Chemical Agent stories

[4V50 Gary]

Inspired by Mike Irwin's tale of a friend in DC, I thought I'd start this thread. So, let's hear you chemical agent story(s).

I've only used Mace legally once in all the years I carried it (every other time I used it I was killing insects). I hosed down one fellow who I later learned was on speed. He wiped his eye and looked at me. My baton came out and tenderized him into submission.

One City Investigator (nonsworn) complained of some seedy characters near her office. The nature of her job sometimes required her to work late night hours and quite naturally she feared for her safety when she walked to her car. So, I gave her my can of CN mace (opps, not suppose to do that as she wasn't licensed) and told her to carry it. A couple of months later, she told how she left work one night and this fellow followed her - closely. He was right behind her and she feared being grabbed (and worse). He cried out, "Hey lady!" She spun around and blasted his face point blank. Happily for her, it worked he grabbed his face in pain. Because of the close proximity (he was in her intimate zone), she got some backblast. Nonetheless, she continued spraying Mace while he went to the ground. Her eyes tearing (half because of the joy knowing that she would survive), she fled to her car. She was able to see enough to drive a short distance to a safe area to stop to allow her eyes to clear.

I asked to examine the can of mace and when I shook it, it felt almost empty. Congratulating her on her survival, I immediately gave her the cannister off my belt and asked her to share any new stories with me.

[IamNOTaNUT]

Good post. Mace / Pepper spray can be an effective intermediate weapon, but it does not incapacitate everyone. Further, it doesn not take out BG's immediately as many people believe. BUT it does caause some serious problems for the poor unfortunate BG who earns the right to be sprayed.

I have had effective use against sober people, drunk people, and tweakers, though it takes a bit longer for a tweaker to feel the burn. As long as you know what to expect you can work with it, but if you spray it and expect immediate results on someone who is under the influence, you are in trouble.

Anyone ever spray themselves?

[Deadman]

I remember during last years Soviet offence on Chechnya
reading about how the Chechans used a chemical weapon on the russians - petrol mixed with chlorine i.e. molotov cocktail with a twist. The poor russians then tried to use this fact as a way of supporting their slaughter of the Chechans.
Burning chlorine in petrol releases chlorine gas which can be quite deadly. I think the Germans used chlorine gas on the French early on in the First Wolrd War.

[Smiley]

a few years backa mail man was delivering the mail just as my brother had let our dog out. She started barking and startled the mail man. (she was really a harmless old mutt but he didn't know) He grabbed his mace and proceded to charge towards my dog and sprayed her, the dog went down right away and started crying in pain. My brother was trying to grad the dog at the time though aand got a healty dose of it in the face as the mail man was being very liberal with teh mace and spraying it all about. My brother basically got pissed off nd yelled at teh mail man to get the hell out of here. He didn't really start feeling anything but a few minutes later he strting tearing up. I may have been because he didn't get a good concentrated blast but just goes to show not everyone goes down, especially if it is some generic cheap stuff.

[Al Thompson]

This may not be a true story - it was passed on by a very trusted friend though. If you've heard it before, that would prove it's a urban legend..

Pepper spray was fairly new and one of the local PD officers had bought a small cannister. Not authorized for belt carry, he stuck it in the glove box. At shift change he left it behind as he had just transported a drunk and was still booking him. The new officer took the car and rummaged around in the glove box for some deodorizer. Found the small spray can and hosed down the interior of the car w/o looking at the can. My buddy said they found out about it when they were called by a citizen. Seems the officer was rolling around on the street after stopping the car.... Took a month or so for the car to be serviceable..

Giz

[C.R.Sam]

Used can of Berryman's carb cleaner in the face to stop wannabe car jacker......VERY effective. Probably as quick a stop as shootin him and a little less legal hassle afterward. Eyes recovered completely eventually.

Thief came over fence at warehouse, dog tried to eat thief and got some of his clothing. Thief had tried to use pepper spray to down dog, dog used pepper spray can as chew toy.

Sam....tween knaps

[racegunner]

I don't know what caused me to do this....
woke up one night around 3:30am to 2 bats flying in the hall, both alternating back and forth. I was tired and at my wit's end (mice, bugs of all kinds, carpenter ants, possum, squirrels in walls, now this!). Out came the mace. It was the camper anti-bear kind that was a small fire extinguisher type, I think 9% ? Fogged the bats and inadvertantly house. Furnace kicks on...Spent rest of night on porch with pissed off girlfriend, weazing...bats were uneffected...

I'm really not that stupid (anymore).

[IamNOTaNUT]

Racegunner -

Two bits of advice if I may:

1. Never spray your girlfriend with pepper spray. You will be in bigger trouble than if you said, "Well, now that you mention it, your butt DOES look kinda big in that skirt."

2. The best defense against an unarmed bat is a tennis racket. Badmitton rackets are too flimsy, and raquetball rackets are too small.

