The real truth about the new 6.5 Creedmoor v/s the .308 - Page 3

OEF-Vet · October 23, 2011, 05:16 AM

Thank you for a well thought out educated opinion on 6.5 Creedmoor vs .308 Winchester. Your insight along with my own research has helped me make my decision on re-barreling my Rem 700 sps. My money can now be better spent on other shooting related things.

CPTMurdoc30 · October 23, 2011, 07:48 AM

Why even get a 6.5mm when you can go with a 6mm and still shoot to 1k? I have seen a 15 year old girl clean up at Quantico F-Class with a 243. A lot of guys are looking into cartridges like the 6xc (Tubbs as well). Guys on the US F-Class team and Palma team would love to shoot 6mm br for matches. The 6br, 6dasher, and 6XC shooting Tubbs DTAC 115gr bullets will hang with the 6.5 and 308 rifles out to 1k. Shooting a 115gr 6mm bullet is going to produce less recoil that any 6.5 or 308.

While the 308 is a good 1k performer it is far from the best. I personally know guys who use 22 cal and 20 cal rifles to shoot 1k + on Prairie Dogs.

The 6.5 creedmore was designed for one thing. It does that one thing very well and can do plenty more as well.

Fullboar · October 23, 2011, 08:14 AM

Here's a good thread on the .260, the discussion is the 260 vs 308 and the 6.5 Creedmore
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthrea...highlight=.260

Jim243 · October 23, 2011, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Why even get a 6.5mm when you can go with a 6mm and still shoot to 1k? I have seen a 15 year old girl clean up at Quantico F-Class with a 243.

I love these descussions about ancient fire arms (anything developed 30 years or longer ago). The ONLY reason the 6.5 is still in existance is it will fit in an AR frame. I am sorry the last time I looked at the rack of rifles at Cabela's and Gander Mtn. I don't remenber seeing any 6.5s there. Why because they don't sell and are not as popular as the 243 or 270. And if you want to cry in your beer about barrel life, buy a 243 it's barrel life is MUCH shorter than the 6.5. But a Savage 243 can change out the barrel in about 10 min with a go/no-go gauge and that 15 year old girl can do it herself.

As to the 308 (I'll catch hell about this) it is a nice footnote in history and has outlived it's usefulness. I love my 30-06 but don't shoot it any more maybe once a year for about 10 rounds to check my zero. If I am hunting I use my 35 remington or 270 winchester depending on terrain. Like I said we love to reminisce over ancient history and hold on to our favorite calibers. Do they still work, yes! But at a cost. Me, I am holding off till the Wizardelectric 2200 comes out in the year 2200 that shoots a bolt of plasma at just under the speed of light. Till then a 243 at 4,000 fps will have to do.

Have fun finding 6.5 ammo.
Jim

Zak Smith · October 23, 2011, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Why even get a 6.5mm when you can go with a 6mm and still shoot to 1k? I have seen a 15 year old girl clean up at Quantico F-Class with a 243.

I love these descussions about ancient fire arms (anything developed 30 years or longer ago). The ONLY reason the 6.5 is still in existance is it will fit in an AR frame.

Your statement doesn't make sense. All of the following - 6.5 Creedmoor, .260 Rem, .243 Win - will "fit" in an AR-10 action, but not an AR-15.

As for 6.5mm vs. 6mm, generally for similar long-range performance the 6mm has less barrel life. The 6mm BC values do not quite match 6.5mm either.

Quote:

As to the 308 (I'll catch hell about this) it is a nice footnote in history and has outlived it's usefulness.

If we're talking about reality, .308 will not be a footnote even when it is finally replaced. After all, it has been a service cartridge throughout the world for over 50 years and new weapons systems are still being procured chambered for it.

Darren007 · October 23, 2011, 04:37 PM

Someone please put this 3 year old thread to death already...

blacksky · November 26, 2011, 01:42 AM

For a shooter that is looking for Distance, Accuracy and Energy @ POI... From a Bolt Action, 26", 1" Bull Barrel, does the 6.5 Creedmoor have all of these factors?

blacksky · November 26, 2011, 01:45 AM

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/71097

reynolds357 · December 11, 2012, 10:57 PM

I have a Savage on order in 6.5 Creedmoor. I probably wont shoot 1000yd competition with it, but it is a cartridge that interests me. Balistically, as has been demonstrated in this thread earlier, the .308 Winchester is not even in the ballpark with the Creedmore. At the moment, my 1000yd rig is a .284 Winchester. At the moment, the cartridge to beat at our 1000Yd. matches is a .270 WSM necked down to 6mm. Its not the typical 6x.270 WSM, but a wildcat cooked up by one of the shooters. It has no taper and an ackley type shoulder that is pushed up ridiculously far, but its the cartridge to beat at the moment.

