The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: Semi-automatics

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 20, 2018, 10:12 PM   #26
Longhorn1986
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 12, 2016
Location: Fort Bend County, Texas
Posts: 173
My Rock River AR is a very decent rifle, but I enjoy my AK-47 rifles a lot more. Don't know why. De gustibus non est disputandum.
Longhorn1986 is offline  
Old July 21, 2018, 04:36 AM   #27
COSteve
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 6, 2009
Posts: 1,344
While I've had a couple of RRA ARs for over a dozen years, my lightweight mid-length gas carbine and a full size A4, I share the OP's opinions. I just can't get excited about ARs. To me they are just tools with no real excitement when I shoot them. Yes, they are accurate and modular if you want that but they hold no real place in my heart.

Besides it's bulky receiver that I find annoying, the AR's basic design just isn't pleasing to the eye even though it's ergonomically well though out. As to the 'plastic and aluminum' vs 'wood and steel' feel, I addressed that as best I could on my A4 I use for longer range, 400yd shooting by adding a real walnut furniture set I found some 10yrs ago and then I made a walnut target grip to match.



However, even the feel of real wood doesn't address the bulky feel of the AR or the tinny sound it makes when it cycles. Even though I've tried and tried to like the AR, it just doesn't do anything for me.

No, I much prefer the look and feel of my M1 Garands, M1 Carbines, and M1A to the AR. In fact, I like the 'wood and steel' look and feel of them so much, 3 years ago I went out and got myself a new 583 Series Mini-14. It's a joy to shoot! Over the next year or so, I and set it up like my M1A.

And as to their history of poor accuracy that the previous pencil barreled versions were known for, the current, thicker barreled, Minis are much more accurate producing 2" groups out of the box from the factory. Also, with a few simple tweaks that cost about what a good trigger for an AR costs, you can tune the Mini to near 1 MOA accuracy.

Besides it's great accuracy for it's design (it's as as accurate as my NM M1A with handloads), it's a beautiful looking rifle and a joy to shoulder and shoot. I have a shooter that produces 1.25" groups at 100yds with my handloads. That's plenty good enough for an irons only shooter I use to wack bowling pins at 200yds with. Clearly it's a rifle I will never let go and since I got it 3 yrs ago, my lightweight AR carbine has become a safe queen.

COSteve is offline  
Old July 28, 2018, 02:27 AM   #28
bamaranger
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 9, 2009
Location: North Alabama
Posts: 8,273
agreed

For a long time, my sole big game rifle had blue steel and walnut. My Grandad carried, it, and my Dad, and now it was my turn. It was the way things were supposed to be. Synthetics were on the market, but I didn't want one.

But I started hunting more and more, climbing trees, bashing about on an ATV, and I became concerned I would seriously damage the stock on that vintage rifle, and they were not making anymore of them, not to mention all the memories connected with that piece of walnut as well. I bought a Rem 700 ADL parkerized and synthetic poly stock.

Hated the thing immediately. It was cold to the touch in bad weather, noisy in the brush and it seemed to lack character. Oh, it was a great shooter, practical, very accurate and consistent, and I sure didn't have to baby it. But the rifle had no soul. I declared that hunting with that ugly bullet launcher was like "sleeping with a harlot", and the rifle became known as "the Harlot".

I feel the same way about the AR family. Great bullet launchers, durable and reliable, lots of options, and some can be made very accurate. But....assembled, not crafted. Guys build them on their kitchen tables or garages, not bespectacled old 'smiths with cigars clenched in their teeth and years behind them on the bench. Another harlot, the AR's lack a soul as well.
bamaranger is offline  
Old July 28, 2018, 06:57 AM   #29
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,656
I disagree about the "no-soul" of an AR--in fact I think they fairly scream "don't f with me." When it comes to "sprit of shooting pleasure" nothing beats a good lever gun IMO--but that's just personal taste. Trad vs Rad--there's room for both.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old July 30, 2018, 03:23 PM   #30
Justice06RR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 21, 2010
Location: Central FL
Posts: 1,360
Same here.

Unless it was a family heirloom, or given by a loved one, or maybe saved your life, firearms are not things I get attached to. Particularly not an AR15 that I assembled from different manufacturers.