Get a look at where it is going, they usually circle around, and when he comes your way WHAK HIM! If you miss, don't worry about it, he'll circle around again to find out what the heck you are. You get a second, third, and fourth chance at it.

They have very fragile bodies, so if you bang a good forehand shot into the wall your bat problem is solved.

God, I sound like a hick. That's it. I'm finally going to bed now.

[Bogie]

For little bats, the badminton racket is okay. They damage easy, but you can swing 'em faster... Don't get too attached to 'em...

My father set off one of the sprays by accident, and drove himself and my mother out of my living room. I never noticed it.

When I was in basic training, I endured the "disco hut" with the rest of my company. I DO NOT like CS gas. Instant sinus clearage, semi-blindness, etc. - I ran over one of the DIs after they cleared me to go out the door. His fault- he shouldn't have been standing in the middle of the path... We did have one guy in our unit, however, who took his mask off, stood there for a second, and asked what the big deal was...

[pokey074]

CS - BAD!!! OC - not so bad. when i went through BT at Ft. Benning, there was a guy in our company who was completely immune to CS. the DS's had him doing pushups with his face OVER the can and it didn't affect the guy one bit.

[4V50 Gary]

As a rookie deputy, they introduced us to CS by stuffing us in a small shack. A rangemaster fired a CS round in it. We were told to stay in there until it bothered us. Being a young smart alec, I closed my eyes and held my breath. Naively I believe that this was sufficient to protect myself. When my cohorts began to leave, I, with eyes still shut tight and breath held, followed. Stepping outside into the fresh air, I opened my eyes and gulped in a fresh breath of air; or so I thought.

The CS was all over my face and thus not only did my eyes immediately tear up but my lungs burned with pain. In agony, I doubled over and stumbled to the water to wash myself off. Later, my buddies told me of everyone there, I looked the worse.

So much for being a smart alec.

[jhisaac]

Not quite a chemical agent story, but it's the best I have. I was cleaning my pistol using a can of pressurized solvent. (It's supposed to blast the stuff right out of there.) I had whatever part I was holding angled just right so that when I shot the stuff it came straight back into my eyes. Owww! My wife helped rinse my eyes out and I am none the worse for wear. My contact lenses were quite clean. I'm really glad I had something citrus based instead of something really nasty.

On a more related note, the picture in our Basic Training yearbook of the gas chamber caught me coming out the door looking pretty sad. (Ft. Leanard Wood, 12C, 1986)

jhisaac

[Jffal]

Someone told me that one day, his brother settled down with the rest of the family for dinner. Suddenly, the fellow's face flushed crimson and he grabbed at the sensitive skin and spilled away from the table.

Turns out that one of the women in the family had been test firing a pepperspray cannister outside and used a bar of soap to wash the residue off her hands. When the fellow came home from work, he used that innocent looking bar of soap and warm water to cleanse his hands and face, forcing OC particles into the pores.
Jeff

[urban assault]

I work as a bouncer at a bar on the weekends. Did it full-time for years, but I saw the light and got a job that paid better money for less risk. I now just work for extra play money. Anyways, a few years ago a cop friend gave me some 10% OC spray. I hadnt ever used it and didnt trust it very much. I decided to spray myself to see if it would slow me down. My rationale is that if it will work on me, it will work on a goblin. I stood on the back porch at my parents house, steeled myself and let my Dad blast me in the eyes, with my glasses off. Someone had obviously put flaming gasoline in the canister by mistake, because my face exploded in burning pain. I couldnt breathe, I couldnt see, all I could do is reel around like a drunken sailor and listen to my father laugh his ass off. All I could do was cry in pain. For awhile I was completly helpless. A tiny, blind French schoolgirl, in a WHEELCHAIR, could have ended me completly. I was that bad off. Snot ran freely from my nose, my lips felt like charcoal briquets and I was wishing I hadnt done this experiment. Finally, after about 10 minutes I could see a little. After 15 or 20, the OC just seemed to fade away.
My idiot father had tears in his eyes from laughing so much. I have used the stuff on goblins on occasion since then but am leery about getting some blown back into my face. PS- dont ever spray some guy in the face with alcohol--based OC, while he is smoking a cigar...it isnt pretty, but thats another story.

michael

[Jody Hudson]

many years ago... just after dirt and CN/CS gas were invented I was a military policeman and the local cops came to hang out at our gate shack in the wee hours of the night and mornings. One morning one of my "freinds" came up in his police car; I opened my door to smile and greet him and he hosed me down with a cannister of Mace. I figured I only had a second to respond (I'd seen the movies you know) so I pulled my can and emptied it on him. Neither of us was much affected and the range was about 4 feet. The temp was about 30 degrees. 10 minutes later we were smoking a cigarette together and vowed to NEVER - EVER use that silly stuff on a Bad Guy.

