1851 .44 Navy Colt - Armi San Paolo

Wazzabie · December 4, 2016, 09:27 PM

Under the rammer of this revolver is marked DGG in a circle. I believe Armi San Paolo made this which is the for runner to Euroarms. The proof date code is XX8 which is 1972. The revolver is marked Jana as shown in figure 16 in the article below. From what I have gathered online Jana was an importer based out of Denver. http://rprca.tripod.com/Schneider.html

Q1. What is the quality of these early revolvers? In particular Armi San Paolo?
Q2. What issues with these should I look for?
Q3. What size caps, balls and charge sould I use?

I'm new to this so please bear with the newbie.

Hawg · December 4, 2016, 10:04 PM

They're pretty good. The insides will be a little rough and the trigger may be stiff and gritty. If its a brass frame I wouldn't go over 18 grains of powder, if its a steel frame I'd use 30 grains with a .454 ball.

Wazzabie · December 4, 2016, 10:50 PM

Its a brass frame. What brand of powder do you recommend?

Beagle333 · December 5, 2016, 12:01 AM

If you can get real black (such as Goex 3f) in your area, use that.

If not, pyrodex P works just fine. I've shot many, many pounds of it with no issues. (they don't sell real black powder around here)

Hawg · December 5, 2016, 12:20 AM

I'll second real black or Pyrodex, others will have different opinions. Oh and #10 caps.

Wazzabie · December 5, 2016, 12:31 AM

When fully cocked how much play is acceptable with the cylinder?

Also I read that XX9 and under have a hardened brass frame. Is that true?

Wazzabie · December 5, 2016, 04:20 AM

According to this posting the Jana marking is rare.

https://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=213302

Beagle333 · December 5, 2016, 04:42 AM

I like 3-4 thousandths of play. Some say you should retire one at 13 thousandths, but I had one that I really like that I shot til it got to .017", even though it put on quite a fireworks show there at the end.

I know nothing about "hardened brass".

Hawg · December 5, 2016, 12:08 PM

Never heard of hardened brass being used. I have a brass .36 Remington made in 76 that has imprinted the cylinder ratchet into the recoil shield and it did it with normal loads or at least normal for a steel frame, now I personally wont go over 15 in a brass frame. The shake on all of mine at full cock is perceptible. Cylinder gaps are all right around .003, If the gun is in good shape you might want to retire it with the Jana marking or contact Dr Jim Davis at Tripod for his opinion. Seems that the Jana marking was only used for one year.

Wazzabie · December 5, 2016, 12:56 PM

The blue on the revolver is nice. The brass is tarnished. It needs a good cleaning. I'm not able to move the cylinder back and forth. There is play when I move the cylinder at full cock side to side. There is not much play.

Also this pistol does not have the notch in the hammer and pins in the cylinder for saftey.

I found these great articles on how to tune it.

http://www.theopenrange.net/articles...a_Part_One.pdf

http://www.theopenrange.net/articles...a_Part_Two.pdf

December 5, 2016, 12:01 AM	#4
Beagle333 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2012 Location: Auburn, AL. Posts: 2,332	If you can get real black (such as Goex 3f) in your area, use that. If not, pyrodex P works just fine. I've shot many, many pounds of it with no issues. (they don't sell real black powder around here) __________________ . . . Have a Colt and a smile.

December 5, 2016, 12:31 AM	#6
Wazzabie Junior Member Join Date: December 4, 2016 Posts: 5	When fully cocked how much play is acceptable with the cylinder? Also I read that XX9 and under have a hardened brass frame. Is that true? Last edited by Wazzabie; December 5, 2016 at 01:20 AM.

December 5, 2016, 04:42 AM	#8
Beagle333 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2012 Location: Auburn, AL. Posts: 2,332	I like 3-4 thousandths of play. Some say you should retire one at 13 thousandths, but I had one that I really like that I shot til it got to .017", even though it put on quite a fireworks show there at the end. I know nothing about "hardened brass". __________________ . . . Have a Colt and a smile.

December 4, 2016, 09:27 PM	#1
Wazzabie Junior Member Join Date: December 4, 2016 Posts: 5	1851 .44 Navy Colt - Armi San Paolo Under the rammer of this revolver is marked DGG in a circle. I believe Armi San Paolo made this which is the for runner to Euroarms. The proof date code is XX8 which is 1972. The revolver is marked Jana as shown in figure 16 in the article below. From what I have gathered online Jana was an importer based out of Denver. http://rprca.tripod.com/Schneider.html Q1. What is the quality of these early revolvers? In particular Armi San Paolo? Q2. What issues with these should I look for? Q3. What size caps, balls and charge sould I use? I'm new to this so please bear with the newbie. Last edited by Wazzabie; December 5, 2016 at 01:25 AM.

December 4, 2016, 10:04 PM	#2
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,190	They're pretty good. The insides will be a little rough and the trigger may be stiff and gritty. If its a brass frame I wouldn't go over 18 grains of powder, if its a steel frame I'd use 30 grains with a .454 ball.

December 4, 2016, 10:50 PM	#3
Wazzabie Junior Member Join Date: December 4, 2016 Posts: 5	Its a brass frame. What brand of powder do you recommend?

December 5, 2016, 12:20 AM	#5
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,190	I'll second real black or Pyrodex, others will have different opinions. Oh and #10 caps.

December 5, 2016, 04:20 AM	#7
Wazzabie Junior Member Join Date: December 4, 2016 Posts: 5	According to this posting the Jana marking is rare. https://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=213302

December 5, 2016, 12:08 PM	#9
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,190	Never heard of hardened brass being used. I have a brass .36 Remington made in 76 that has imprinted the cylinder ratchet into the recoil shield and it did it with normal loads or at least normal for a steel frame, now I personally wont go over 15 in a brass frame. The shake on all of mine at full cock is perceptible. Cylinder gaps are all right around .003, If the gun is in good shape you might want to retire it with the Jana marking or contact Dr Jim Davis at Tripod for his opinion. Seems that the Jana marking was only used for one year.

December 5, 2016, 12:56 PM	#10
Wazzabie Junior Member Join Date: December 4, 2016 Posts: 5	The blue on the revolver is nice. The brass is tarnished. It needs a good cleaning. I'm not able to move the cylinder back and forth. There is play when I move the cylinder at full cock side to side. There is not much play. Also this pistol does not have the notch in the hammer and pins in the cylinder for saftey. I found these great articles on how to tune it. http://www.theopenrange.net/articles...a_Part_One.pdf http://www.theopenrange.net/articles...a_Part_Two.pdf