300 WSM

[Bayoubulldog]

I posted an earlier thread on the 270 WSM and i got a ton of good feedback. Admitatly more than i expected. But it made me think about a totally different caliber instead!

So heres the deal, I am looking into getting a new caliber rifle soon. I want something new and unique that does everything i need it to do. Normally that would be whitetail, but I'll be hog hunting soon and my father and i have been planning a black bear and/or elk hunt for years. When he hits retirement in the next year or so, we are going to take some big trips!

So, I've been researching the WSM calibers among others! (A good friend hunts with a 300 WSM and loves it, which is what turned me on to the WSM.)

Overall, im looking for something unique but versatile. I hunt whitetail mostly but may be hunting bigger game in the next few years!

I'll be reloading my own rounds so ammo scarcity isn't a HUGE problem for me. Though I know finding brass can be an issue at times.

I initially looked at the winchester 70 and browning X bolt hunter models. I am really interested in your experiences and thoughts on the round and rifles you shoot! I think the overall WSM craze will Peter out but the 300 WSM may be the only round to survive it.

Do you reload for it? If so do you do any lighter loads? Hunting loads?

Talk me out of (or into) the new 300 WSM I'm considering adding to the stable soon!

[Scorch]

You don't need a 300 WSM for deer or hogs. I killed plenty of them with a 30-30 and a 357 mag. Now, that said, there is a difference between needing and wanting, and if you are just jonesing for a 300 WSM, go ahead, but I think you will find it too much unless you are hunting elk or the like.

[handlerer2]

The bullets available in 30 cal would make it more attractive for me. I reload and shoot 300Wby and 340Wby. No experience with the WSM's, but I like the idea of a shorter belt-less more moderate magnum.

[Boogershooter]

I have many rifles in many calibers but the majority are .30 cals. From 300 blkout to 300 weatherby the wsm is by far my favorite. The ballistic performance to recoil ratio makes it the perfect cartridge IMHO. I don't notice any recoil difference between it and the very versatile and capable 30-06. On paper there should be but I can't feel it. I can feel the recoil difference between it and the normal 300 winmag even with the winmag being a heavier rifle. If you are going to get it in a lightweight rifle I'm sure it will be even more noticeable. I've used mine on elk, deer, hogs, coyotes, and even a few bobcats. I think the 300 wsm is best suited for the 150 grain bullets. If you are going to feed it a steady diet of heavier bullets I believe you would be better suited with full size magnums. My wife loves her 270 wsm and it's a great round but if you are going on premium hunts after large trophy critters the 300 is the better choice IMHO.

I have 3 of them. My first was a browning A-bolt II, then a model 70 winchester featherweight, then a custom rig for all day, long range shooting. The Abolt tames the recoil a hair better than the model 70 but it isn't bad in either. I use the 150 grain ballistic tips and it's never failed me. Almost always DRT. The first one that wasn't DRT, I shot a front chest shot and the buck hit the ground but got up and ran about 40 yards. The second was on a running deer I thought was already shot by wife. I shot it running about 150 yards and made a bad shot. Hit it low in the ham. It completely broke that leg and it fell off within 10 yards. It went thru to hit the other back leg and shattered it also. How that deer got up and went 20 yards I will never know but it did. I've never seen a deer bleed that much in such a short distance but it looked like it walked over a landmine. The hole thru the second leg and ham was big enough I could stick both hands into it. Some say the ballistic tips explode but that hasn't been my experience. They do however result in very large wound channels and DRT kills. I normally shoot behind the shoulder thru the ribs to keep from wasting meat.

[jmr40]

I posted in the other thread and will try not to repeat myself. Compared to 30-06 and 300 WM the 300 WSM will shoot the same bullets 150-300 fps faster than 30-06 and about 50-100 fps slower than 300 WM. It really depends on bullet weight and the individual load. Since the 300WSM uses about 10-12 gr less powder than 300WM, and is a little slower recoil is noticeably less in same weight rifles. Or about the same as 300 WM if used in a rifle 1/2 lb lighter. Having owned them all the extra 50-100 fps of the 300 WM isn't worth the negatives to me.

