Brand Names

Dino. · June 9, 2010, 09:08 PM

Just curious what manufactures you guys would recommend as "good quality".

At this time, I only own one black powder gun, which is made by Uberti.
Though I've been somewhat disappointed in the so-called "drop-in" replacement parts (which may not even be made by Uberti), I would consider the overall quality of this gun VERY good.

So what about other manufactures? ... Pietta? Palmetto? CVA? Others?
Which would you guys recommend as "good quality" and which would you recommend staying away from?

Thanks for the help.

pohill · June 9, 2010, 09:45 PM

I've had good and bad Piettas and Ubertis. Palmetto does not have a good reputation but I had a decent Palmetto .31. I've never seen a bad Ruger Old Army - they're built like tanks, even if they're not historically accurate to anything but themselves. I like used guns - most of the bugs have been worked out and the prices are alot lower. If I buy a new gun with a small to medium problem, I try to work through it because you could return that gun for a new one and end up with worse problems. The devil you know...
Plus, by working on the guns, you get to know them.
I have two 3rd Generation Colt Signature Series revolvers and I do not think you will find any gun, anywhere, better than either of these. Fit, finish, functionality are just about perfect. And they look great.
I have a few originals which are in a class of their own. It's a great obsession...I mean sport.

Dino. · June 9, 2010, 11:11 PM

Quote:

I've had good and bad Piettas and Ubertis. Palmetto does not have a good reputation but I had a decent Palmetto .31. I've never seen a bad Ruger Old Army - they're built like tanks, even if they're not historically accurate to anything but themselves. I like used guns - most of the bugs have been worked out and the prices are alot lower. If I buy a new gun with a small to medium problem, I try to work through it because you could return that gun for a new one and end up with worse problems. The devil you know...
Plus, by working on the guns, you get to know them.
I have two 3rd Generation Colt Signature Series revolvers and I do not think you will find any gun, anywhere, better than either of these. Fit, finish, functionality are just about perfect. And they look great.
I have a few originals which are in a class of their own. It's a great obsession...I mean sport.

Yeah, I've heard the same things about Palmetto and Ruger.
And I believe CVA's are mostly entry level. At least from those I've seen.
Can anyone tell me if a Pietta is similar to Urberti in quality?

the rifleer · June 9, 2010, 11:59 PM

I think that ubertis are better quality than pietta.

arcticap · June 10, 2010, 02:44 AM

Euroarms are good quality guns!

suzukibruce · June 10, 2010, 05:16 AM

uberti is way better than pietta... just look at how many pietta's are getting returned vrs ubertis...

mykeal · June 10, 2010, 07:05 AM

My opinion, worth exactly twice what you paid for it:

In descending order of 'quality'...

Ruger
Feinwerkbau
US Firearms
Colt 2nd Generation
Colt 3rd Generation
Fabriques d’Armes Unies de Liège
Pedersoli
Uberti
Euroarms/Armi San Paolo
Peitta
Armi San Marco
.
.
.
.
Palmetto

The top 7 are so close in quality it's probably silly to attempt to rank them, but an opinion is just an opinion anyway.

By the way, I own, or have owned at least one example (and usually more than one) of each of the above manufacturer's bp revolvers with the exception of USFA and Feinwerkbau. For those two I'm relying on others' opinions.

madcratebuilder · June 10, 2010, 08:01 AM

I've seen good and bad examples from all manufacturers with one exception, Ruger. Never seen a poorly made Ruger, maybe a stiff trigger or two.

Uberti makes a fine Colt Dragoon, but I prefer the Pietta holster frame Colts and Remingtons over the Uberti. Early ASM could be short on fit and finish but toward the end of their production they made a very nice pistol, to bad they stopped.

Quote:

uberti is way better than pietta... just look at how many pietta's are getting returned vrs ubertis...

Pietta probably out sells Uberti five to one. Uberti has their share of FAIL revolvers, I own a few.

Dino. · June 10, 2010, 08:09 AM

This is good stuff.
Thanks for all the feedback.

ClemBert · June 10, 2010, 09:48 AM

A lot of times you get what you paid for. Oddly (or not) my rankings match that concept. From personal experience and ownership:

1. Ruger
2. Uberti
3. Pietta

Ruger is way ahead of the other two. Uberti finish is much nicer than Pietta. Your mileage may vary.

