My bullets are not touching the lands, but can't be seated out any more unless I single load as they're at max to function through the rotary magazine. I bought some shim stock but haven't tried it yet. I'm still working on it. It would be nice if it would out group my ancient 30/06. I may try W296.

Prince55 · February 9, 2010, 01:02 PM

About how far off the lands are your bullets and what is the maximum
cartridge overall length that you can use through that rotary magazine ?

Thanks

M14 · February 9, 2010, 01:36 PM

I'll have to reply when I get home about the maximum length that will function through the magazine. I originally did the "just off the lands" thing but found the rounds wouldn't function through the magazine so I seated them so they would just function through the magazine. I'm not sure how far off the lands they are now. After I shim the bolt, I may try the "just off the lands" & single load if I'm still unhappy withe the groups.

Colorado Redneck · February 12, 2010, 10:50 PM

When i bought this rifle, i had read several different threads in this forum, and an article in some magazine that Horents can be persnickety. Well, after fiddling around with this round for a year, I am here to validate that statement.

I THINK a round using Sierra 40 gr blitzking and H110 is the best so far. But it will remain to be seen. At first I thought 40 gr hornadys were the deal. I had tried some different loads and a couple grouped really good. But when I loaded 200 rounds and headed for Wyoming to shoot dogs, the thing wouldn't hit a bull in the butt at 10 yards. Back to the range, and the results were enough to pi$$ off the pope. So, more experimenting, more reading, more disappointment. But it looks like maybe the Sierra load will work. Till, for some reason, the gun decides they shouldn't.

So don't give up. Like me, you might have more reasons to shoot and buy different bullets and powder and primers and cases and equipment....

M14 · February 17, 2010, 05:35 AM

I measured the col & it's 1.717". As I said, I'm not sure how far off the lands that puts me. However, I dove into the shim kit I ordered & shimmed the bolt. What a difference! I set up a target at 75 yds. & shot a 3/4" group using a fallen tree as a rest. 4 of the shots went into 1/2". I really believe using a bench & not kneeling in the snow behind a fallen tree would tighten up the group a little more.

Scorch · February 17, 2010, 12:22 PM

Quote:

I really believe using a bench & not kneeling in the snow behind a fallen tree would tighten up the group a little more

No, I have a friend who talked to the clerk at the 7-11 who knows a guy that heard from a guy who says he used to be a Navy Seal that kneeling in the snow is best. Either that, or leaning across the hood of your truck.

Just kidding. Glad you got it fixed, or at least heading in the right direction.

fishhawk · February 20, 2010, 10:25 AM

the us made rifles use SAAMI spec chambers which are rather large ,the European makers use C.I.P. specs which are tighter.
the hornet head spaces on the rim and the larger SAMMI chambers require you to fire form the cases and just resize the neck.
this is one of the major reasons the CZ rifles in 22 hornet shoot so well the tighter C.I.P chamber.
the Ruger 22 hornet compounds this with there two piece bolt,the Ruger is such a fine rifle why would they put such a pice of c&@# bolt on it .

January 25, 2010, 07:01 PM	#1
M14 Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2006 Location: Southwest Michigan Posts: 110	Ruger 77/22 Hornet bolt I've been reading that the accuracy of my Ruger 77/22H can be improved by eliminating the "slop" in the 2 piece bolt. I've read of cures by shimming the bolt, expanding the portion of the neck not used to grip the bullet to 6mm, etc. Knowing nothing of which I speak, couldn't the same thing be accomplished by setting the barrel back & rechambering to either standard hornet or k hornet? __________________ Strangers in the night exchanging tracers.

January 26, 2010, 03:46 AM	#2
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	How bad does it shoot? Most problems with 22 Hornets can be fixed with good handloads. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

January 26, 2010, 03:51 PM	#3
M14 Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2006 Location: Southwest Michigan Posts: 110	Let me try rephrasing this. I would like to eliminate the generous headspace on this rifle. Not being a gunsmith, my "tunnel vision" question is: Can't the barrel merely be setback to eliminate the excessive headspace? __________________ Strangers in the night exchanging tracers.

January 27, 2010, 11:53 AM	#4
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	Yes, you can set the barrel back. 77/22H receivers and barrels are threaded. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

January 28, 2010, 07:02 AM	#6
M14 Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2006 Location: Southwest Michigan Posts: 110	Thanks for the info. I'm already only neck sizing my brass. I previously had a k hornet & I think the shoulder on the k hornet helps a lot in maintaining headspace even though it's a rimmed cartridge. I wonder if this guy's idea has merit? http://www.centerfirecentral.com/brad22h.htm __________________ Strangers in the night exchanging tracers.

