Winchester 1873

Twlunt · March 20, 2019, 08:54 PM

Hello all! I’m new to the forum. I have my great great grandfather’s 1873. I’m looking for more info on the rifle. I’m not very knowledgeable with this gun. I’ve seen values all over the map and I’m curious what dictates the value. No I’m not selling it. Ever.

Scorch · March 21, 2019, 02:31 AM

First thing that dictates value is scarcity or rarity. Yes, it is an 1873 rifle (as opposed to a carbine or deluxe rifle), and that is fairly uncommon anymore as they have been out of production for almost 90 years. But in order to be truly rare, it needs to be a variant or model that is hard to find or very desirable, not necessarily just old. Desirability generally goes something like early production > later production, and deluxe rifle > rifle > carbine, but not always. Special models can be extremely valuable.

Next is age, with anything made before 1898 being slightly more valuable than a similar firearm made after that date. First year or last year of production typically counts for a bit more.

Next thing that dictates value is condition, and that doesn't mean "I think it looks pretty good for an old gun", there are guidelines published as to % original finish, or in the case of antique firearms the NRA standard (excellent, fine, very good, good, fair, poor). People throw these terms around, but there are standards for classifying the condition of any firearm and they are published. Rust, dings, visible or poorly done repairs, missing parts or parts replaced with non-factory parts all detract from value (most of the time). Pitted or rusted bore, broken action parts, missing parts, broken wood, etc, are a death sentence.

Next thing that dictates value is factory options and the scarcity of those options. Yours has a tang sight. If it is a Winchester tang sight, the value goes up. If the rifle is engraved, the value goes up. If it has an unusual barrel length, the value goes up. If it was a special order gun, the value goes up. If you have a factory letter that tells condition when it left the factory and it is still in that condition, the value goes up.

If you just want to know about the rifle, you can research it online by finding the date of production (www.proofhouse.com or www.winchestercollector.com), what similar rifles have sold for recently, what was available when, etc. There is a bunch of information about old Winchesters online.

Good luck!

Jim Watson · March 21, 2019, 06:58 AM

All I can add is that you have a round barrel which is less common even though the usual octagon cost more.

Caliber matters, I doubt a .32-20 is worth as much as a .38-40 or .44-40.

You have little or no finish remaining, but I don't see any scrapes, dents, or gouges. Even the one visible screw head is not boogered up.

Looks like the open sight elevator is gone.
I can't make out the front sight but it looks like SOMETHING up there besides a plain blade or bead. Maybe a Beach Combination to go along with the tang sight?

Pathfinder45 · March 21, 2019, 01:22 PM

Welcome to TFl. Clearly, Twlunt, you know exactly what it's worth to you: It's a priceless Family Heirloom. To someone else it's a matter of desire combined with a comparison of what similar items sell for and how motivated the seller might be. I doubt that it would fetch less than $3,000 or more than $10,000; probably closer to the former, unless a previous owner was noted in history.

Pathfinder45 · March 21, 2019, 04:18 PM

Nice rifle,btw, thanks for sharing. Which caliber is it? You can find the date of manufacture by the serial #.

Twlunt · March 21, 2019, 06:49 PM

Thanks all! My great great grandfather fought in the Civil War. 2nd Regt company D US Sharpshooters. This was made in 1888 I think. I actually own his Civil war rifle he used as a sharpshooter with iron clad provenance and the accouterments!
Would that rifle be appropriate for this forum?

Pathfinder45 · March 21, 2019, 08:09 PM

Now it sounds like the whole collection would be great in a museum....but if you were me, you'd want to shoot both rifles at least a little bit.

roc1 · March 22, 2019, 07:22 AM

Looks great I have my great grandad 1873 octagon barrel everything even bullet mold and powder horn. I wrote Winchester they sent letter saying it left factory in 1891. I shot it when I was a kid my grandpa carried me out let me shoot it. As they say wish old rifle could talk be interesting.
Roc1

Fishbed77 · March 22, 2019, 07:56 AM

Quote:

I’ve seen values all over the map and I’m curious what dictates the value. No I’m not selling it. Ever.

Then why be concerned about the value?

Paul B. · March 22, 2019, 11:05 PM

"Then why be concerned about the value? "

I would think for purposes of insuring the rifle(s).
Paul B.

Twlunt · March 22, 2019, 11:09 PM

Yes. For insurance purposes. I have 3 antique shotguns from him as well and I’m willing to let the less valuable ones be wall hangers but the civil war rifle is too valuable and the Winchester may turn out to be as well.

eastbank · March 23, 2019, 03:49 AM

have it cleaned, not to remove any finish but to stop any active rust and that includes the bore. please don,t try to make it look brand new. I have several 1873 rifles and I shoot them.

eastbank · March 23, 2019, 03:54 AM

what caliber is it? if it is ok to shoot it, I would with mild smokless powder ammo, black powder would be ok also but require addition cleaning steps as black powder residue is very corrosive(draws moisture).

Twlunt · March 23, 2019, 08:10 PM

.38 cal is stamped on the bottom.

Jim Watson · March 23, 2019, 11:16 PM

Standing for .38 WCF = .38-40.