Hawg · June 10, 2010, 04:48 PM

Quote:

uberti is way better than pietta... just look at how many pietta's are getting returned vrs ubertis...

That's because more Pietta's are bought. Go to Cabela's and read the reviews.

robhof · June 10, 2010, 06:12 PM

I have a ROA and a 31 San Marco; both bought used, the Ruger looked new and unfired and shoots great and as said above"built like a tank", the San Marco also had little use, but required much work to get it in good shooting condition. I have handled and shot both Pieta and Uberti and they're good guns, but you do get what you pay for.

MJN77 · June 10, 2010, 09:31 PM

"That's because more Pietta's are bought"

That's because Pietta's are cheaper. People just getting into BP guns don't usually go to the more expensive copies. They just get one of the cheaper ones from Cabelas. That's what I did 15 years ago when I got into BP. After 3 different Piettas crapped out on me in about 5 years I went with the more expensive Ubertis and have never had but one problem with any of them. I have owned 8 Piettas but still own 2, and one is broken. Including non BP guns, I have 12 Ubertis. I raise cattle in the "hills of West Virginia" and my Ubertis are my "FARM GUNS". BP and cartridge "cowboy" guns. I hunt with them, I have put down injured cows with them, killed coyotes with them. I have worn them in the worst weather possible, rain, snow, heat,mud, you name it. I have never had a problem with any of them. My Piettas broke down just doing Civil War reenactments once a month. I know some people have Piettas that have been going for 20 years without a problem. I guess EVERY time I ordered a Pietta I just got the crappy one of the bunch. The only "problem" I had with a Uberti was in a 51 navy copy. The day after I got it the hand spring broke. I got a new spring and have not had another problem with it since. I have to say in MY OPINION and experience, Uberti beats the pi$$ out of Pietta. Others feel differently. I don't know about Rugers. Hope I didn't ruffle any feathers.

Gaucho Gringo · June 10, 2010, 09:53 PM

I don't know, Uberti must have accumulated enough return guns to sell a bunch to Midway as refurbished guns. My post on it is here: http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=411732

MJN77 · June 10, 2010, 10:52 PM

Or they are returned to Midway and Midway refurbished them. Either way, how many threads are there about returning a Pietta to Cabelas because of problems? I know I have read a lot of them. When I am at Cabelas, I see alot of returned revolvers in the bargin cave. Someone said read the reviews on Cabela's site. How many bad comments do you think they want on their site?( not just Cabela's but any site with reviews) Too many bad reviews is bad for business. I am not saying there are not reliable Pietta revolvers out there. In fact I would like to have a Great Western II from EMF. I have just never had a "good" Pietta in my experience.

BlackPowderSmoke · June 11, 2010, 12:35 PM

Quote:

CVA?

CVA is not an manufacturer, they are an importer. One of the brands they import is Armi San Marco.

Dino. · June 11, 2010, 01:07 PM

Quote:

CVA is not an manufacturer, they are an importer. One of the brands they import is Armi San Marco.

Hmm ... Their website would lead you to believe they are a manufacture.
Regardless, a quick Google search will reveal alot of bad reviews for whoever makes the guns with their name on them.

pohill · June 11, 2010, 01:45 PM

There is another brand you might come across - High Standard. I have one, a brass framed Griswold & Gunnison .36. I think "madcratebuilder" has all the others that were ever made. I'm pretty sure they're Uberti parts, but they don't have any Italian markings at all. Nice guns.
I had an Armi San Marco Dragoon and it was a good shooter.

I recently bought a Pietta "Lawman", an 1860 .44 with the fluted cylinder and the white grips. It was considered used but it was unfired. It is a very well made gun - fit and finish are great. The first BP gun I ever owned is a regular Pietta 1860 .44, and its action is as smooth as any gun I've ever owned.
You cannot buy a BP revolver, other than a Ruger, and expect it to be as trouble free as a modern gun. Half the fun is working on them (as long as the problems are minor).

BlackPowderSmoke · June 11, 2010, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Their website would lead you to believe they are a manufacturer

i noticed that to Dino. Ran across it a while back when researching a CVA revolver on a gun auction. I kept on researching, found out they were importers. Heard a lot of bad things, too. I think ASM is like a lot of other Italian manufacturers, they should be examined on a piece by piece basis; they weren't all bad. Since, I couldn't have the rev in my hand to examine before laying the money down, I moved on.

madcratebuilder · June 12, 2010, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pohill

There is another brand you might come across - High Standard. I have one, a brass framed Griswold & Gunnison .36. I think "madcratebuilder" has all the others that were ever made. I'm pretty sure they're Uberti parts, but they don't have any Italian markings at all. Nice guns.
I had an Armi San Marco Dragoon and it was a good shooter.

