loading 45-70 first time

abraxian · January 20, 2009, 08:17 AM

I have handloaded for pistol for many years but have never come across the following issue. Some of my reloading data states that loading small amounts of pistol powders (2400 and unique) can "cause problems or even an explosion with minimum loads (or less)". A buddy of mine says that the case should be at least 3/4 full to avoid this problem so that rules out pistol powders. Yet, some of the reloading data shows, for example: 24gr of 2044 or 15 gr of Unique without any mention of a problem. What is the answer?? I plan on starting out with 3031 and loading for 300 and 405 gr bullets. If I can use 2400 or Unique for plinking loads that would be great. I am loading for a new Ruger #1 I will be picking up today. Thanks!!!

45Marlin carbine · January 20, 2009, 08:48 AM

I don't have a 45-70 but my nephew just inherited one and I've read some on loading cast slugs at mild loads useing pistol powder for it. some loaders use tight fitting felt discs atop the powder to hold it against the primer - I'm interested in learning any techniques from accomplished 45-70 handloaders for this cartridge, my nephew (or one of the 6 I should say) doesn't handload.

mkl · January 20, 2009, 11:36 AM

The rumored "light charge explosion" phenomena had to do with using very light charges of slow burning powders.

I've used small charges of pistol powder in my 45-70 for many years. I generally use magnum primers to insure good case pressurization and ignition with very small volume loads.

Check the CAS sites (google) for many, many reduced loads using a variety of pistol powders.

kraigwy · January 20, 2009, 01:09 PM

I like to load my 45-70 to equal the velocity of the old 405 government round. But I'm too lazy to fool with cleaning the black powder crap.

I load 28 grns of 4198. Works good for a mild load, about 1200 fps with the 405 grn cast bullet in my Browning 1895

HOGGHEAD · January 20, 2009, 05:37 PM

I load and shoot a half dozen 45-70's. It is by far my caliber of choice for about everything. I also handload and cast all my ammunition.

My advice is simple. Do what your friend said . I definitely like the idea of trying to fill the case as much as possible.

A lot of shooters use the faster powder so they can save money on powder. It is that simple. There is no other good reason to not fill the case, except economics. And IMO that is a mistake. There are far too many things that can go wrong when one case can hold 2 or 3 or even 4 charges of powder.

Believe me accidents happen to the best reloader in the world.

Fill the case as much as possible. You do not have to worry about case position sensitivity of a charge. You will not have to worry about a double charge. And IMO a full case shoots more accurately.

Remember you are shooting a case that was initially designed to shoot a bulkier black powder. So the case design is different from modern pistol case design. There is a lot of space in a 45-70 case.

I am not trying to start an argument with the guys who like the faster powders. However I just feel it is much safer to keep your cases full.

I use RL7 in my 45-70's. It gives me pretty good case fill. And I have found it to be a very accurate powder for all my 45-70. And if you buy it in the big containers it is really not that much more expensive. And my safety is worth the little extra powder expense. Tom.

steveno · January 20, 2009, 06:23 PM

my most accurate loads in my Ruger #1S 45-70 use Unique and 2400

The Terminator · January 20, 2009, 09:41 PM

I have used 53 grains of IMR 3031, but that is a pretty stout load. I shoot a Marlin 1895. I backed down to 40 grains of IMR 3031, it is a little stronger than the trapdoor loads, but as hard on the body as the full power loads. I shoot 300 and 350 grain bullets with this load. With the 300 grain, the velocity is around 1500 fps. That is a mild load, good for the range, with all the killing power you will ever need.

GoldenRoyBoy · January 21, 2009, 07:43 AM

45-70, as others have written is also one of my favorite calibers. I'm a huge straight wall fan; liking 32-40, 38-55, and 45-120, just to name a few.

Have you thought about IMR's (now part of Hodgedon) Trail Boss?

You don't tell us if you are a hunter; or a shooter, or both? Being you bought a new Ruger #1 leads this reader to think both. I'm a hole puncher only. That means, for me at least no pain. Yesterday, for example I loaded up my usual batch of 45-70s using home cast 300 gn. LFNs pushed by only 13 grains of Trail Boss. Living at 6800 feet altitude, things tend to burn, and fly faster. This load averages 1150 fps, confirmed by Chronograph numerous times; and is plenty accurate, and safe. The good thing is I can grab any 45-70 I own and not have to worry about pressure ratings. The load shoots equally as well in my T/C Encore, or my Springfield Trapdoor. Shot through my Sharps, it's a real treat! I never shoot just one gun; when at my little range; so it's important to me to keep things as simple as possible; load-wise.

