Please Help Me Pick a Duty Shotgun

[224Man]

I need to purchase a duty shotgun within the next 6 weeks's. I have been looking at a number of models so far my best choices seem to be:

Customized from Vang Comp ( www.vangcomp.com ):

Mossberg 590A-1 - $695

Remington 870P - $1195

Remington 1187P - $1200

Or Stock:

Remington 1187P with GRS, 18 1/2" - ~$800

Benelli's: M1, M3, M4, or Nova Tactical Pump ( www.benelliusa.com )

These are all approved by my agency. I will be using standard 2 3/4" buckshot and slugs no beanbags or other light loads. The Mossberg 590 I would upgrade with a Surefire forend light. Is having semi-automatic capability worth the price difference over pump?

Right now I'm leaning towards the Vang-Comped 590 or 1187P but would appreciate your opinions.

Thanks,

224Man

[Denny Hansen]

I lean towards an 870 myself, but I know several folks who swear by their 590s. The SureFire forend, IMO, is a must have for a duty/HD shotgun. If the budget is a concern, I'd go with the 590 with the upgrade.

Denny

[jekla]

i tend to like the benelli m4 especially with pistol grip. though compared to vang comp guns you mentioned i think this would be considered a stock gun.

[strider72]

Have to lean toward the 870p myself.

[grimel]

While I really really like the Benelli/Beretta autos (and the Nova pump). For your needs the Mossberg is far and away the most bang for the buck.

[Bruce Layne]

I finally got around to buying a tactical shotgun for personal defense use. I just bought the Mosberg 590 (50668) because it seemed to offer the best value for my money. A pro might make a different choice. I might swap out the plastic safety for the metal one used by the US military, even though the plastic one seems well made and is situated where it doesn't seem likely to break.

I liked the fact that the 50668 came factory stock with 8+1 capacity, very nice Ghost Ring sights, parkerized finish and a Davis SpeedFeed stock that holds four shells. I keep four slugs in the SpeedFeed. It seems like Mossberg knew what features a good tactical shotgun would need and offered them at a good price. They have many different versions of the 590, so you can order what you like. Besides avoiding the hassle and expense of buying a lot of add ons to make the shotgun I wanted, I feel very confident the factory features are reliable, as opposed to, say, adding an extension tube and not being 100% sure about the spring tension, hangups where the extension joins the main magazine, or potential weakness of a threaded aftermarket add-on. I'd generally prefer that the manufacturer does as much as possible.

Here are the various Mossberg tactical shotguns with retail pricing:
http://www.mossberg.com/pcatalog/Specpurp.htm

Here is a good internet price on the shotgun I purchased:
http://www.snipercountrypx.com/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idproduct=2168

Here is a better local deal I missed out on:
http://www.kyimports.com/rifle3.htm

I haven't shot my new shotgun enough to comment on the long trerm reliability, but it has a good reputation and seems well made. It feeds 2 3/4" shells very smoothly. I can't comment on professional use, other than to say many police and military units use the Mossberg 590, but I can say it seems plenty fine for home defense. If it was good enough for the US Marine Corp, it's good enough for me, even though it looks like they're moving to a semiauto shotgun.
http://www.hqmc.usmc.mil/factfile.ns...0?OpenDocument

On the down side, if you get the factory Ghost Ring sites, the factory barrel heat shroud does not fit. It's one or the other. They also offer a heavy duty barrel, although I can't imagine wearing out the standard barrel.

A lot of people on this forum are almost religious about their 870s. I'm sure they're very nice and I wouldn't offer a critical word against the 870. They seem to operate on similar principles as the Mossberg 590.

[Brian Williams]

The biggest thing is the difference in the safety and the reciever material
870 has a button safety on the triggerguard and steel receiver
590 has a tang slide safety and a Aluminum receiver I think.
Get something and shoot it. But ammo, use up and repeat
then build it as needed when you find what you like.

I would go with a 870P and shoot it, then send it to VC if needed

[224Man]

Thanks for all the replies so far. Right now I think I'll go with a Remington 870P package that includes Surefire 618FA, Speedfeed IV stock and ghostring sights. Out the door it will be about $800 and I can always take it to VC later for the porting and VC system.

[fed168]

If you look at the 11-87, make sure it will function with all ammo. Mine seems to be low brass sensitive.

