M1 Garand problems

[Freeloader Reloader]

My friend and I recently purchased an M1 Garand for each of us. They are beautiful rifles, as I am sure you know. I have been into reloading for almost 10 years now and have loaded many rounds of ammo (quite a few pistol calibers and an assortment of rifle calibers as well). I've been loading 30-06 ammo for 150 gr. FMJ-BT using IMR-3031 powder (the only powder that I have that's listed in my Lee Manual. I loaded 5 different test loads to try out. 43.0 (SSG); 43.5; 44.0; 44.5; and 45.0. All the loads fired just fine and the first round ejected cleanly. But the second round did not chamber on any of the test loads. Is the problem with the type of powder I am using (saw a bunch of videos while checking and saw IMR 4064 seemed to be preferred) or are the loads too weak? Have to say I have no experience with gas systems. Any thoughts?

[USSR]

IMR3031 is the fastest powder that should be used in the Garand, and is best with lighter bullets (110 - 125gr). One of 2 things is happening here. You either have a bad clip (have you tried several clips?), or more likely, you are not generating enough pressure to work the oprod properly. You can try bumping up the charge weight to 47-48gr, or better yet, switch to either IMR4895 or IMR4064. Hope that helps.

Don

[HiBC]

Please elaborate what "did not chamber" means.

Round not picked up by the bolt? Round not feeding into the chamber? Or bolt not fully rotating into battery/op rod not going fully fwd.

There are some true experts here who can give a precise number,but the typical bolt action pursuit of .002 head clearance is the wrong idea for a Garand.

More generous head clearance is necessary as the ammo must not resist full bolt lockup.

I had a copy of Precision Shooting's "Handloading For Competition" I have not seen it for some time. It has a chapter on loading for gas guns.
He stressed sizing for sufficient head clearance.

My memory might be fuzzy and wrong. Experts,feel free to correct me,but I think the recommended head clearance was .006,and you check for stretch rings. Maybe get 4 reloads.

It somewhat depends on how uniformly you can size and measure your head clearance. I'll hazard a guess don't go less than .004.

Also be aware the seater die has a crimp function built in. If you set your seater die to contact the shellholder,you are almost certainly collapsing the shoulder of the case
Use a sized case in your press,ram up,when you screw the seater die in. You will feel the die contact the case mouth . Note the space the die is off the shellholder.

[Freeloader Reloader]

Thanks so much for the info. We were using 3031 because that was the only powder in my stock that had 30-06 data in my manuals. I am in the process right now of creeping my loads up to the maximum listed in half-grain increments. If we still have same problem we will switch to 4064 and start over. Biggest hassle we have is an hour-long drive (one way) to get to the range to test these loads. We're going to keep on plugging and thank God we're not in a wartime situation. We would be croaked before getting the second round off!

[HiBC]

Once again,please elaborate on "won't chamber"

[Unclenick]

If "won't chamber" meant the bolt closed on an empty chamber, it is definitely your powder charge.

But if "won't chamber" meant the round got stuck on the way into the chamber or that the bolt was pushing on the round from behind but could not push it all the way out of the clip, you most likely have a bad clip or your operating rod spring is weak. The ones available here are particularly good, IMHO, as they are newly made to the correct specification and are not used and are not wound for excessive force as those from one well-known maker are.

[Rod47]

Replace op rod spring, lube bolt lugs and op rod channel, use H4895 powder, and invest in the Hornady manual.

[Bayou]

OP -

If you are reloading for your Garand, I suggest you refer to the Hornady reloading manual. It has dedicated reloading sections for military rifles including the Garand and M14/M1-A. It identifies appropriate powders and charges.

Just FYI -

Bayou

[burrhead]

Best to use mild loads of slow powders. Pressure spikes WILL damage the op-rod and, best I know, they ain't making them any more. You can't fix a bent op-rod yourself which means buying one that's been rebuilt. I haven't looked in a few years but I suspect they're in the $300+ range.

My 79 year old Springfield likes 46gr of H4895 with 150gr Interlocs. Both the Hornady and Sierra manuals have Garand specific reloading sections. Another good source of data is the CMP forum.

[Unclenick]

Be careful about that description, "slow powders". H4895 falls sort of into the middle range of high power rifle powder burn rates. The old rule of thumb is that powders for which the maximum bolt gun load with a 150-grain bullet is greater than 53 grains are too slow and will create too much muzzle pressure if you don't have a vented gas port plug or a Garand Gear hollow plug to give the gas more expansion space. The rule doesn't work out perfectly with certain extremes of bullet weight, but for the normal range of about 150 to 180 grains, it seems to be pretty close.

[USSR]

The old time Garand shooters had an axiom that said "No powder faster than IMR3031, no powder slower than IMR4320, and no bullet heavier than 180 grains".

Don

[burrhead]

Points taken

[Bart B.]

Originally Posted by USSR

The old time Garand shooters had an axiom that said "No powder faster than IMR3031, no powder slower than IMR4320, and no bullet heavier than 180 grains".

Don

The USN and USAF rifle team's 7.62 NATO Garand long range match handloads was 44 grains of IMR4320 under a Sierra 190 HPMK in a new M118 match primed case. Tested under 4 inches at 600 yards with the rifle in a machine rest. Barrels were service grade air gauged for uniform groove diameter no larger than .3079 inch.

[dahermit]

Originally Posted by Bart B.

The USN and USAF rifle team's 7.62 NATO Garand long range match handloads was 44 grains of IMR4320 under a Sierra 190 HPMK in a new M118 match primed case. Tested under 4 inches at 600 yards with the rifle in a machine rest. Barrels were service grade air gauged for uniform groove diameter no larger than .3079 inch.

What is a "7.62 NATO Garand"? 7.62 in the Army generally meant 7.62 NATO (.308 Winchester). As far as I know, the factories that made M1 Garands only chambered them in 30-06 (save for that proprietary cartridge that Garand originally developed his gun for).

[30Cal]

Originally Posted by dahermit

What is a "7.62 NATO Garand"? 7.62 in the Army generally meant 7.62 NATO (.308 Winchester). As far as I know, the factories that made M1 Garands only chambered them in 30-06 (save for that proprietary cartridge that Garand originally developed his gun for).

The govt arsenals (Springfield and H&R) converted rifles to 7.62NATO. Navy used them a fair amount.

Kit included a 7.62NATO Usgi barrel (diff drawing number than the 30-06 barrel) and a magazine spacer.

[Unclenick]

The gas port hole is a little bigger on the .308 Garand barrels. I don't have the drawing to know what the military armorers worked out for it, but you can find people claiming anything from 0.086" to as much as 0.105" is "correct" on the .308 Garand.