grrr... FTF with .45 acp in 1911 - Page 2

ghbucky01 · March 11, 2014, 08:02 PM

You all are great!

This would be a really frustrating experience without having this source to use, so thank you, thank you, thank you!

I found a tutorial buried in the archives here that recommends using a factory round that loads well to help set your bullet seating depth. So, I followed that tidbit and got a length of 1.232.

I made up 7 dummies at that length with a .472 crimp, loaded up a mag and cycled them through my 1911 3 times back to back with 0 FTF

Now I get to pull about 40 rounds and make up some loads for the range tomorrow.

Misssissippi Dave · March 12, 2014, 07:19 PM

I forgot to mention the dummy round also have to not be too long to work easily in the magazines. Too long and they will get stuck. Often the magazine forces you to load shorter than the rifling in many pistols. It seems you are on your way to developing a load that works for you. Next you need to find out if they cycle well and are accurate. There is a learning curve to reloading. Once you get ammo that is cycling well and is accurate for your needs you have gotten over the hardest part. You will continue to learn more as you continue in this great hobby.

ghbucky01 · March 12, 2014, 07:28 PM

Thanks!

Put together 100 rounds last night and just got back from the range.

Better! But, I still had 8 FTF out of the 100 rounds. I kept them aside them and will take a closer look to see if I can figure it out.

But, I guess because of the decreased pressure from the increased OAL, I am now getting a lot of unburnt powder.

I would increase the charge, but my books tell me that I can only go to 6.7gr, and I am at 6.5.

Full stats: 6.5gr IMR SR4756, 230 gr LRN bullet. OAL is now 1.232 This powder only gives me .5 gr between min and max per IMR, but I can't find anything else to load with right now.

riverratt · March 13, 2014, 03:06 AM

As stated before the C.O.L. given in you book tends to be the min. For safety and i have found the max powder charge tends to be set at that seating deapth, though i could be wrong. In my personal loads i have found that increasing C.O.L. reduces presure and thus needs more powder to preform and burn clean.

If i was having you problem i would make 3 rounds ea in .1gr incraments until you find the first sign of over presure. With my loads it has always been a createrd primer or marks on the headstamp from flowing brass. This will give you a true max load for your load. Make a note of that load every detail and never load it again. Then find a spot inbetween where you are now and your true max that you are happy with, preferably closer to where your at now.

Just remember if you change anything no matter how minuet it may seem it changes your max load. So if you change anything reduce you charge and work back up just to be on the safe side. I keep a book with all the safe interchangable componets on my bench so i know what i can use or havnt used yet just in case.

riverratt · March 13, 2014, 04:40 AM

Oops i read my last post and realized i forgot an important piece of info when working up above max published data i NEVER GO ABOVE 10% OF MAX. The presure curve is no a constant .1gr will not simply mean another 100psi or whatever it increases dramatically .1gr may very well be 100psi but another .1gr may add 500psi.

I have found in the three powders that ive loaded .45 230gr lrn with the sweet shooting spot has been the 800fps mark (published velocity). This is out of 2 .45's although the powders dont seem to burn to clean. I dont know about your powder/gun it may very well be different.

parttime · March 13, 2014, 07:34 AM

The first sticky of this forum is dedicated to the reloading of 230 grn. lead bullets in the .45 acp.

Read that sticky. Thread #27 of that sticky by "UNCLENICK" should clear up any COL issues.

Also, do not be afraid to TAPER taper crimp down to .470.

I have a Ruger SR 1911 that was doing the same thing that you are experiencing. I had my lead rounds crimped down to .472-.473. When I recrimped them to .470-.471 all problems went away.

I have since fired over 500 rounds of both 200 gr. lead SWC and 230 gr. lead round nose without any issues at all.

WESHOOT2 · March 14, 2014, 11:45 AM

OAL 1.255"+/-.005"

Crimp .469--.471"

Charge is up to you

ghbucky01 · March 17, 2014, 07:46 PM

I re-worked my OAL and came up with 1.26.

Per suggestions, I worked up from my original charge and found just adding .2gr eliminated the unburnt powder.

I cranked out a batch and fired through 70 of them tonight with no malfunctions at all!

Of course, that was also the last of my 230gr LRN, so I get to start over with 200gr LSWC, but I think I've got the hang of it now.

Thanks so much for all the help that has been provided.

