Silencers for Air Guns-Are they Legal?? - Page 3

FirstFreedom · May 7, 2007, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Any substance concerntrated at the muzzle that will slow the release of gas without detrimental degradation of the projectile's trajectory will effectively supress any firearm - no doubts paper and tape will do that. If you make one, you have yourself a serious "make firearm", NFA problem.

Right. Problem is, an airgun is not a "firearm" under federal law, IINM. So none of that matters or applies. Suppress to your heart's content, I do believe. But the above advice is good about writing the BATFE to be sure.

**JohnKSa** · May 7, 2007, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Problem is, an airgun is not a "firearm" under federal law, IINM.

If the device constructed is considered a silencer by the BATF, it's regulated in and of itself--regardless of what it is attached to or what you intend to attach it to.

Travismaine · May 7, 2007, 10:34 AM

#1 A suppressor is a suppressor regardless of what it is being used on.

#2 To own a suppressor you have to fill out the paperwork and get the 200 dollar tax stamp.

#3 Many people have said things like its just for a paintball gun or its just for a bb gun. Those people found out the hard way the GOV does not care.

#4 Make no mistake a suppressor is a NFA weapon. It does not make a difference what is is going on.

Chris Phelps · May 7, 2007, 11:50 AM

I am surely late, but I will step in from the paintball gun aspect.

I contacted BATFE about 3 years ago asking about suppressing the volume of my paintball gun, and was given the go-ahead for my idea... since it was neither a permanent or detachable item... or even an item at all, really.

I had a small chunk of fiberglass that was left over from a repacking job on the exhaust of my 4 wheeler. All I did was wrap duct tape ONCE around each end. Make sure you leave it open... if you have a fully closed off area, you have just overstepped your bounds. They said this was fine, since there was no shell/casing and since I would have to literally destroy the fiberglass to remove it from the barrel.

FYI - it didnt do anything anyway. It just slightly altered the report.. thus making me much easier to find mid-game. After about 5 minutes into a game, I pulled the fiberglass off and trashed it.

On another note... when it comes to paintball guns, there is no way of making anything permanent or integral... the barrel is still removable. Since the barrel is about the same size as a normal 22LR suppressor, this is a HUGE no no.

FirstFreedom · May 7, 2007, 12:14 PM

Quote:

If the device constructed is considered a silencer by the BATF, it's regulated in and of itself--regardless of what it is attached to or what you intend to attach it to.

Oh, ok, gotcha - sorry, I'm dense....

FirstFreedom · May 20, 2007, 07:33 PM

http://www.pyramydair.com/site/articles/silencers/

excellent discussion of the subject.

Working Man · May 28, 2007, 12:15 PM

Chris,

Thats interesting. Action Pursuit advertised silencers years back when I use to
look through their magazine. I wonder if they just were not very effective or
if those companies were walking on thin ice.

tatera · June 16, 2007, 10:29 PM

Built in supression:
http://www.gamousa.com/Catalog.aspx?Product=234

Lavid2002 · June 16, 2007, 10:48 PM

Use a watter bottle stuffed with cotton : )

Gunfixr · June 16, 2007, 10:50 PM

I talked to ATF on this very matter just over 20 yrs ago. I asked about suppressing an airgun since the airgun was not considered a firearm. I was told that so long as it could not be made to work on a firearm it would be legal. So I took the airgun I had at the time that I wanted suppressed, turned down and ported the barrel, and made end collars to hold a very thin walled tube on the barrel which was packed with cotton. It worked great. if you removed the end collars, the whole thing became a bunch of loose parts due to the ends not being attached to the tube. Also, Even if you were to put it on a barrel, you would first have to turn it down, or bore out the collars, and port the barrel. This is modifying the firearm. Therefore, it will not attach to and suppress a firearm without modification to the firearm first. Simply threading the muzzle would not be sufficient. During the AWB, and even now, you can screw a muzzle attachment to the end of a rifle's barrel and then blind pin it and the attachment is considered permanently attached and the threads not to exist. This is legal. Simply drilling out the blind pin will undo this, but that doesn't matter because machining is required to facilitate the removal.

tatera · August 13, 2007, 06:05 AM

Here is a review of Gamo's air rifle having an integrated silencer.

http://www.gatewaytoairguns.com/airg...d=28077#M28077

They described the difference with super sonic pellets like going from a .22 long to a .22 short. With regular pellets, it doesn't seem to offer much reduction.

This would seem to be insuffient for urban or even suburban target shooting. If you shoot something that sounds like a .22 in close quarters, it seems like you should expect a visit from the police.