On the negative side factory loads are a little harder to find. Even if you reload brass is not easy to find. Federal makes a lot of loads and our local Walmart generally keeps a good supply of 300WSM. Last winter they were selling it for $15/box. I bought 6 boxes. I don't really want the factory loads, but that is cheaper than I can buy brass. I'll shoot it up and save the brass to reload.

I like the round and my rifle. I just don't really need the added performance. I doubt if I'll sell mine, but I don't really use it often. Realistically my 308 does 95% of what I need a rifle to do. But if you want more punch than 30-06 with manageable recoil I think it is a good round.

[Nathan]

When I hear hogs and whitetail's, I think 30 - 375 cal low to med power.

308 win
338 fed
358 win
30-30
375 win
300 BO
30'06
444 mar
308 mar
45-70 light loads
44 mag/357 mag Ruger semi or bolt gun

Which one would depend on average shot distance. 357 mag for 50 yds and under, 30'06 out to 300 of so yds.

I own a 300 WSM. Mine is 14-15 lbs and still recoils a fair bit.

In your shoes, I like an M1A carbine with a 2-8 or 3-9 scope on it!

[taylorce1]

I wouldn't consider the .300 WSM a new or unique cartridge anymore. Maybe a decade ago I would have considered it still new and unique. I do think that you can do far worse for cartridge selection than a .300 WSM.

If you want a unique cartridge get a .30 RCM (Ruger Compact Magnum) ammunition is hard to find as I believe it's all but a dead round. However, you can pick up several different M77 Ruger rifles for $500 in it from CDNN. Just buy enough brass to last your lifetime and since it's a .308 caliber it'll be easy to find the rest of the components.

[briandg]

The short magnum series should have replaced all of the standard cartridges by now, just for the fact that they boost performance at very little actual penalty of changing cartridges. If a person was wanting to maximize hunting potential only, and not planning on firing many hundreds of rounds annually, I'd recommend going with the short magnum over a 30-06. Ammo may be as much as twice the price, comparing apples to apples, between the wsm and 30-06, but unless you are going to go through hundreds, what will one dollar matter? Whether you shoot factory or reloads, the wsm will cost more, but reloading the wsm will still cost more than the standard.

Even if you go through 200 rounds in a year, what does that amount to, $200? is that a real deal breaker?

The thing has far better ballistics than the 06, has better shooter comfort, is far more capable in larger game, can be loaded down some for smaller game, and makes sense for a hunting rifle, not so much for one that you take to the range every weekend for entertainment.

My two cents. If I was buying a hunting rifle today, this is the decision I would make.

[Llama Bob]

Of the two short magnums that survived, I think I like .300 WSM a little more than .270 WSM. I do think they went a hair too hot with it though, at least on the heavy loads. It's got more recoil than my 7mm mag, and I can't think of any hunting situation where I'd rather have the .300 WSM than the 7mag - they strike me as functionally identical. So I can do without the extra recoil.

[ballisti]

Actually, four of the WSM cartridges are still in production, still being chambered in new rifles... Dunno where you got the idea that there were only two.

[Llama Bob]

I guess technically you can still buy 325 WSM and 7mm WSM rifles, but both calibers are clearly in serious trouble. Which is a little too bad, since 7mm WSM is probably the only one I'd consider.

[ballisti]

I don't know much about the 7mmWSM, but the 325WSM is very interesting to me. It appears to be one of the most efficient cartridges on the market, providing the most bang for a given powder charge.

At maximum, the 325 WSM with a given bullet comes very close to the velocity of the gigantic 8mm Rem mag. - But in a short action instead of a long one. It uses less powder to do all of this, and by all accounts has notably less recoil.

In the Speer book listings for the 200 grain SP:

8mm RM    IMR4350  74 grn  2936 fps COAL 3.575"
325 WSM   IMR4350  65 grn  2802 fps COAL 2.840"

These are max listed loads, both from 24" barrels.

The 8mmRM gets an additional 134 fps from an extra 9 grains of powder.