March 21, 2019, 02:31 AM	#2
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	First thing that dictates value is scarcity or rarity. Yes, it is an 1873 rifle (as opposed to a carbine or deluxe rifle), and that is fairly uncommon anymore as they have been out of production for almost 90 years. But in order to be truly rare, it needs to be a variant or model that is hard to find or very desirable, not necessarily just old. Desirability generally goes something like early production > later production, and deluxe rifle > rifle > carbine, but not always. Special models can be extremely valuable. Next is age, with anything made before 1898 being slightly more valuable than a similar firearm made after that date. First year or last year of production typically counts for a bit more. Next thing that dictates value is condition, and that doesn't mean "I think it looks pretty good for an old gun", there are guidelines published as to % original finish, or in the case of antique firearms the NRA standard (excellent, fine, very good, good, fair, poor). People throw these terms around, but there are standards for classifying the condition of any firearm and they are published. Rust, dings, visible or poorly done repairs, missing parts or parts replaced with non-factory parts all detract from value (most of the time). Pitted or rusted bore, broken action parts, missing parts, broken wood, etc, are a death sentence. Next thing that dictates value is factory options and the scarcity of those options. Yours has a tang sight. If it is a Winchester tang sight, the value goes up. If the rifle is engraved, the value goes up. If it has an unusual barrel length, the value goes up. If it was a special order gun, the value goes up. If you have a factory letter that tells condition when it left the factory and it is still in that condition, the value goes up. If you just want to know about the rifle, you can research it online by finding the date of production (www.proofhouse.com or www.winchestercollector.com), what similar rifles have sold for recently, what was available when, etc. There is a bunch of information about old Winchesters online. Good luck! __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

March 22, 2019, 11:05 PM	#10
Paul B. Senior Member Join Date: March 28, 1999 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 3,801	"Then why be concerned about the value? " I would think for purposes of insuring the rifle(s). Paul B. __________________ COMPROMISE IS NOT AN OPTION!

March 21, 2019, 06:58 AM	#3
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,535	All I can add is that you have a round barrel which is less common even though the usual octagon cost more. Caliber matters, I doubt a .32-20 is worth as much as a .38-40 or .44-40. You have little or no finish remaining, but I don't see any scrapes, dents, or gouges. Even the one visible screw head is not boogered up. Looks like the open sight elevator is gone. I can't make out the front sight but it looks like SOMETHING up there besides a plain blade or bead. Maybe a Beach Combination to go along with the tang sight?

March 21, 2019, 01:22 PM	#4
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	Welcome to TFl. Clearly, Twlunt, you know exactly what it's worth to you: It's a priceless Family Heirloom. To someone else it's a matter of desire combined with a comparison of what similar items sell for and how motivated the seller might be. I doubt that it would fetch less than $3,000 or more than $10,000; probably closer to the former, unless a previous owner was noted in history.

March 21, 2019, 04:18 PM	#5
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	Nice rifle,btw, thanks for sharing. Which caliber is it? You can find the date of manufacture by the serial #.

March 21, 2019, 06:49 PM	#6
Twlunt Junior Member Join Date: March 19, 2019 Posts: 4	Thanks all! My great great grandfather fought in the Civil War. 2nd Regt company D US Sharpshooters. This was made in 1888 I think. I actually own his Civil war rifle he used as a sharpshooter with iron clad provenance and the accouterments! Would that rifle be appropriate for this forum?

March 21, 2019, 08:09 PM	#7
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	Now it sounds like the whole collection would be great in a museum....but if you were me, you'd want to shoot both rifles at least a little bit.

March 22, 2019, 07:22 AM	#8
roc1 Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2005 Location: Lubbock Texas Posts: 560	Looks great I have my great grandad 1873 octagon barrel everything even bullet mold and powder horn. I wrote Winchester they sent letter saying it left factory in 1891. I shot it when I was a kid my grandpa carried me out let me shoot it. As they say wish old rifle could talk be interesting. Roc1

March 22, 2019, 11:09 PM	#11
Twlunt Junior Member Join Date: March 19, 2019 Posts: 4	Yes. For insurance purposes. I have 3 antique shotguns from him as well and I’m willing to let the less valuable ones be wall hangers but the civil war rifle is too valuable and the Winchester may turn out to be as well.

March 23, 2019, 03:49 AM	#12
eastbank Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2008 Location: pa. Posts: 2,450	have it cleaned, not to remove any finish but to stop any active rust and that includes the bore. please don,t try to make it look brand new. I have several 1873 rifles and I shoot them.

March 23, 2019, 03:54 AM	#13
eastbank Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2008 Location: pa. Posts: 2,450	what caliber is it? if it is ok to shoot it, I would with mild smokless powder ammo, black powder would be ok also but require addition cleaning steps as black powder residue is very corrosive(draws moisture).

March 23, 2019, 08:10 PM	#14
Twlunt Junior Member Join Date: March 19, 2019 Posts: 4	.38 cal is stamped on the bottom.

March 23, 2019, 11:16 PM	#15
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,535	Standing for .38 WCF = .38-40.