Dealers? Are prices rising or dealer gouging? - Page 2

Rockrivr1 · January 21, 2021, 03:55 PM

As a small time FFL I can tell you that prices for everything has gone up and it's near impossible to get stock. Distributors are sold out of just about everything. The small trickle of items coming in go out so fast you have to be refreshing web sites constantly to even have a chance of grabbing something as it comes available. Ammo is even worse. Orders are taking months to even get a small percentage of what you ordered. That is why you are seeing gun and ammo prices explode. Limited stock with huge demand equals massive price increases. Capitalism

baddarryl · January 21, 2021, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockrivr1

As a small time FFL I can tell you that prices for everything has gone up and it's near impossible to get stock. Distributors are sold out of just about everything. The small trickle of items coming in go out so fast you have to be refreshing web sites constantly to even have a chance of grabbing something as it comes available. Ammo is even worse. Orders are taking months to even get a small percentage of what you ordered. That is why you are seeing gun and ammo prices explode. Limited stock with huge demand equals massive price increases. Capitalism

Fully Understood.

Ignition Override · January 21, 2021, 06:14 PM

Hawg: When you mentioned 600 for Hornady- in which chambering?

gaseousclay · January 23, 2021, 10:55 AM

The ammo shortage reminds me of the all around shortages we're seeing everywhere. First it was TP, then hand sanitizer, ammo, sewing supplies, housing, etc, etc. I'm still waiting for the housing market to implode. Millions in forbearance....what could possible go wrong?

buck460XVR · January 23, 2021, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TBM900

Always fascinating to see supposedly free-market advocates using words like "gouging" "rip-off" etc
You snooze you lose... and no I'm not the slightest bit sorry if my saying that hurts anyones feelings
Just a fact of life

Everyone has effectively had the same opportunity to buy when things were plentiful and "cheap"
If you chose not to buy or couldn't, say due to finances, thats not my or anyone else fault
I've been flipping stuff like crazy on various auction sites the last few months
Penny start and no reserve
Things like Maks I bought ages ago for under $100, selling today for $600+
WASR's that people were LOLing at when priced under $300, selling today for 3-4x
So am I gouging?
Am I ripping anyone off?

Seems in this thread and others like it in the past, the definition of "gouging" differs between those selling and those buying. Much of the shortage we see today is not the fault of being "unprepared" or "snoozing". Much of the shortage in today is due to new shooters, who never needed ammo before. There were 5 million first time/new gun owners in 2020. 40% of guns sold were to first time gun buyers. These are not folks that "snoozed and lost", these are folks that had no need for ammo, in any quantities, til just now. Even if those folks bought just 2 boxes of ammo, that would be 10 million less boxes for the rest of us, from a demand source there never used to be. Many of these folks did not by their weapons for hunting or were they actually at more risk now than before. It was the fear of perceived risk that drove the sales and most of these sales were to folks that were financially secure and not financially impacted by Covid. They could afford to pay inflated prices for firearms and they did. They can afford to pay inflated prices for ammo now that they have a gun and wish to shoot it and they do. Is this just the market? To a point it is, but some of it is others taking advantage....and this is what "gouging" is. Similar to the "Harley" craze back in early 2000. Dealers were adding $3-4000 and more to the MSRP of bikes because of folks feeling they "needed" one to be cool. Created a shortage too. Those folks that paid the extra 5 grand were happy to, because having the Harley in their driveway fed their ego.......and they could afford it. Were they the smart ones or were the smart ones the ones who paid pennies on the dollar for the same bikes a few years later? Lots of folks out there reselling anything they find and folks cleaning their closets of any guns or ammo they have not used for years. Makes sense since it's a seller's market right now. Are they "ripping" folks off? Some are, some aren't. Like all things in life, buyers need to be aware. But many new buyers are not aware. Give them a break.

Ignition Override · January 23, 2021, 01:22 PM

Last summer JGSales priced 1,000 rds. of fmj Tula 7.62x39 at $380.

A month ago— $620.
Now- $680 or so.

It must be mostly the new shooters paying this, but also those who were warned Years Ago, and who can find - if at all-, only one or two small boxes in a gun store .?

**Shane Tuttle** · January 23, 2021, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buck460XVR

Much of the shortage we see today is not the fault of being "unprepared" or "snoozing". Much of the shortage in today is due to new shooters, who never needed ammo before. There were 5 million first time/new gun owners in 2020. 40% of guns sold were to first time gun buyers.

I have to respectfully disagree, to a point. New shooters, as in, just now of legal age to make a first purchase? Sure, I'll agree to that. New, as in, a 30-something just now getting scared due to political climate? I disagree. The latter, IMO, is largely at fault for being unprepared.

Nathan · January 23, 2021, 06:27 PM

When inventories shrink, prices go up...that is not gouging.