**JohnKSa** · December 11, 2012, 11:24 PM

Interesting footnote from the 2011 Shooter's Bash match held at Rifles Only.

The article was in the August 2012 issue of Guns Magazine. Shooter’s Bash 2011, A Tactical Match at Rifles Only by Jacob Gottfriedson

Out of the top 10 finishers:

3 were shooting the .243 Win (1st, 9th & 10th)
4 were shooting the .260 Rem, (2nd through 5th places)
1 was shooting 6mm Creedmoor (6th)
1 was shooting 300WM (7th)
1 was shooting 7mm WSM (8th)

I've also heard/read that the .260 is very popular at silhouette matches.

stubbicatt · December 12, 2012, 09:03 AM

Wow Necro-thread!

Bart B. · December 12, 2012, 08:00 PM

In its heyday in match rifles, the .308 has a barrel life of 2000 rounds of pristine accuracy; about 1000 more of very good accuracy. And .243's about 1000 rounds at pristine level, 500 more of very good accuracy.

Lessdrop · February 14, 2013, 01:01 AM

well said, kraigwy. one thing not mentioned. here. is the creed -(retains) moor energy past 1000 yds than does the 300mag.
anyone know how to remove muzz - break on savage long range hunter? it's the on-off type.
thanks, and I hope everyone acheives
lessdrop

Zak Smith · February 14, 2013, 01:13 AM

Quote:

one thing not mentioned. here. is the creed -(retains) moor energy past 1000 yds than does the 300mag.

Fail.

Code:

_Bullet_           _BC_ _MV_         0     500    1000    1500 | YARDS
300WM 210VLD      0.631 2850 >    2850    2187    1628    1213 | velocity (fps)
300WM 185Hyb      0.569 3025 >    3025    2268    1639    1186 | velocity (fps)
6.5 140           0.612 2820 >    2820    2143    1577    1172 | velocity (fps)

300WM 210VLD      0.631 2850 >    0.00   13.17   60.58  157.28 | wind (inches)
300WM 185Hyb      0.569 3025 >    0.00   13.58   63.37  167.28 | wind (inches)
6.5 140           0.612 2820 >    0.00   13.84   64.06  166.49 | wind (inches)

@ 1400 yards
300/210 685 ft*lbs
300/185 577 ft*lbs
6.5/140 426 ft*lbs

@ 1000 yards
300/210 1234 ft*lbs
300/185 1102 ft*lbs
6.5/140 772 ft*lbs

Even if you could fire a 140 at 3000 fps from a 6.5 CM, using the same conditions as above it would only retain 1702 fps at 1000 yards and still have 27% less energy.

Lessdrop · February 14, 2013, 01:39 AM

sorry god, ispoke out of bad vison and fogot to insert 180 and 140 but still I was wrong they'rs equals according to, calc on big, game info.
still lessdrop:-)

Zak Smith · February 14, 2013, 01:41 AM

Quote:

still lessdrop:-)

Try again?

Code:

_Bullet_           _BC_ _MV_         0     500    1000    1500 | YARDS
300WM 210VLD      0.631 2850 >   -0.00    2.50    7.65   15.64 | drop (mil)
300WM 185Hyb      0.569 3025 >   -0.00    2.22    7.04   14.87 | drop (mil)
6.5 140           0.612 2820 >   -0.00    2.59    7.97   16.45 | drop (mil)

Lessdrop · October 14, 2013, 10:21 AM

Just my signature, not a ballistic claim, oh tay?
Lessdrop
(We all look for...)

Here's a good one, i tried to find out what it was that made me say that energy stuff, and i found the article- started out something like "the trajectory either beats or stays right with the 300 mag, with half the recoil of a .308, and with 30g less mass, retains more energy (than the. 308)
Thats where i was confused, and when i looked to see who the author was, well...it was...YOU.
Thanks for clearing up my confusion, tho. Didn't mean to speak with false facts.
Can i go to the range now? I know i'll sleep better.
peace thru bigger firestick
Lessdrol

October 23, 2011, 05:16 AM	#51
OEF-Vet Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2011 Location: Backwoods, PA Posts: 284	Thanks Thank you for a well thought out educated opinion on 6.5 Creedmoor vs .308 Winchester. Your insight along with my own research has helped me make my decision on re-barreling my Rem 700 sps. My money can now be better spent on other shooting related things.

October 23, 2011, 07:48 AM	#52
CPTMurdoc30 Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2008 Location: Stafford VA Posts: 969	Why even get a 6.5mm when you can go with a 6mm and still shoot to 1k? I have seen a 15 year old girl clean up at Quantico F-Class with a 243. A lot of guys are looking into cartridges like the 6xc (Tubbs as well). Guys on the US F-Class team and Palma team would love to shoot 6mm br for matches. The 6br, 6dasher, and 6XC shooting Tubbs DTAC 115gr bullets will hang with the 6.5 and 308 rifles out to 1k. Shooting a 115gr 6mm bullet is going to produce less recoil that any 6.5 or 308. While the 308 is a good 1k performer it is far from the best. I personally know guys who use 22 cal and 20 cal rifles to shoot 1k + on Prairie Dogs. The 6.5 creedmore was designed for one thing. It does that one thing very well and can do plenty more as well. __________________ Solving Virginia's Ground Hog problems 50gr at a time.....