Don P · March 18, 2014, 09:40 AM

I found the plunk test to be the best. True no 2 chambers are exactly alike and I have the oal gages from Dillon. Still prefer to use the plunk test. You may experience feeding issues with the semi-wad cutters. My 1911 does not like them maybe yours will. Only way to know is try them. Like Weshoot2 stated my loads work best at a oal of 1.250-1.255

Toolman · March 19, 2014, 06:15 PM

For .45ACP I load a 230 gr RNFMJ over 7.0 gr of True Blue. the COAL is 1.269". That round runs great in my Colt 1911's and Springfield XD.

Don P · March 20, 2014, 10:24 AM

Quote:

the COAL is 1.269".

Man thats long. My 3- 45 acps won't think of chambering a round that long

cosh · March 20, 2014, 01:57 PM

I also had problems with handloads feeding into the chamber. After doing a Flitz polish of the chamber and plunk test, I found that anything over .472" diameter were tight. Factory loads were about .470-.471" diameter. I don't use a Lee FCD, but adjusted my seating die to taper the loaded diameter to .470". I also measure factory rounds to make sure none are over .471 diameter.

steve1147 · March 21, 2014, 06:40 AM

I had the same issue years ago when I first started loading .45acp with Lee 230 gn micro-groove lead bullets. Instead of being anal about col, I set the top band on the bullet just ahead of the crimp, providing kinda a ramp between the bullet head and brass, light crimp with lee fcd, problem solved, and ended up with a col of 1.270

Jeffm004 · March 22, 2014, 08:55 PM

I was out fussing with the 230 grn SNS coated today. My first time loading them. I had one not feed twice. I took it home. All others were 1.251. The problem cartridge was 1.243. Federal fmj, 1.269. Fed crimp, .472, berry same setup, .470, SNS coated problem .472, typical SNS .470. I'll pull it tomorrow and see if I can isolate case vs bullet. Running 5.5 grns of ww231 in everything. The SNS were noticeably more accurate than the berry. A good inch or two.

March 13, 2014, 07:34 AM	#31
parttime Member Join Date: August 25, 2009 Location: Minnesota Posts: 82	The first sticky of this forum is dedicated to the reloading of 230 grn. lead bullets in the .45 acp. Read that sticky. Thread #27 of that sticky by "UNCLENICK" should clear up any COL issues. Also, do not be afraid to TAPER taper crimp down to .470. I have a Ruger SR 1911 that was doing the same thing that you are experiencing. I had my lead rounds crimped down to .472-.473. When I recrimped them to .470-.471 all problems went away. I have since fired over 500 rounds of both 200 gr. lead SWC and 230 gr. lead round nose without any issues at all. __________________ The wants of the many DO NOT outweigh my needs.

March 14, 2014, 11:45 AM	#32
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	then try 'em in your buddy's 1911? OAL 1.255"+/-.005" Crimp .469--.471" Charge is up to you __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

March 17, 2014, 07:46 PM	#33
ghbucky01 Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2014 Location: Northern, KY Posts: 176	Production!!!! I re-worked my OAL and came up with 1.26. Per suggestions, I worked up from my original charge and found just adding .2gr eliminated the unburnt powder. I cranked out a batch and fired through 70 of them tonight with no malfunctions at all! Of course, that was also the last of my 230gr LRN, so I get to start over with 200gr LSWC, but I think I've got the hang of it now. Thanks so much for all the help that has been provided.

March 18, 2014, 09:40 AM	#34
Don P Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 2005 Location: Swamp dweller Posts: 6,187	I found the plunk test to be the best. True no 2 chambers are exactly alike and I have the oal gages from Dillon. Still prefer to use the plunk test. You may experience feeding issues with the semi-wad cutters. My 1911 does not like them maybe yours will. Only way to know is try them. Like Weshoot2 stated my loads work best at a oal of 1.250-1.255 __________________ *NRA Life Member, NRA Chief Range Safety Officer, NRA Certified Pistol Instructor,, USPSA & Steel Challange NROI Range Officer, ICORE Range Officer, ,MAG 40 Graduate* *As you are, I once was, As I am, You will be.*

March 19, 2014, 06:15 PM	#35
Toolman Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 514	For .45ACP I load a 230 gr RNFMJ over 7.0 gr of True Blue. the COAL is 1.269". That round runs great in my Colt 1911's and Springfield XD. __________________ Crime Control. NOT Gun Control.

March 11, 2014, 08:02 PM	#26
ghbucky01 Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2014 Location: Northern, KY Posts: 176	You all are great! This would be a really frustrating experience without having this source to use, so thank you, thank you, thank you! I found a tutorial buried in the archives here that recommends using a factory round that loads well to help set your bullet seating depth. So, I followed that tidbit and got a length of 1.232. I made up 7 dummies at that length with a .472 crimp, loaded up a mag and cycled them through my 1911 3 times back to back with 0 FTF Now I get to pull about 40 rounds and make up some loads for the range tomorrow.