I have one AR that I've owned for a few years which I have owned the longest. Its the only one I prefer to keep since I've shot it plenty of times and it has not malfunctioned.
Justice06RR is offline  
Old July 30, 2018, 06:01 PM   #31
xandi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 10, 2015
Location: ga
Posts: 321
So where can I get one of these possessed guns with a “soul?”

I must be weird cause all guns do it for me, I have lol be for my AR15, both for it functionality and Symbolism
I like guns
xandi is offline  
Old July 31, 2018, 08:44 AM   #32
ndking1126
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2008
Location: Madison, AL
Posts: 1,932
Very interesting post.

I've shot ARs in the military for years and I've owned 2. There is no question it is a fantastic platform that is fun to shoot, and I love the idea of owning them. But I'm with you, I never get attached to them and have sold both of them. I shoot at the range and at large game so I guess I've never needed semi-automatic firing capabilities. My two favorite guns are my long range precision rifle (260 Rem) and my beat up, ugly Savage 10 in 243. I bought it used for $245 and it has a 50 year old 3-9 Bushnell scope on it.. Its every bit as accurate as the 260 Rem at practical ranges that the old scope can be used at, haha. Neither has a wood stock, though.. I value the functionality and fit of the guns over the construction.
ndking1126 is offline  
Old July 31, 2018, 09:49 AM   #33
BumbleBug
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 11, 2013
Location: Near Heart of Texas
Posts: 870
Quote:
Originally Posted by kymasabe View Post
...Anyone have an AR they absolutely love and will keep forever? Or are most of you of my mindset, it's just a tool, something to be bought, sold, or traded when bored, which happens fairly often for me.
Thinking about it, I am a lot less attached to my AR rifles than my other guns. For me accuracy is king. My first AR assembly was a PSA lower & I bought a complete PSA upper. It was cheap, fun & shot pretty good. I gave it away to a friend that I felt needed an AR as a ranch rifle. The other two I own, I assembled the uppers & lowers. Both have ARP performance barrels & shoot amazing! One is 5.56 & the other is a Six5 wildcat. At first it kinda made me made me mad that these metal & plastic AR "monsters" shot as good if not better better than most of my bolt & single-shot rifles with wood stocks. That's the attraction for me. These semi-auto rifles can be made to shoot like a bolt action target rifle! If I get a wild hair I might sell the 2 AR's off but I'd probably keep the barrels replacing the ARP's with a couple of bargain basement tubes.
__________________
Visit my fictional blog "The dr Chronicles" about a laid-back Texan named dr - Enjoy!
BumbleBug is offline  
Old July 31, 2018, 09:57 AM   #34
jugornot
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 20, 2017
Posts: 197
Only pending death and refusal of my sons to take my rifles would cause their sale. I have two AR style rifles a 5.56 RRA and a 308 DPMS. Both bull barrel rifles that with handloading are less than 1 MOA. They are the opposite of my Savage FTR rifles in the same caliber. The savages are like precision surgery. The ARs are precision party time. Both are equally satisfying satisfying depending on my mood.
jugornot is offline  
Old July 31, 2018, 10:49 AM   #35
K_Mac
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 15, 2010
Posts: 1,850
I love the utility of an AR for my purposes, i.e., home and personal defense. I feel for them as I do my polymer pistols and pump shotgun:They are the correct tools for job I've assigned them to. They are not as beautiful, desirable, or as collectable as others but we are in a long term committed relationship.
__________________
"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Benjamin Franklin
K_Mac is offline  
Old August 2, 2018, 10:51 PM   #36
Dano4734
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 6, 2014
Posts: 730
Never owned one. I fired many and they were fun but where I hunt I get much better use for a good bolt or lever. Besides my state is so restrictive it’s not worth it to me. Home defense I like a shotgun or my glock
Dano4734 is offline  
Old August 3, 2018, 07:33 AM   #37
HistoryJunky
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 7, 2010
Location: Freeport, IL
Posts: 833
The only 2 guns I own that I am attached to are my CZ-85B and my Yugo M70 N-PAP.

No story behind the CZ, I just like everything about it.

My wife bought me the AK for my birthday a couple years back.

I have owned an AR in the past. Didn't really care for it.

Sent from my SM-G930R4 using Tapatalk
HistoryJunky is offline  
Old August 7, 2018, 03:41 AM   #38
mellow_c
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2008
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,862
I appreciate every firearm.

If one is particularly unreliable or inaccurate (bad POI with fixed sights, etc) I'll be ok with getting rid of it.