November 26, 2011, 01:42 AM	#57
blacksky Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2008 Location: OH Posts: 741	Keeping this thread alive.............. For a shooter that is looking for Distance, Accuracy and Energy @ POI... From a Bolt Action, 26", 1" Bull Barrel, does the 6.5 Creedmoor have all of these factors? __________________ By the choices we make, we define ourselves, thereby revealing what we truly care about. Last edited by blacksky; November 26, 2011 at 02:11 AM.

November 26, 2011, 01:45 AM	#58
blacksky Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2008 Location: OH Posts: 741	Looking at this Savage 6.5 Creedmoor Rifle http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/71097 __________________ By the choices we make, we define ourselves, thereby revealing what we truly care about.

December 11, 2012, 11:24 PM	#60
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 24,969	Interesting footnote from the 2011 Shooter's Bash match held at Rifles Only. The article was in the August 2012 issue of Guns Magazine. Shooter’s Bash 2011, A Tactical Match at Rifles Only by Jacob Gottfriedson Out of the top 10 finishers: 3 were shooting the .243 Win (1st, 9th & 10th) 4 were shooting the .260 Rem, (2nd through 5th places) 1 was shooting 6mm Creedmoor (6th) 1 was shooting 300WM (7th) 1 was shooting 7mm WSM (8th) I've also heard/read that the .260 is very popular at silhouette matches. __________________ Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?

October 23, 2011, 08:14 AM	#53
Fullboar Senior Member Join Date: January 4, 2011 Location: North Queensland, Australia Posts: 218	Here's a good thread on the .260, the discussion is the 260 vs 308 and the 6.5 Creedmore http://www.thehighroad.org/showthrea...highlight=.260

October 23, 2011, 04:37 PM	#56
Darren007 Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 1,053	Someone please put this 3 year old thread to death already...

December 11, 2012, 10:57 PM	#59
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,164	I have a Savage on order in 6.5 Creedmoor. I probably wont shoot 1000yd competition with it, but it is a cartridge that interests me. Balistically, as has been demonstrated in this thread earlier, the .308 Winchester is not even in the ballpark with the Creedmore. At the moment, my 1000yd rig is a .284 Winchester. At the moment, the cartridge to beat at our 1000Yd. matches is a .270 WSM necked down to 6mm. Its not the typical 6x.270 WSM, but a wildcat cooked up by one of the shooters. It has no taper and an ackley type shoulder that is pushed up ridiculously far, but its the cartridge to beat at the moment.

December 12, 2012, 09:03 AM	#61
stubbicatt Senior Member Join Date: September 15, 2007 Posts: 1,707	Wow Necro-thread!

December 12, 2012, 08:00 PM	#62
Bart B. Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Posts: 8,927	In its heyday in match rifles, the .308 has a barrel life of 2000 rounds of pristine accuracy; about 1000 more of very good accuracy. And .243's about 1000 rounds at pristine level, 500 more of very good accuracy.

February 14, 2013, 01:01 AM	#63
Lessdrop Junior Member Join Date: September 21, 2011 Posts: 6	new guy well said, kraigwy. one thing not mentioned. here. is the creed -(retains) moor energy past 1000 yds than does the 300mag. anyone know how to remove muzz - break on savage long range hunter? it's the on-off type. thanks, and I hope everyone acheives lessdrop

February 14, 2013, 01:39 AM	#65
Lessdrop Junior Member Join Date: September 21, 2011 Posts: 6	oops sorry god, ispoke out of bad vison and fogot to insert 180 and 140 but still I was wrong they'rs equals according to, calc on big, game info. still lessdrop:-)

October 14, 2013, 10:21 AM	#67
Lessdrop Junior Member Join Date: September 21, 2011 Posts: 6	Hey zak Just my signature, not a ballistic claim, oh tay? Lessdrop (We all look for...) Here's a good one, i tried to find out what it was that made me say that energy stuff, and i found the article- started out something like "the trajectory either beats or stays right with the 300 mag, with half the recoil of a .308, and with 30g less mass, retains more energy (than the. 308) Thats where i was confused, and when i looked to see who the author was, well...it was...YOU. Thanks for clearing up my confusion, tho. Didn't mean to speak with false facts. Can i go to the range now? I know i'll sleep better. peace thru bigger firestick Lessdrol Last edited by Lessdrop; October 14, 2013 at 10:47 AM. Reason: Just for grins1

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