March 12, 2014, 07:19 PM	#27
Misssissippi Dave Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Posts: 1,411	I forgot to mention the dummy round also have to not be too long to work easily in the magazines. Too long and they will get stuck. Often the magazine forces you to load shorter than the rifling in many pistols. It seems you are on your way to developing a load that works for you. Next you need to find out if they cycle well and are accurate. There is a learning curve to reloading. Once you get ammo that is cycling well and is accurate for your needs you have gotten over the hardest part. You will continue to learn more as you continue in this great hobby.

March 12, 2014, 07:28 PM	#28
ghbucky01 Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2014 Location: Northern, KY Posts: 176	Thanks! Put together 100 rounds last night and just got back from the range. Better! But, I still had 8 FTF out of the 100 rounds. I kept them aside them and will take a closer look to see if I can figure it out. But, I guess because of the decreased pressure from the increased OAL, I am now getting a lot of unburnt powder. I would increase the charge, but my books tell me that I can only go to 6.7gr, and I am at 6.5. Full stats: 6.5gr IMR SR4756, 230 gr LRN bullet. OAL is now 1.232 This powder only gives me .5 gr between min and max per IMR, but I can't find anything else to load with right now.

March 13, 2014, 03:06 AM	#29
riverratt Senior Member Join Date: February 21, 2014 Posts: 314	As stated before the C.O.L. given in you book tends to be the min. For safety and i have found the max powder charge tends to be set at that seating deapth, though i could be wrong. In my personal loads i have found that increasing C.O.L. reduces presure and thus needs more powder to preform and burn clean. If i was having you problem i would make 3 rounds ea in .1gr incraments until you find the first sign of over presure. With my loads it has always been a createrd primer or marks on the headstamp from flowing brass. This will give you a true max load for your load. Make a note of that load every detail and never load it again. Then find a spot inbetween where you are now and your true max that you are happy with, preferably closer to where your at now. Just remember if you change anything no matter how minuet it may seem it changes your max load. So if you change anything reduce you charge and work back up just to be on the safe side. I keep a book with all the safe interchangable componets on my bench so i know what i can use or havnt used yet just in case.

March 13, 2014, 04:40 AM	#30
riverratt Senior Member Join Date: February 21, 2014 Posts: 314	Oops i read my last post and realized i forgot an important piece of info when working up above max published data i NEVER GO ABOVE 10% OF MAX. The presure curve is no a constant .1gr will not simply mean another 100psi or whatever it increases dramatically .1gr may very well be 100psi but another .1gr may add 500psi. I have found in the three powders that ive loaded .45 230gr lrn with the sweet shooting spot has been the 800fps mark (published velocity). This is out of 2 .45's although the powders dont seem to burn to clean. I dont know about your powder/gun it may very well be different.

March 20, 2014, 01:57 PM	#37
cosh Member Join Date: August 14, 2013 Posts: 39	I also had problems with handloads feeding into the chamber. After doing a Flitz polish of the chamber and plunk test, I found that anything over .472" diameter were tight. Factory loads were about .470-.471" diameter. I don't use a Lee FCD, but adjusted my seating die to taper the loaded diameter to .470". I also measure factory rounds to make sure none are over .471 diameter.

March 21, 2014, 06:40 AM	#38
steve1147 Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Location: Valles Mines, Missouri Posts: 142	I had the same issue years ago when I first started loading .45acp with Lee 230 gn micro-groove lead bullets. Instead of being anal about col, I set the top band on the bullet just ahead of the crimp, providing kinda a ramp between the bullet head and brass, light crimp with lee fcd, problem solved, and ended up with a col of 1.270 __________________ Circa 1964: Rocky to Bullwinkle: "But that trick never works!" But Bullwinkle tries it anyway...again and again

March 22, 2014, 08:55 PM	#39
Jeffm004 Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2013 Location: SW Ohio Posts: 255	I was out fussing with the 230 grn SNS coated today. My first time loading them. I had one not feed twice. I took it home. All others were 1.251. The problem cartridge was 1.243. Federal fmj, 1.269. Fed crimp, .472, berry same setup, .470, SNS coated problem .472, typical SNS .470. I'll pull it tomorrow and see if I can isolate case vs bullet. Running 5.5 grns of ww231 in everything. The SNS were noticeably more accurate than the berry. A good inch or two.