That is 12% more powder for a 4.5% velocity advantage, if I figured the percentages correctly.

Use starting loads for the 325WSM, and you have 8x57 velocity, perfect for whitetail deer. This makes the 325 WSM useful for anything from 100 pound whitetails to pissed off 10 ft. grizzlies, with the proper bullet and load.

This is also true of the 300WSM, which emulates the 30-06 with starting loads, but comes very close to the 300WM at max.

Very versatile, very useful cartridges, either one a superior choice for the one-gun hunter in North America.

[Bayoubulldog]

Originally Posted by ballisti

I don't know much about the 7mmWSM, but the 325WSM is very interesting to me. It appears to be one of the most efficient cartridges on the market, providing the most bang for a given powder charge.

At maximum, the 325 WSM with a given bullet comes very close to the velocity of the gigantic 8mm Rem mag. - But in a short action instead of a long one. It uses less powder to do all of this, and by all accounts has notably less recoil.

In the Speer book listings for the 200 grain SP:

8mm RM    IMR4350  74 grn  2936 fps COAL 3.575"
325 WSM   IMR4350  65 grn  2802 fps COAL 2.840"

These are max listed loads, both from 24" barrels.

The 8mmRM gets an additional 134 fps from an extra 9 grains of powder.

That is 12% more powder for a 4.5% velocity advantage, if I figured the percentages correctly.

Use starting loads for the 325WSM, and you have 8x57 velocity, perfect for whitetail deer. This makes the 325 WSM useful for anything from 100 pound whitetails to pissed off 10 ft. grizzlies, with the proper bullet and load.

This is also true of the 300WSM, which emulates the 30-06 with starting loads, but comes very close to the 300WM at max.

Very versatile, very useful cartridges, either one a superior choice for the one-gun hunter in North America.

Very interesting! I'm intrigued by the capabilities of the WSM rounds out of the shorter action rifles! The 325 is a very interesting round. My father has one in a Browning BAR. It's a sweet gun for sure, btw.

I'm thinking that the range of what you can pull out of the 300 WSM with 150 grain bullets will be capable and efficient for a wide variety of medium to large game. This ain't over! I found a Browning A bolt III hubter and an x bolt hunter locally in 300 WSM.... they are beautiful guns and really feel good in the hand! I'm starting to zone in on what I need...

[math teacher]

Ballist stated:

The 8mmRM gets an additional 134 fps from an extra 9 grains of powder.

That is 12% more powder for a 4.5% velocity advantage, if I figured the percentages correctly.

When we burn powder in a cartridge case, it produces energy. Velocity is a byproduct. Compare the energy of the two cited loads and there is about a 10% difference. Thus the shorter cartridge is only about 2% more efficient, not enough to worry about. If all you want to do is punch holes in paper, then yes the short magnums are more efficient and standard cartridges are even more efficient still.

[Worc]

If I were buying only one rifle for all around use, the cartridge would be the .300 WSM. Since I use the small, medium, and large concept for my hunting bolt guns, I don't have just one. The .300 WSM is the most popular in the line with the .270 WSM being the second. I don't see either going away anytime soon especially the .300 WSM. The .7mm WSM is more on life support and the .325 WSM has a leg in the grave already.

If you want something different, I'd go .270 WSM as not everyone on your street will have one. It'll be fine for all the game you intend to hunt. Since you will hand load for it, you can tailor you load for each specific type of game.
The .300 WSM would work the same way with hand loads. Download something like a 150 gr for deer & hogs and then step up to 180's with a tougher bullet and more speed for elk.


My BIL has a custom rifle in .325 WSM. He hand loads for it and uses it for hogs and deer with light for caliber bullets.

[Mike1]

I got a Win M70 FWT Classic in 300WSM about 10 years ago. Other than the factory test shot, there has never been a factory load through the barrel. I installed a Sims recoil pad to start with and it really works well (unfortunately it was the original "melting" compound). Five years ago, due to shoulder problems, I had a muzzle brake made for it, and that also considerably reduces felt recoil (drawback is noise).