[dfaugh]

But I always choose the Mossbergs.... for the simple fact that in 30+ years of shooting, I've never owned anything but 500 variants, and in all that time I've never had any failures, of any kind...They are also generally the least expensive, in any class...Seems like a lot of LEOs prefer 870s, but I've not seen much that tells me why they consider them any better (and I'm sure they're very good, considering what I've read).

For reliability, I would always choose a pump over a semi, simply because there's more that can go wrong with a semi, and in a life-or-death situation, even the slightest increased chance of a problem is unacceptable. If you practice with a pump, speed isn't much of a factor, you can throw lead pretty fast.

My 2 cents, YMMV

[Hawgleg44]

I like the 870's, but I prefer the Mossy 590A1. I agree that a light is a smart move for a duty gun, but why are you considering the other modifications? I've carried an 870 and a 590 on duty and haven't had a problem with either factory gun.

I'd save the money, buy a stock 590A1 for much less than the Remington you are looking at and add the light to it. If you look around, you should be able to find a 590 in the $300 range.

[mgdavis]

I've never really paid attention to the 590, but I haven't heard anything bad about it. I would tend to stay away from an autoloader, just personal preference. As far as I am concerned, the 870 is The King of shotguns.

[Manchu]

Honestly, I wouldn't have any issues with any of the ones you're considering. I couldn't be any happier with my 870 HD, it has performed flawlessly for me. With that said, if I had to choose, though, and under the circumstances you mentioned, I'd go with the stock 11-87P. While pumps are inherently going to be more reliable, they have their drawbacks as well. Besides, if some were to apply the same logic regarding pumps and autos to handguns they'd be carrying Colt SAA revolvers instead of autos.
With heavy loads a pump will dang near knock the sense out of most people, this can get real painful during extended live-fire drills. The auto on the other hand does an outstanding job at soaking up recoil as compared to pumps. And just as well, the 11-87P was designed to function with these full-powered loads in mind. In addition, that automatic can lay down some serious firepower. I've seen guys that could perform controlled pairs (double taps) with an auto that sounded as though they were one continuous shot, and could run through a course scary fast. This could be life saving if you were to ever find yourself as the #1-man in a stack. Even if someone was able to operate a pump fast enough, the recoil and recovery time alone would prohibit follow up shots at the same speed, and though I've heard many say that they could shoot their pump just as fast as any auto, I've yet to personally see any.
As for price differences, a local LEO dealer here only has about a $200 price difference between stock 870P's and 11-87P's (>$450 vs. >$650, respectively).
Good luck with whatever you choose!!

[Geoff Timm]

For modern duty use, with all the circumstances specified, I have to give the nod to a semi-auto. Prone position rapid fire is a major consideration. You have to move to use the pump and this draws fire, not to mention changing your firing position.

But, practice, practice practice. Especially with rifle sights.

Geoff
Who packs a pump, but is not expected to go in harm's way.

[9mmMike]

I voted (a little late) for the 870P / Vang.

What did you get? How's it working out?

Mike

[tc300mag1]

Vang Comped 870P would have to be my choice.

[Gewehr98]

But the Vang Comp package isn't really necessary for an effective pump 12 gauge. Get the gun, work with it for a while, then decide whether the extra expenditure is really called for.

[224Man]

Thank you all for your valuable input. It was very helpful, there are so many excellent choices available for the modern shotgunner it is difficult to choose.

I purchased a Remington 870P with 18" bbl. XS front site and Wilson Combat ghost ring rear site. It was $540, I just ordered a Surefire 618FA forend light Bungee Cord type tac sling and Wilson Combat's 2-shot extension, side saddle and oversize safety from Brownells. I'm out the door at $870 for what I feel is an excellent day/night weapons system. I'm going to take Eric's suggestion and see how it shoots stock before I pay for the Vang Comp mod.

I chose the 870 over the 1187 for two reasons, first was price with the cost difference I was able to add the Surefire forend. Second the distruter's LE rep told me felt the 1187 was an excellent competition gun but he would choose the 870 or 590 for duty use. The recoil of 12 gauge pumps has never bothered me that much with a fixed stock, and decent recoil pad. I absolutely hate weapons malfunctions(I get enough from my Bushmaster AR15 :barf: ) so I wanted something I would never have to worry about.

The fit and finish on this gun is excellent and it is running flawlessly. Thank you all again for your help.

224Man