By the way, you can find more information regarding Trail Boss, and other powders following this link (This will connect you to loads recommended for the TrapDoor) ---

http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

Enjoy your new rifle!
GRB

January 20, 2009, 01:09 PM	#4
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	I like to load my 45-70 to equal the velocity of the old 405 government round. But I'm too lazy to fool with cleaning the black powder crap. I load 28 grns of 4198. Works good for a mild load, about 1200 fps with the 405 grn cast bullet in my Browning 1895 __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

January 20, 2009, 05:37 PM	#5
HOGGHEAD Senior Member Join Date: April 2, 2008 Location: Rivesville, WV Posts: 637	45-70 I load and shoot a half dozen 45-70's. It is by far my caliber of choice for about everything. I also handload and cast all my ammunition. My advice is simple. Do what your friend said . I definitely like the idea of trying to fill the case as much as possible. A lot of shooters use the faster powder so they can save money on powder. It is that simple. There is no other good reason to not fill the case, except economics. And IMO that is a mistake. There are far too many things that can go wrong when one case can hold 2 or 3 or even 4 charges of powder. Believe me accidents happen to the best reloader in the world. Fill the case as much as possible. You do not have to worry about case position sensitivity of a charge. You will not have to worry about a double charge. And IMO a full case shoots more accurately. Remember you are shooting a case that was initially designed to shoot a bulkier black powder. So the case design is different from modern pistol case design. There is a lot of space in a 45-70 case. I am not trying to start an argument with the guys who like the faster powders. However I just feel it is much safer to keep your cases full. I use RL7 in my 45-70's. It gives me pretty good case fill. And I have found it to be a very accurate powder for all my 45-70. And if you buy it in the big containers it is really not that much more expensive. And my safety is worth the little extra powder expense. Tom.

January 20, 2009, 09:41 PM	#7
The Terminator Senior Member Join Date: February 3, 2002 Location: Georgia, 35 miles Northwest of the armpit Posts: 946	I have used 53 grains of IMR 3031, but that is a pretty stout load. I shoot a Marlin 1895. I backed down to 40 grains of IMR 3031, it is a little stronger than the trapdoor loads, but as hard on the body as the full power loads. I shoot 300 and 350 grain bullets with this load. With the 300 grain, the velocity is around 1500 fps. That is a mild load, good for the range, with all the killing power you will ever need. __________________ The Terminator John 3:16 (I hope to see You over there.)

January 21, 2009, 07:43 AM	#8
GoldenRoyBoy Junior member Join Date: November 10, 2008 Location: Trinidad, Colorado Posts: 107	45-70 Great caliber! 45-70, as others have written is also one of my favorite calibers. I'm a huge straight wall fan; liking 32-40, 38-55, and 45-120, just to name a few. Have you thought about IMR's (now part of Hodgedon) Trail Boss? You don't tell us if you are a hunter; or a shooter, or both? Being you bought a new Ruger #1 leads this reader to think both. I'm a hole puncher only. That means, for me at least no pain. Yesterday, for example I loaded up my usual batch of 45-70s using home cast 300 gn. LFNs pushed by only 13 grains of Trail Boss. Living at 6800 feet altitude, things tend to burn, and fly faster. This load averages 1150 fps, confirmed by Chronograph numerous times; and is plenty accurate, and safe. The good thing is I can grab any 45-70 I own and not have to worry about pressure ratings. The load shoots equally as well in my T/C Encore, or my Springfield Trapdoor. Shot through my Sharps, it's a real treat! I never shoot just one gun; when at my little range; so it's important to me to keep things as simple as possible; load-wise. By the way, you can find more information regarding Trail Boss, and other powders following this link (This will connect you to loads recommended for the TrapDoor) --- http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp Enjoy your new rifle! GRB

January 20, 2009, 08:17 AM	#1
abraxian Member Join Date: June 18, 2005 Location: amelia island, florida Posts: 73	loading 45-70 first time I have handloaded for pistol for many years but have never come across the following issue. Some of my reloading data states that loading small amounts of pistol powders (2400 and unique) can "cause problems or even an explosion with minimum loads (or less)". A buddy of mine says that the case should be at least 3/4 full to avoid this problem so that rules out pistol powders. Yet, some of the reloading data shows, for example: 24gr of 2044 or 15 gr of Unique without any mention of a problem. What is the answer?? I plan on starting out with 3031 and loading for 300 and 405 gr bullets. If I can use 2400 or Unique for plinking loads that would be great. I am loading for a new Ruger #1 I will be picking up today. Thanks!!!

January 20, 2009, 08:48 AM	#2
45Marlin carbine Junior member Join Date: January 26, 2007 Location: South-Western North Carolina Posts: 1,124	I don't have a 45-70 but my nephew just inherited one and I've read some on loading cast slugs at mild loads useing pistol powder for it. some loaders use tight fitting felt discs atop the powder to hold it against the primer - I'm interested in learning any techniques from accomplished 45-70 handloaders for this cartridge, my nephew (or one of the 6 I should say) doesn't handload.

January 20, 2009, 11:36 AM	#3
mkl Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2008 Location: DFW area, Texas Posts: 494	The rumored "light charge explosion" phenomena had to do with using very light charges of slow burning powders. I've used small charges of pistol powder in my 45-70 for many years. I generally use magnum primers to insure good case pressurization and ignition with very small volume loads. Check the CAS sites (google) for many, many reduced loads using a variety of pistol powders.

January 20, 2009, 06:23 PM	#6
steveno Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2004 Location: Minden , Nebraska Posts: 1,407	my most accurate loads in my Ruger #1S 45-70 use Unique and 2400