I began loading Hornady 165 and 180 Interlocks. (I have not used any lighter bullets). While they were accurate, I decided to go with a premium bullet and began loading Barnes TSX 168gr. (The key to Barnes bullet accuracy is to pay attention to their recommended bullet jump). I use Win brass, Fed 215s and a max load of Varget. With a heavy Burris 30mm scope, sling, extra 6 rounds on the butt, the combo is around 10 1/2 lbs. The gun/ammo combo is a tack driver, with 3 shot groups at 300 yards between 1 to 1 1/2" depending on how well I'm shooting and the wind.

Mike

Due to bad luck the only Elk I've collected has been a cow. Shot at about 40 yards downhill. Forget about scope offset and shot high on her chest. Critter took 2 steps back and fell down dead. Bullet was found at the back of her hind leg under the skin with all petals gone.

[trooper3385]

I have the Browning X-bolt in the 300 WSM and it's been my go to gun for the last few years. I have a gun safe full of hunting rifles, and I seem to grab this one most of the time. My second choice has been my A-bolt in the 270 WSM. The accuracy on it has been great. I have not hand loaded for it yet. I got a good deal a couple years ago on some Nosler Custom 180 gr Accubonds and bought like 4 boxes. I'm shooting under an inch with those and have had great results. Last year I shot a 650-700 lb nilgai bull with it at 200 yds. The front quartering shoulder shot flipped him on his back. If your not familiar with Nilgai, they are one of the toughest animals in North America. It's a light gun so the recoil is pretty sharp on it, but it's not a gun your going to be shooting on the bench all day. My brother in law has the exact same set up and used it to take a 60 inch moose and a mountain goat. He has also taken caribou and Elk with it. The 300 win mag might have a little bit better balistics, but I doubt it's not enough for the animals to tell the difference. What I like with the 300 WSM is that one it's a shorter, lighter action and two, i believe the barrel length is 23 inches. In the 300 win mag, you need a 26 in barrel to get the full potential out of it. That 3 inches makes a big difference, weight wise and mobility. I have a 300 win mag in an A bolt and it has not been out of my safe since I got the WSM.

[ballisti]

I recently purchased a Winchester model 70 "Extreme Weather SS" in 270WSM, and am enjoying that cartridge. Kicking a bit less than a 7mm RM, it can handle anything up to and including elk or moose. For large bears, I would prefer something that throws a heavier slug, but my chances of a grizzly hunt are like slim and none, so this is not an issue.

This is my second 270WSM, the first being a Winchester 1885. In both guns it has proven to be a superbly accurate cartridge.

I do not honestly believe I that will ever need anything more powerful, and starting loads tones it down to 270 Winchester power levels for whitetail, pigs, etc.

It should be about right for hunting where I live, in the high desert of West Texas, where cover is sparse and shots can sometimes be long.

Jack O'Connor used to teach at the university here, and he got by just fine with a 270 and a 30-06. I feel confident that this 270WSM will handle any situation that I am likely to encounter.

I thought about a 300WSM, but decided that the extra power that it offers is not going to be necessary in my case.

[jismail]

I inherited a remington woodsmaster 81 in 300 savage. Neat gun.... Designed by Browning i believe. it is a more unique cartridge but can still be found in many stores. How does the 300sav stack up to the 300wsm?

[handlerer2]

The 300 Savage is more closely akin to the 308 than a WSM. It has slightly less case capacity than the 308, but I have read that is suitable for the same gam,e as the 308. The Savage is a very interesting cartridge, IMO.

[Deaf Smith]

Bayoubulldog,

If you want to shoot way out past Fort Mudge, and do it very accurately.. well the 300 WSM will do the deed.

Nice thing is, if you handload you can load it down to the power of a .308 or less or up to the .300 WM simply by varying the power charge and bullet selection.

From 200 grain on down to 110 is easy. Even make it a 30/30 by using 170 flat point bullets and a reduced charge of 3031 powder.

It will do fine for virtually anything in the North American continent.

Oh, and if you want to go to 8mm, there IS the 325 WSM.. which is also 8mm!

Deaf