NOW... pepper spray, in a heavy stream like one of those 10 oz spray fire-extinquishers... that's another story. By the way get the strongest 10 to 15% or stronger stuff you can get. Sure 10% is great on bears but they have big open mouths, big wet noses, and big wet eyes all just waiting for the pepper spray to utilize the mucous membrane to do it's stuff. People have no such plethora of ready to use mucous membranes... so get the heavy % stuff and hose em down.

When I was walking through the Rodney King riots and fires in South LA a few years ago I carried a small mayonaise jar full of full strength Capiseum (sp) pepper and grain alcohol for protection. I was living with a bunch of Mexicans at the time who LOVED hot peppers on everything. I put a drop of my "hot sauce" in a pot of spaghetti sauce and NO ONE wanted another drop. I was convinced... although I never had to use it for self defense. I got the super hot cap peppers from a health food store. I did throw some on a dog that kept coming at me.. and he stopped!!!!

From what I've learned pepper spray is better by far than Mace. Pepper spray and Mace are best when you and about 10 of your uniformed officer buddies are surrounding the BG with pistols drawn and you hose him down. AND... Pepper Spray and Mace worked a lot better when people believed the hype and before they experience it. Now the BGs here are so used to getting sprayed with pepper that they hardly mind it anymore. At first they feared it.

[Joe 543]

Well, my wacko department requires that everyone be sprayed with OC before it's issued. It's done on video for documentation purposes. You state your name, rank, then blasto! Funny though, they never did that with the ASP or the issued 9mm.

[Joe 543]

oh yeah, "flaming gasoline" is the right description.
2,000,000 SHUs

[Keith J]

My first exposure was in BCT in 1987. Each platoon was marched in in MOP level 2 (mask&hood, no gloves, boots or suit)and told to remove mask. then a level 2 Ds walks down the line, prompting each one individually for name, rank and company. One BT decided it was too much and bolted after doing so, leaving the rest of us in the chamber suffering while two DS's went after him. It felt like 5 minutes until they returned with PVT Bolter (not his real name)kicking and screaming. His nose was bloodied and he was moving like a cat in a sack.

That was something else.

At one duty station, a perp stole some CS from the chamber and hit the snack bar with it. I think it was a capsule or two but it was enough to clear the place and warrant the fire department visit.

Years later, my then significant other shows me a can she and a friend had found while rummaging through some wanna-be SOF's hideout. It was the military CS capsules used for chamber training. They are gelatine capsules full of a off-white to orange powder. She and her friend thought it was nerve gas (LOL)and had even tried to get high on the stuff!

She took the ENTIRE can, about 1/2 full. Needless to say, I ditched her for this type of behavior and kept a few capsules. Dissolved in alcohol, it made a good dog deterrent. One spray to the nose will turn them away in a few seconds.

[Bam Bam]

Got some pepper spray for my sister as she is gun-unfriendly. She wanted to know if it really worked and sprayed some in the toilet. The back-blast got her and she is convinced it will stop a goblin if he gets a face or pants full. Since she is something of a bitch the latter is her prefered target for self-defense.

[Vern Brink]

OC

I had been working plainclothes on the city bus looking for the garden variety of bad people that bother good people.
I came home and immediately began wrestling around with the dog (Rottie). I had just stuck the small can of OC in my back pocket and unknown to me, it popped out while I was rolling around w/the dog. Of course, she see's it and I sorta see "something" go skidding across the carpet.

Before I can really tell what it is, she's got it scooped up and running across the living room. Next thing I hear is a slight "pop" and some hissing. I get up only to see her crouching over the now punctured can of OC and a very small red spot (dye) on the floor. Most of the blast had been contained by her mouth and she is non too happy about it.

20 minutes of running the garden hose in her mouth seemed to turn her back to normal. Funny, people I spray seem to complain a lot longer.

[444]

I went out to take my dog (rottweiler) for a walk. I got out on the porch and told him to sit while I locked the door. I didn't know it, but the mailman came up the driveway behind me. My dog never moved, never growled, didn't even hardly look at him, but of course the mailman pepper sprayed him. He had absolutely no reaction to it at all. Didn't even blink. I asked what the hell he was doing and the mailman told me he didn't want to take a chance. I said, you see how much good that stuff would have done you. I wanted to brain the piece of *&^% but I held my tongue. I work as a paramedic and have seen many, many people get maced and peppersprayed. We carry a neutralizing spray for it called Cool off or Cool It or something like that. Most of the time, the police don't want us to use it for obvious reasons. I have seen many failures with it. I ran on a guy once that was cornered by about 5 officers all in a semi circle with their guns drawn. One of them would occasionally pepper spray him with no effect. He was standing there twirling two butterfly knives. An older detective showed up and was breaking the other officers balls for not getting aggressive enough with this clown. He grabbed a device we had called a scoop strether, or orthopedic flat or whatever you want to call it. And told me to get on the other end. We charged the guy and pinned him to the wall with it while everyone else dogpiled him. The guy still managed to stab one of the officers superficially. The perp was well known to me as a chronic user of angel dust; we have run on him two or three times before.