Old wads....advice

[darkgael]

This past weekend I acquired a large box full of old shotgun wads - early plastic wads from Federal, Winchester and Alcan. I'm wanting to play a bit with these.
I've attached a picture. There are(l to r.) WAA12XW, Federal Champion 7/8 size, and Alcan #s 3-4-5 and one labeled E20.


Any advice on their possible use? I have a 2nd edition Lyman Shotshell manual; it refers to a number of these. I also have about 1000 Federal paper hulls - many in good shape. I have about twenty Alcan zinc hulls.
One issue that I have is powder.....many of the loads in Lyman refer to powders no longer in production - Win 473AA, Win. 452, a number of Alcan powders.
Are there safe substitutions?
For my Trap loads now, I'm using Red Dot or SR 7625 in Win AA hulls and WAA12 or Rem. Fig.8 wads.


Pete

[oneounceload]

Here's a chart with burn rates - seems 473 is still listed on there - I would loko to either side and start on the lower end if faster:

http://www.reloadbench.com/burn.html

which would mean International Clays

Not too sure about the wads though - maybe grampa Zippy remembers them...

[zippy13]

Things haven't changed much since I started reloading for skeet with my first MEC in late 1960s. Back then, I used Win-AA hulls, 17.5 or 18.0 gr of Red Dot, W209 primers and WAA12 (or eq.) wads.

I'm going out on a limb here, IIRC, your WAA12XW were bulk wads for handicap trap loads (black AAs), had stiffer petals and were loaded like the WAA12 wads. I'd try them first with a reduced load.

Win 473AA was the powder used in factory AA 20-ga loads and there was data for it in several 12 and 20-ga loads. It's been discontinued since Hodgdon took over Winchester's powder division. I never used 473AA because of the cost -- it would take over 35% more 473AA to duplicate my Red Dot loads, and Win ball powder is about 25% more per pound than Alliant. Some folks liked it in the 20-ga because it duplicated the factory load and gave a good crimp. You might consider substituting 473AA with Green Dot (see loading in the Alliant guide).

Back in the day, I was aware of Alcan products, but have no familiarity with them. The only Federal Champion wad I've used is the two piece 12C1 with the red powder wad. It's for 1-1/8 oz loads in Fed's paper hulls. Are you sure yours are 7/8-oz? The only other similar wad I know of is the 12C2 for plastic hulls, IIRC, it had a black wad.

If you wads are indeed the 12C1's then use them in your Fed paper hulls with your existing Red Dot and some Fed 209A primers: 19.0 gr will get you 1145 fps at 8,200 psi, 20.0 gr goes 1200 fps at 8,600 psi or 21.5 gr gets you 1,255 fps at 8,900 psi. Save them for special occasions 'cause they are sweet shooting and hard hitting.

Pete, all of this assumes your wads are still soft and pliable.

[darkgael]

Zippy: Thanks. The wads appear to be in good condition.

Are you sure yours are 7/8-oz? The only other similar wad I know of is the 12C2 for plastic hulls, IIRC, it had a black wad.

Printing on the bag says size 7/8 for 1 1/8 ounce loads.
I was thinking that one of the "Dot" propellants would work. At that rate, I suspect 700 X would work as well as 7625 and WST. Maybe?
Pete

[zippy13]

Pete, see PM.