Or if i have a good incentive to sell one maybe.

Otherwise, I've acquired said firearm for ownership reasons and those reasons would continue as long as I owned said firearm.

I can appreciate that more and older wood and steel guns might have a comparatively greater sentimental history due to their greater numbers and time on this planet.

But i think given time and individual experience, any gun can be considered a favorite.
mellow_c is offline  
Old August 8, 2018, 01:13 AM   #39
Dr. Strangelove
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 1, 2008
Location: Athens, GA
Posts: 1,436
I just "put together" a .223 AR (won't say I "built" it because I ordered an assembled upper) just to mess around with the platform.

It was a fun project to acquaint me with the platform. I like it, I'll probably keep it just as it is because it's fun to shoot and it was inexpensive (for today's gun prices, jeez). I like that I don't have about worry about scratching it up, can throw it in a Jeep, canoe, whatever and not worry about it.

The .223 cartridge just isn't flexible enough for me (not trying to start any debates). I'm thinking of a long term, low cost AR-10 build (two things that don't go together, I know) because I'd like to have a semi-auto .308 that is a "truck gun" kind of rifle.
__________________
Just remember, when you pull the trigger, the bullets come out going very, very fast. So make sure to keep the weapon pointing away from you.
Dr. Strangelove is offline  
Old August 8, 2018, 07:15 AM   #40
Skadoosh
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 13, 2010
Location: Virginia Beach
Posts: 2,016
I know that my AR's, as everyone seems to keep saying here, are tools. However I view my AR's are more than "just a fork in the drawer". It is never far from my mind that there could be the real possibility that one day, one of my ARs could mean the difference between life or death. No fork in the drawer will ever do that. I am very attached to my AR's. And because each of my AR rifles is unique, they each got a name to help identify it. Like "the Dane", "Blackbird" and "Hail Mary".
__________________
NRA Life Member
USN Retired
Skadoosh is offline  
Old August 9, 2018, 12:35 PM   #41
kymasabe
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 10, 2005
Location: SW Florida
Posts: 2,747
Well, I'm building another one. Instead of keeping it simple and affordable as usual, am going way over (my) budget and building with components I'd never consider before because I consider them all too expensive. So, I'm curious to see if it's gonna be "holy -CENSORED- this thing is AWESOME and worth every penny" and is gonna be my new favorite rifle, or just another ho-hum AR that I spent way too much money on.
__________________
God's creatures big and small, eat them one, eat them all.
kymasabe is offline  
Old August 22, 2018, 09:43 AM   #42
DMK
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 18, 2001
Location: Over the hills and far, far away
Posts: 3,206
Quote:
No AR is a favorite rifle.
An AR is a fork, like the other forks... they go in the fork drawer.
A favorite gun is like a wedding fork, pretty and unique; doesn’t get lumped in with the regular forks.
My ARs are my favorite rifles.

I'd rather shoot my AR15s than my Garand, my K31, my Springfield '03 or my Kar98. Not that I don't love those classic rifles for their history, but whether I'm using iron sights or optics, I am more confident in the fact that I can hit the target with my ARs.

I like the ergonomics of my ARs. I like the fact that I can customize it to my preferences, making it more versatile, more comfortable and more usable for me specifically.

The old saying says that accurate rifles are more interesting. Out of my collection and with my skill set, my AR15s are my most accurate rifles.

That's why they are my favorites.


__________________
- Homeland Security begins at home: Support your Second Amendment -
www.gunowners.org - www.saf.org - act.nraila.org - www.grnc.org

Last edited by DMK; August 22, 2018 at 09:49 AM.
DMK is offline  
Old August 22, 2018, 10:46 AM   #43
BWM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 6, 2013
Location: SW IN
Posts: 438
I like my AR,S and my Dan Wesson hand guns because you can do so much with them. They are easy to change from different barrels length and different calibers.
__________________
Man that likes guns. Navy. USS Ponchatoula AO 148 USS Vesuvius AE 15
BWM is offline  
Old August 23, 2018, 11:38 AM   #44
rickyrick
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 15, 2010
Posts: 8,235
I own several ARs. More than any other type of gun. None are a favorite rifle.
I admit that there are some really cool ARs out there. To me they are just a utilitarian modular machine. Adults can play Mr. Potato Head dress up when they are bored.
Just my personal opinion.
I like them
They are ergonomic
They function well
They are useful and fun
Most are reasonably accurate