Think about it. If primers were $35/1000 in 2019 and I run out of stock in 4/2020, I order more. I receive those 12/2020. I look at the current primer prices and raise my price to be comptative. Today, competitive is about $200/1000. Am I gouging?

If I list for $35, they are gone I. An hour. No more are available from the distributor. How do I feed my family next week?

Literally, a local store has a few guns left and expects to be out by Jan end. There are no known orders to replenish....who is feeding him in February? BTW, 9MM ammo is like $45 per 50 at that store. Sold out.

Road_Clam · January 23, 2021, 08:12 PM

Marking up a non-necessity product to quadruple the cost of the same product a year ago is not gouging. It's fair market.

Marking up a necessity item in uncontrollable negative circumstances IS gouging.

We had a devastating week long ice storm in December of 2008 and we had no power for 8 days. I had a generator thankfully and I had 12 family member staying with me. There was only 3 gas stations with power within a 30 mile distance , 2 of them were charging a reasonable $3 / gallon the third decided to charge $7 / gallon. I was in line waiting at the 3rd gas station, as it was the closest to me and I needed gas badly, I actually saw the cops show up and what looked to be a STRONG conversation with the two owners and what do you know, the price immediately was dropped to $3 / gallon . True story

Ignition Override · February 5, 2021, 03:01 AM

Increased fear and believing rumors equal increased profits.

Ka Ching goes the cash.

Dealers must compete- via higher purchase costs — but would You want to sell products at early 2020 prices, and go bankrupt?

Maybe years from now those who were not prepared will be ready for the next panic?

January 23, 2021, 08:12 PM	#34
Road_Clam Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2013 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 1,695	Marking up a non-necessity product to quadruple the cost of the same product a year ago is not gouging. It's fair market. Marking up a necessity item in uncontrollable negative circumstances IS gouging. We had a devastating week long ice storm in December of 2008 and we had no power for 8 days. I had a generator thankfully and I had 12 family member staying with me. There was only 3 gas stations with power within a 30 mile distance , 2 of them were charging a reasonable $3 / gallon the third decided to charge $7 / gallon. I was in line waiting at the 3rd gas station, as it was the closest to me and I needed gas badly, I actually saw the cops show up and what looked to be a STRONG conversation with the two owners and what do you know, the price immediately was dropped to $3 / gallon . True story __________________ "To be old an wise you must have been young and stupid"

January 21, 2021, 03:55 PM	#26
Rockrivr1 Senior Member Join Date: June 6, 2002 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 271	As a small time FFL I can tell you that prices for everything has gone up and it's near impossible to get stock. Distributors are sold out of just about everything. The small trickle of items coming in go out so fast you have to be refreshing web sites constantly to even have a chance of grabbing something as it comes available. Ammo is even worse. Orders are taking months to even get a small percentage of what you ordered. That is why you are seeing gun and ammo prices explode. Limited stock with huge demand equals massive price increases. Capitalism

January 21, 2021, 06:14 PM	#28
Ignition Override Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2008 Location: About 20 nm from the Big Muddy Posts: 2,884	Hawg: When you mentioned 600 for Hornady- in which chambering?

January 23, 2021, 10:55 AM	#29
gaseousclay Senior Member Join Date: August 4, 2010 Posts: 1,210	The ammo shortage reminds me of the all around shortages we're seeing everywhere. First it was TP, then hand sanitizer, ammo, sewing supplies, housing, etc, etc. I'm still waiting for the housing market to implode. Millions in forbearance....what could possible go wrong?

January 23, 2021, 01:22 PM	#31
Ignition Override Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2008 Location: About 20 nm from the Big Muddy Posts: 2,884	Last summer JGSales priced 1,000 rds. of fmj Tula 7.62x39 at $380. A month ago— $620. Now- $680 or so. It must be mostly the new shooters paying this, but also those who were warned Years Ago, and who can find - if at all-, only one or two small boxes in a gun store .?

January 23, 2021, 06:27 PM	#33
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,326	When inventories shrink, prices go up...that is not gouging. Think about it. If primers were $35/1000 in 2019 and I run out of stock in 4/2020, I order more. I receive those 12/2020. I look at the current primer prices and raise my price to be comptative. Today, competitive is about $200/1000. Am I gouging? If I list for $35, they are gone I. An hour. No more are available from the distributor. How do I feed my family next week? Literally, a local store has a few guns left and expects to be out by Jan end. There are no known orders to replenish....who is feeding him in February? BTW, 9MM ammo is like $45 per 50 at that store. Sold out.

February 5, 2021, 03:01 AM	#35
Ignition Override Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2008 Location: About 20 nm from the Big Muddy Posts: 2,884	Increased fear and believing rumors equal increased profits. Ka Ching goes the cash. Dealers must compete- via higher purchase costs — but would You want to sell products at early 2020 prices, and go bankrupt? Maybe years from now those who were not prepared will be ready for the next panic?