Not many High Standards on the market and the ones that are seem to be way over priced. I guess that's what happens when they become "collectible".

High Standard did much the same as Colt did with the second gens. HS bought barrels, cylinders and grip frames from Uberti. Made their own frames, all small parts and grip panels. What's unique about the HS is there are no color case parts, everything is blued. The blue is a very dark and deep black finish like top of the line S&W.

They made a brass frame Schneider & Glassick, a brass frame Griswold & Gunnison(two version). A steel frame Leech & Rigdon. You would be hard pressed to find a better made version of these revolvers. Most of the HS records were lost in a fire so exact numbers are a guess, but about 1000 of each of the cased sets were made. There were four cased sets, I have three of them, two with matched serial numbers.

DrLaw · June 12, 2010, 08:08 AM

I have one Pedersoli. Very nice quality of wood and metal finish. Shoots great (once I went to the Black Powder forum and found guidance).

I have one Pietta. It came with tool marks about ten/fifteen years ago. I understand that their quality has gone up since then. Shoots fine, though, no timing issues.

I had one Armi San Marco. A piece of You-Know-What.

I have three Uberti's and no complaints about them whatsoever. Unlike some, I really do like the finish on the grips.

I have one Jukar, and it is a fun gun, once I figured out the hammer was not hitting the nipple squarely enough to fire the cap. It was a kit. You can find my photos of it on this and THR pages.

I would not hesitate to buy Uberti or Pedersoli.

I have a friend who has a Rogers & Spencer by Euroarms. It is also a nicely made gun.

The Doc is out now.

Dino. · June 12, 2010, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Quote by pohill: You cannot buy a BP revolver, other than a Ruger, and expect it to be as trouble free as a modern gun. Half the fun is working on them (as long as the problems are minor).

This has pretty much been my conclusion regarding BP handguns.
There is no such thing as "drop-in" parts as it appears that no two (even if it's the same model made by the same manufacture) are exactly the same. It's almost as if each handgun is custom made.

MJN77 · June 12, 2010, 10:04 AM

Originals were the same way.

pohill · June 12, 2010, 10:26 AM

The biggest probem I've had with the repro Colt open tops is a loose barrel/frame connection. Once the wedge gets worn a little, or the exit slot metal gets stretched, it throws everything off. I have an original Colt 1851 .36 made in 1862, and it's still tight at that connection. The difference is the wedge screw (and maybe the metal?). Colt intended the wedge screw to act as a depth set for the wedge to keep the connection tight -the head of the wedge screw in this gun is larger and actually contacts the slot in the wedge and does act as a set. At some point the wedge would have to be replaced, but until then the screw works well. I actually put a screw with an oversized head on my Pietta 1860 .44 and it tightened the connection up.
Beyond the history, the smoke, the BOOM, it's the minor repairs that make these guns interesting, and worth keeping as opposed to sending them back for a gun with new problems. That's why I like used guns.

June 9, 2010, 09:08 PM	#1
Dino. Junior member Join Date: November 2, 2006 Posts: 908	Brand Names Just curious what manufactures you guys would recommend as "good quality". At this time, I only own one black powder gun, which is made by Uberti. Though I've been somewhat disappointed in the so-called "drop-in" replacement parts (which may not even be made by Uberti), I would consider the overall quality of this gun VERY good. So what about other manufactures? ... Pietta? Palmetto? CVA? Others? Which would you guys recommend as "good quality" and which would you recommend staying away from? Thanks for the help.

June 9, 2010, 11:59 PM	#4
the rifleer Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2008 Location: Sunny California Posts: 1,281	I think that ubertis are better quality than pietta. __________________ There is no such thing as a stupid question, only stupid people.

June 10, 2010, 05:16 AM	#6
suzukibruce Senior Member Join Date: May 14, 2010 Location: camden maine Posts: 137	uberti is way better than pietta... just look at how many pietta's are getting returned vrs ubertis... __________________ Guns don't kill people, jealous husbands that come home from work early kill people

June 10, 2010, 06:12 PM	#12
robhof Senior Member Join Date: September 16, 2007 Posts: 712	robhof I have a ROA and a 31 San Marco; both bought used, the Ruger looked new and unfired and shoots great and as said above"built like a tank", the San Marco also had little use, but required much work to get it in good shooting condition. I have handled and shot both Pieta and Uberti and they're good guns, but you do get what you pay for.