There’s not much wow to them for me. Uncle Sam put something similar in my hands at the age of 17 and pretty much kept it there for the next 15 years.
rickyrick is offline  
Old August 23, 2018, 05:42 PM   #45
dvdcrr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 5, 2010
Posts: 665
I will sell all of my AR's. Last one would be the MP10 though
__________________
"All warfare is based on deception. Hence when we are able to attack we must seem unable....when using our forces we must appear inactive. When we are near we must make the enemy believe we are far away."Sun Tzu The Art of War.
dvdcrr is offline  
Old August 31, 2018, 09:54 AM   #46
hdwhit
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 22, 2017
Posts: 1,011
Quote:
zincwarrior wrote:
There is something to be said for good wood furniture.
Wood stocks are available for AR-15-style rifles.

They look pretty good, too.
hdwhit is offline  
Old August 31, 2018, 12:57 PM   #47
COSteve
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 6, 2009
Posts: 1,344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Centuriator View Post
No idea what the OP is talking about. My ARs are my "funnest" rifles to shoot with. To each his own, but ... there you go. Thanks for sharing.
I think that the number of replies that agree with the OP, including mine, demonstrate that many of us who actually own ARs aren't that fond of them. We may feel that they are good 'tools' for their intended purpose instead of looking at them as 'a fine firearm' as we feel for some of our other platforms.

Yes, mine all shoot well, however, I've got 'NM' triggers and other parts to enhance the basic accuracy of my RRAs and S&W AR. Yes, my Mini-14 isn't quite as accurate as my scoped AR, however, with irons at 0 to 200-250yds, I can't tell any difference in accuracy between my Ruger Mini carbine and my RRA AR carbine.



(Thought I'd add a pic of it as my posts above show my other AR and Mini)

As I said, we usually don't have anything against our ARs, it's that we don't get excited about shooting them like we may do with other platforms. Call me 'old fashioned' or just call me 'old'. Both may be true. I'd just rather spend my time shooting another platform. But like you said, "To each his own ..."
COSteve is offline  
Old August 31, 2018, 02:02 PM   #48
stagpanther
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2014
Posts: 11,656
I have fun making one hole bugeyes with AR builds--not an easy thing to do when dealing with all the complexities of cycling, gas system balancing and accurizing the build itself. No other platform compares with the relative ease and effectiveness of the AR build. Just my preferences--it doesn't bother me in the least if nobody agrees with or values the AR in the same way I do.
__________________
"Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill
I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!
stagpanther is offline  
Old September 1, 2018, 08:56 AM   #49
rickyrick
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 15, 2010
Posts: 8,235
It’s not that they are unliked, it’s that they don’t have a lot of ‘wow’ to them. ARs are very good utility weapons. But I would probably ‘like’ something like an old cheap enfield better than an AR. I don’t develop fond warm feelings over a gun any more than I do a towel in a stack of assorted towels.
I like the activities of firearm ownership for sure. I like that you can tinker with ARs and assemble parts during times you can’t shoot. ARs do their task well, in a satisfactory manner. As far as semiautomatic rifles go, they are low cost.

I think more AR owners just have them for their good utilitarian value, not because ARs turn their crank. Some of us have guns we don’t like much and still keep them and then go buy another that we do like.
I’ve though about firing up my forge and making art out of a couple of AR barrels that I haven’t used, lol, then I could appreciate them more.
rickyrick is offline  
Old September 1, 2018, 09:11 AM   #50
COSteve
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 6, 2009
Posts: 1,344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Centuriator View Post
"many of us who actually own ARs aren't that fond of them." Many of us? "Many"? A few of us, some of us, not "many" of us. I think this is kind of a dumb thread. If I had a firearm I didn't like much, I'd get rid of it and buy something I liked.

Carry on.
Maybe you don't get the thrust of this thread. There is a huge gamut of possibilities between really feeling attached to something and not liking it. I don't think that the OP and many of us who responded hate, or dislike the AR, it's rather we might feel ambivalent' about it. Something like a few of the hammers I have. They are tools plain and simple. I don't like or dislike them. I pick them up and use them. That's not the feeling I get when I take up my Mini-14, M1A, Garand, or any of my leverguns. I have an immediate good feeling holding them, shouldering them, and firing them. My ARs are just a tool.
COSteve is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.06646 seconds with 8 queries