January 27, 2010, 01:00 PM	#5
twice barrel Member Join Date: November 11, 2009 Posts: 98	Why not just fireform your cases in your own gun's chamber and start working up some good loads with necksized cases? TB

January 28, 2010, 02:29 PM	#7
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	Interesting article, bulging out the shoulder area to form a headpsacing area on the shoulder. It sounds to me like he was bumping his shoulder back every time he loaded, a sure way to have case issues with a Hornet. Neck sizing is the way to go if that is your issue. BTW, the poor headspacing of the Hornet is what caused me to sell my Krico 22 Hornet 25 years ago. The guy who bought it from me messed around with it for a while then recut the chamber to K Hornet, and did away with all the nonsense. In your case, I would recommend sending the rifle back to Ruger for a headspace repair, or have the chamber recut to K Hornet and quit worrying about it. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

January 28, 2010, 04:28 PM	#8
M14 Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2006 Location: Southwest Michigan Posts: 110	While neck sizing is a good idea, I wonder how well it helps in maintaining headspace on the Hornet with its almost non existent shoulder. My Ruger delivers 1 1/2" groups which is still okay for chucks out to 150 yds. My old Winchester M43 in k-hornet could still beat it, & I consider the M43 a cheap (at the time) rifle, __________________ Strangers in the night exchanging tracers.

January 28, 2010, 05:17 PM	#9
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	Agreed, the hornet has almost no shoulder, but if you are just neck sizing, you should be able to get better groups than that. Things to try: * Use small pistol primers instead of small rifle primers. The case volume of the Hornet and the small volume of powder do not need as much OOMPH as a small rifle primer provides. This usually takes care of any erratic velocity issues, too. * While I have read about people loading the Hornet with LilGun powder, and many recommend IMR4227 for accuracy, my best results were with a 40 gr bullet and 11.0 gr of W296. * Seat the bullets out just a little further than you are currently, reducing jump to the lands. * Check your rifle's throat: by using a Sharpie, blacken a bullet, then use it to load a dummy round to make sure you are not seating against the lands. If you touch the lands, it will show up as light scratches on the bullet all the way around. Best accuracy will be when seating slightly off the lands. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

January 28, 2010, 05:29 PM	#10
cal74 Junior Member Join Date: January 19, 2010 Posts: 6	Why don't you try just shimming your bolt like the majority of other people do? Lots cheaper and if it doesn't work you can try other options. Heard good things about these guy as well http://www.ct-precision.com/

January 28, 2010, 08:05 PM	#11
M14 Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2006 Location: Southwest Michigan Posts: 110	I am using small pistol primers. My bullets are not touching the lands, but can't be seated out any more unless I single load as they're at max to function through the rotary magazine. I bought some shim stock but haven't tried it yet. I'm still working on it. It would be nice if it would out group my ancient 30/06. I may try W296. __________________ Strangers in the night exchanging tracers.

February 9, 2010, 01:02 PM	#12
Prince55 Senior Member Join Date: June 22, 2007 Posts: 472	Ruger .22 Hornet--- About how far off the lands are your bullets and what is the maximum cartridge overall length that you can use through that rotary magazine ? Thanks

February 9, 2010, 01:36 PM	#13
M14 Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2006 Location: Southwest Michigan Posts: 110	I'll have to reply when I get home about the maximum length that will function through the magazine. I originally did the "just off the lands" thing but found the rounds wouldn't function through the magazine so I seated them so they would just function through the magazine. I'm not sure how far off the lands they are now. After I shim the bolt, I may try the "just off the lands" & single load if I'm still unhappy withe the groups. __________________ Strangers in the night exchanging tracers.

February 12, 2010, 10:50 PM	#14
Colorado Redneck Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2008 Location: Northeast Colorado Posts: 1,993	Savage model 40 hornet When i bought this rifle, i had read several different threads in this forum, and an article in some magazine that Horents can be persnickety. Well, after fiddling around with this round for a year, I am here to validate that statement. I THINK a round using Sierra 40 gr blitzking and H110 is the best so far. But it will remain to be seen. At first I thought 40 gr hornadys were the deal. I had tried some different loads and a couple grouped really good. But when I loaded 200 rounds and headed for Wyoming to shoot dogs, the thing wouldn't hit a bull in the butt at 10 yards. Back to the range, and the results were enough to pi$$ off the pope. So, more experimenting, more reading, more disappointment. But it looks like maybe the Sierra load will work. Till, for some reason, the gun decides they shouldn't. So don't give up. Like me, you might have more reasons to shoot and buy different bullets and powder and primers and cases and equipment....

February 17, 2010, 05:35 AM	#15
M14 Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2006 Location: Southwest Michigan Posts: 110	I measured the col & it's 1.717". As I said, I'm not sure how far off the lands that puts me. However, I dove into the shim kit I ordered & shimmed the bolt. What a difference! I set up a target at 75 yds. & shot a 3/4" group using a fallen tree as a rest. 4 of the shots went into 1/2". I really believe using a bench & not kneeling in the snow behind a fallen tree would tighten up the group a little more. __________________ Strangers in the night exchanging tracers.

February 20, 2010, 10:25 AM	#17
fishhawk Junior Member Join Date: October 2, 2009 Location: louisiana Posts: 13	22 hornet the us made rifles use SAAMI spec chambers which are rather large ,the European makers use C.I.P. specs which are tighter. the hornet head spaces on the rim and the larger SAMMI chambers require you to fire form the cases and just resize the neck. this is one of the major reasons the CZ rifles in 22 hornet shoot so well the tighter C.I.P chamber. the Ruger 22 hornet compounds this with there two piece bolt,the Ruger is such a fine rifle why would they put such a pice of c&@# bolt on it .

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