June 10, 2010, 09:31 PM	#13
MJN77 Senior Member Join Date: April 27, 2009 Location: on a hill in West Virginia Posts: 789	"That's because more Pietta's are bought" That's because Pietta's are cheaper. People just getting into BP guns don't usually go to the more expensive copies. They just get one of the cheaper ones from Cabelas. That's what I did 15 years ago when I got into BP. After 3 different Piettas crapped out on me in about 5 years I went with the more expensive Ubertis and have never had but one problem with any of them. I have owned 8 Piettas but still own 2, and one is broken. Including non BP guns, I have 12 Ubertis. I raise cattle in the "hills of West Virginia" and my Ubertis are my "FARM GUNS". BP and cartridge "cowboy" guns. I hunt with them, I have put down injured cows with them, killed coyotes with them. I have worn them in the worst weather possible, rain, snow, heat,mud, you name it. I have never had a problem with any of them. My Piettas broke down just doing Civil War reenactments once a month. I know some people have Piettas that have been going for 20 years without a problem. I guess EVERY time I ordered a Pietta I just got the crappy one of the bunch. The only "problem" I had with a Uberti was in a 51 navy copy. The day after I got it the hand spring broke. I got a new spring and have not had another problem with it since. I have to say in MY OPINION and experience, Uberti beats the pi$$ out of Pietta. Others feel differently. I don't know about Rugers. Hope I didn't ruffle any feathers. Last edited by MJN77; June 10, 2010 at 11:18 PM.

June 9, 2010, 09:45 PM	#2
pohill Senior Member Join Date: December 27, 2005 Location: northeast Posts: 521	I've had good and bad Piettas and Ubertis. Palmetto does not have a good reputation but I had a decent Palmetto .31. I've never seen a bad Ruger Old Army - they're built like tanks, even if they're not historically accurate to anything but themselves. I like used guns - most of the bugs have been worked out and the prices are alot lower. If I buy a new gun with a small to medium problem, I try to work through it because you could return that gun for a new one and end up with worse problems. The devil you know... Plus, by working on the guns, you get to know them. I have two 3rd Generation Colt Signature Series revolvers and I do not think you will find any gun, anywhere, better than either of these. Fit, finish, functionality are just about perfect. And they look great. I have a few originals which are in a class of their own. It's a great obsession...I mean sport.

June 10, 2010, 02:44 AM	#5
arcticap Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2005 Location: Central Connecticut Posts: 3,166	*Euroarms* are good quality guns!

June 10, 2010, 07:05 AM	#7
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	My opinion, worth exactly twice what you paid for it: In descending order of 'quality'... Ruger Feinwerkbau US Firearms Colt 2nd Generation Colt 3rd Generation Fabriques d’Armes Unies de Liège Pedersoli Uberti Euroarms/Armi San Paolo Peitta Armi San Marco . . . . Palmetto The top 7 are so close in quality it's probably silly to attempt to rank them, but an opinion is just an opinion anyway. By the way, I own, or have owned at least one example (and usually more than one) of each of the above manufacturer's bp revolvers with the exception of USFA and Feinwerkbau. For those two I'm relying on others' opinions.

June 10, 2010, 08:09 AM	#9
Dino. Junior member Join Date: November 2, 2006 Posts: 908	This is good stuff. Thanks for all the feedback.

June 10, 2010, 09:48 AM	#10
ClemBert Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2009 Location: Orlando Posts: 936	A lot of times you get what you paid for. Oddly (or not) my rankings match that concept. From personal experience and ownership: 1. Ruger 2. Uberti 3. Pietta Ruger is way ahead of the other two. Uberti finish is much nicer than Pietta. Your mileage may vary.

