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Old June 3, 2022, 07:10 PM   #151
TunnelRat
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I have shot over 100,000 rd of factory, new ammunition. The only ammunition failures that come to mind are a few poorly seated rounds that wouldn't chamber. I'd say less than 20 of those total. I have had failures to feed, extract, and eject that I traced to the firearm itself.

The worst ammunition I ever had was "factory reloaded" ammunition. I can't remember the name of the outfit. The powder charges were all over the place to the extent I felt I was shooting differ cartridges (I did check that I wasn't). From what I've seen with others at the range, "factory reloaded" ammunition can be a gamble.
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Old June 3, 2022, 08:02 PM   #152
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O am going to bring up a side note about factory vs handloaded. In the past three years, I have had multiple factory load failures. I had Winchester .25-06 that 4 out of 20 never went boom in any of my 3 rifles. Had 350 legend ammo with multiple primers in backwards. Had 30-30 split a case neck. Watched a Glock 22 get the barrel bulged shut. All that was factory ammo. In the same time, I have had zero handloads failures. (Except in a Taurus G3 that has an undersized chamber, but that don't count)
In the first 1000 round handgun reliability match I attended, reloads did extremely poorly--worse even than the steel-cased Wolf ammo which was worse than any of the brass or aluminum-cased ammo.

It was so bad, in fact, that reloads were not allowed in the second match the following year because when they were used it was way more about the ammunition than it was about the gun--and it was supposed to be all about the guns.

Of course, the quality of ammunition varies, whether it's factory or handloaded.

I think that's something that can get lost sometimes. People tend to form opinions about the reliability of factory ammunition based on the lowest price ammo they can find to shoot at the range and then carry those opinions over to premium self-defense ammo that can cost 10 times the price and generally comes with commensurately better stringent quality control and better quality components.

Anyway, if I were going to list the #1 reason I wouldn't carry handloads for self-defense, it would be what I've personally witnessed in terms of the generally lower reliability of handloads compared to factory self-defense ammo. That said, I'm sure everyone in this thread who handloads makes ammo that is much more reliable than factory and so my observations shouldn't be taken to apply to their ammo.
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Old June 3, 2022, 08:26 PM   #153
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Back to the OP's question (what this thread is about).

No one is telling anyone they "must" use a particular ammo.

No one is telling anyone they "cannot" use a particular ammo,be it factory loads or handloads.

The question I chose to respond to is "What factors influence my choice"

I can make my choice based on anything I want. You can make yours based on anything you want.

I don't care what you use.

Its silly and stupid to enter some ego arguement over "My way is better than your way" It just does not matter.

There ARE learned people who present a valid legal reason why a person might make the FREE CHOICE to use factory ammo for carry.(Or not)

There is also misinformation about reasons to not carry handloads that are bogus. Example? Handloads are (AFAIK) perfectly lawful for carry. Its bogus to say they are not. Its bogus to say "Handloads label you a gunnut who want dum dum wound channels....blah blah blah.

All that distracts from the legit reason of admissible forensic evidence.

We do folks who are asking about choosing SD ammo a disservice when we clutter the air with BS.

It always come down to you CAN carry whatever you want. You may certainly weigh the factors ,load +P+ handloads with whatever bullet you like and carry them.

There is nothing to get riled up about. No one is trying to take anything from you.

But for Sally Firstgun, the honest info from someone like Spats McGee or Massad Ayoob might help them along and if they ever do use their handgun and face trial, (Very slim chance that happens) the factory load may aid in acquittal.

The Rittenhouse trial was educational.
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Old June 4, 2022, 08:42 AM   #154
reynolds357
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnKSa View Post
In the first 1000 round handgun reliability match I attended, reloads did extremely poorly--worse even than the steel-cased Wolf ammo which was worse than any of the brass or aluminum-cased ammo.

It was so bad, in fact, that reloads were not allowed in the second match the following year because when they were used it was way more about the ammunition than it was about the gun--and it was supposed to be all about the guns.

Of course, the quality of ammunition varies, whether it's factory or handloaded.

I think that's something that can get lost sometimes. People tend to form opinions about the reliability of factory ammunition based on the lowest price ammo they can find to shoot at the range and then carry those opinions over to premium self-defense ammo that can cost 10 times the price and generally comes with commensurately better stringent quality control and better quality components.

Anyway, if I were going to list the #1 reason I wouldn't carry handloads for self-defense, it would be what I've personally witnessed in terms of the generally lower reliability of handloads compared to factory self-defense ammo. That said, I'm sure everyone in this thread who handloads makes ammo that is much more reliable than factory and so my observations shouldn't be taken to apply to their ammo.
That is funny because the world's best pistol shooters shoot reloaded ammo in competition. It is usually tuned in their pistol to just barely make power factor.
I have seen what you describe on many occasions. The fact Billy Joe bob with his $225 progressive press and limited knowledge turns out a pile of trash loads is not indicative as to what a "reloader" with proper equipment and knowledge turns out. I will admit myself that I have a Hornaday LNL that turns out awesome .223 ammo, but it turns off jamomatic 9mm. Been back to Hornaday and they "fixed" it. Still turns off jamO stuff. Never had a jam or any malfunction in ammo off my Dillon.
The LNL and the way it's shell plate works can't "bust" the Glock Bulges quite enough to make them run in my race gun. The Dillon can. LNL is bullet proof with pre roll sized brass.

Last edited by reynolds357; June 4, 2022 at 08:52 AM.
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Old June 4, 2022, 11:08 AM   #155
TunnelRat
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How do you choose your SD ammo?

Quote:
Originally Posted by reynolds357 View Post
That is funny because the world's best pistol shooters shoot reloaded ammo in competition. It is usually tuned in their pistol to just barely make power factor.
I have seen what you describe on many occasions. The fact Billy Joe bob with his $225 progressive press and limited knowledge turns out a pile of trash loads is not indicative as to what a "reloader" with proper equipment and knowledge turns out. I will admit myself that I have a Hornaday LNL that turns out awesome .223 ammo, but it turns off jamomatic 9mm. Been back to Hornaday and they "fixed" it. Still turns off jamO stuff. Never had a jam or any malfunction in ammo off my Dillon.
The LNL and the way it's shell plate works can't "bust" the Glock Bulges quite enough to make them run in my race gun. The Dillon can. LNL is bullet proof with pre roll sized brass.

And just because you with your decades of experience and attention to detail can turn out quality ammunition doesn’t mean everyone else will. It goes both ways. We all have to be careful of using ourselves as singular examples of someone engaging in our chosen activity. General observations aren’t a condemnation of everyone, they’re simply a summary of what someone has seen. It doesn’t mean an exception can’t exist.


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Old June 4, 2022, 07:55 PM   #156
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I think it's hard to beat a 147 XTP in a 9. Faster the better.
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Old June 7, 2022, 02:48 PM   #157
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One decision you must make is do you prefer barrier blindness.
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Old June 13, 2022, 05:55 PM   #158
zeke
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Will admit to giving consideration to the various gel results. As others have noted reliability is needed. Nowadays accessibility is a major consideration. Have long used Hdy xtp's and Speer gold dots as preferable standards. For my purposes, bullet selection can also be dependent on caliber. Can only think of 2 factory rounds i bought for carry (from Federal and Win), but they have gotten very expensive. Am also making a distinction between custom handloading and reloading.
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Old June 14, 2022, 05:22 AM   #159
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I look at ballistics gel tests, availability, and price. Then, I test 100 rounds. If that goes well, I am comfortable carrying it and buying more.
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