June 10, 2010, 09:53 PM	#14
Gaucho Gringo Senior Member Join Date: May 17, 2007 Location: Vancouver, WA Posts: 366	I don't know, Uberti must have accumulated enough return guns to sell a bunch to Midway as refurbished guns. My post on it is here: http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=411732 __________________ 357 Taurus Gaucho, 22 Heritage RR, 2-Pietta 1858 44 NMA Remingtons, Pietta, Euroarms & ASM 36 1851 Navies, 31 Uberti 1849, 12 ga H&R Topper, 16 Ga Western Field, 43 Spanish Remington Rolling Block, 44 ASM Colt Walker, High Point C9 9mm, Winchester 1906 22, Rossi 62 22 rifle, Uberti 1860, H&A & IJ 32 S&W BreakTop, 36 Euroarms 1858, 32 H&R 04, 22mag NAA SS BP revolver, .44 Rodgers & Spencer, IJ 38 S&W BreakTop, IJ 22 Sealed 8

June 10, 2010, 10:52 PM	#15
MJN77 Senior Member Join Date: April 27, 2009 Location: on a hill in West Virginia Posts: 789	Or they are returned to Midway and Midway refurbished them. Either way, how many threads are there about returning a Pietta to Cabelas because of problems? I know I have read a lot of them. When I am at Cabelas, I see alot of returned revolvers in the bargin cave. Someone said read the reviews on Cabela's site. How many bad comments do you think they want on their site?( not just Cabela's but any site with reviews) Too many bad reviews is bad for business. I am not saying there are not reliable Pietta revolvers out there. In fact I would like to have a Great Western II from EMF. I have just never had a "good" Pietta in my experience. Last edited by MJN77; June 10, 2010 at 10:58 PM.

June 11, 2010, 01:45 PM	#18
pohill Senior Member Join Date: December 27, 2005 Location: northeast Posts: 521	There is another brand you might come across - High Standard. I have one, a brass framed Griswold & Gunnison .36. I think "madcratebuilder" has all the others that were ever made. I'm pretty sure they're Uberti parts, but they don't have any Italian markings at all. Nice guns. I had an Armi San Marco Dragoon and it was a good shooter. I recently bought a Pietta "Lawman", an 1860 .44 with the fluted cylinder and the white grips. It was considered used but it was unfired. It is a very well made gun - fit and finish are great. The first BP gun I ever owned is a regular Pietta 1860 .44, and its action is as smooth as any gun I've ever owned. You cannot buy a BP revolver, other than a Ruger, and expect it to be as trouble free as a modern gun. Half the fun is working on them (as long as the problems are minor). Last edited by pohill; June 12, 2010 at 07:49 PM.

June 12, 2010, 08:08 AM	#21
DrLaw Senior Member Join Date: June 3, 2007 Location: Wild Western Illinois Posts: 559	I have one Pedersoli. Very nice quality of wood and metal finish. Shoots great (once I went to the Black Powder forum and found guidance). I have one Pietta. It came with tool marks about ten/fifteen years ago. I understand that their quality has gone up since then. Shoots fine, though, no timing issues. I had one Armi San Marco. A piece of You-Know-What. I have three Uberti's and no complaints about them whatsoever. Unlike some, I really do like the finish on the grips. I have one Jukar, and it is a fun gun, once I figured out the hammer was not hitting the nipple squarely enough to fire the cap. It was a kit. You can find my photos of it on this and THR pages. I would not hesitate to buy Uberti or Pedersoli. I have a friend who has a Rogers & Spencer by Euroarms. It is also a nicely made gun. The Doc is out now. __________________ General McAuliffe said it best "Nuts."

June 12, 2010, 10:04 AM	#23
MJN77 Senior Member Join Date: April 27, 2009 Location: on a hill in West Virginia Posts: 789	Originals were the same way.

June 12, 2010, 10:26 AM	#24
pohill Senior Member Join Date: December 27, 2005 Location: northeast Posts: 521	The biggest probem I've had with the repro Colt open tops is a loose barrel/frame connection. Once the wedge gets worn a little, or the exit slot metal gets stretched, it throws everything off. I have an original Colt 1851 .36 made in 1862, and it's still tight at that connection. The difference is the wedge screw (and maybe the metal?). Colt intended the wedge screw to act as a depth set for the wedge to keep the connection tight -the head of the wedge screw in this gun is larger and actually contacts the slot in the wedge and does act as a set. At some point the wedge would have to be replaced, but until then the screw works well. I actually put a screw with an oversized head on my Pietta 1860 .44 and it tightened the connection up. Beyond the history, the smoke, the BOOM, it's the minor repairs that make these guns interesting, and worth keeping as opposed to sending them back for a gun with new problems. That's why I like used guns.