Nonetheless - it does demonstrate a flexibility by the BATF in regards to the employ of silencer techonology on air rifles. It is absolutely legal to suppress an air rifle. The trick is getting to that point without having a silencer detached from the rifle itself. A slippery legal slope.

barnetmill · August 14, 2007, 03:47 PM

Has anyone ever asked the ATF if possession of a small gasoline engine with a detachable muffler is a firearms violation? Some of these could be slipped over the muzzle of a .22 rifle and I am sure that the decibel level would be reduced by at least one db.

In England engine mufflers are called silencers.

I have read the Beeman article and under no conditions would I construct my own air gun silencer without a BATFE letter of approval. $200 hundred dollars is a lot cheaper than paying the cost of a trial and getting convicted. I would buy a legally imported airgun with a silencer if the ATF has approved it with a letter as they do for the sale of "assault weapons".

May 7, 2007, 11:50 AM	#54
Chris Phelps Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2005 Location: South China, Maine Posts: 814	I am surely late, but I will step in from the paintball gun aspect. I contacted BATFE about 3 years ago asking about suppressing the volume of my paintball gun, and was given the go-ahead for my idea... since it was neither a permanent or detachable item... or even an item at all, really. I had a small chunk of fiberglass that was left over from a repacking job on the exhaust of my 4 wheeler. All I did was wrap duct tape ONCE around each end. Make sure you leave it open... if you have a fully closed off area, you have just overstepped your bounds. They said this was fine, since there was no shell/casing and since I would have to literally destroy the fiberglass to remove it from the barrel. FYI - it didnt do anything anyway. It just slightly altered the report.. thus making me much easier to find mid-game. After about 5 minutes into a game, I pulled the fiberglass off and trashed it. On another note... when it comes to paintball guns, there is no way of making anything permanent or integral... the barrel is still removable. Since the barrel is about the same size as a normal 22LR suppressor, this is a HUGE no no. __________________ Bushmaster Superlight AR-15 5.56mm / Custom 24" Heavy BBL Varmint AR-15 5.56mm / Ruger M77 .257 Roberts / Ruger MKI 22LR Pistol / EAA Witness 9mm Pistol / Daisy 2202 22LR / Remington Viper 522 22LR / Stevens 200 .223 / Savage 10FP 24" .308 / Mauser 98 Sporter 30-06

May 20, 2007, 07:33 PM	#56
FirstFreedom Junior member Join Date: May 31, 2004 Location: The Toll Road State, U.S.A. Posts: 12,451	Lookie here http://www.pyramydair.com/site/articles/silencers/ excellent discussion of the subject.

June 16, 2007, 10:29 PM	#58
tatera Member Join Date: March 6, 2007 Posts: 58	Comercial silencer on pellet gun Built in supression: http://www.gamousa.com/Catalog.aspx?Product=234

June 16, 2007, 10:48 PM	#59
Lavid2002 Senior Member Join Date: April 6, 2007 Posts: 2,568	Hmmmmm.....Try making one with a water bottle Use a watter bottle stuffed with cotton : ) __________________ Math>Grammar

June 16, 2007, 10:50 PM	#60
Gunfixr Senior Member Join Date: June 10, 2007 Location: East Coast, USA Posts: 360	I talked to ATF on this very matter just over 20 yrs ago. I asked about suppressing an airgun since the airgun was not considered a firearm. I was told that so long as it could not be made to work on a firearm it would be legal. So I took the airgun I had at the time that I wanted suppressed, turned down and ported the barrel, and made end collars to hold a very thin walled tube on the barrel which was packed with cotton. It worked great. if you removed the end collars, the whole thing became a bunch of loose parts due to the ends not being attached to the tube. Also, Even if you were to put it on a barrel, you would first have to turn it down, or bore out the collars, and port the barrel. This is modifying the firearm. Therefore, it will not attach to and suppress a firearm without modification to the firearm first. Simply threading the muzzle would not be sufficient. During the AWB, and even now, you can screw a muzzle attachment to the end of a rifle's barrel and then blind pin it and the attachment is considered permanently attached and the threads not to exist. This is legal. Simply drilling out the blind pin will undo this, but that doesn't matter because machining is required to facilitate the removal. __________________ NRA Life, Glock Advanced Armorer Gunsmith for Unique Armament Creations, 07/SOT

May 7, 2007, 10:34 AM	#53
Travismaine Senior Member Join Date: July 19, 2006 Posts: 147	#1 A suppressor is a suppressor regardless of what it is being used on. #2 To own a suppressor you have to fill out the paperwork and get the 200 dollar tax stamp. #3 Many people have said things like its just for a paintball gun or its just for a bb gun. Those people found out the hard way the GOV does not care. #4 Make no mistake a suppressor is a NFA weapon. It does not make a difference what is is going on.

May 28, 2007, 12:15 PM	#57
Working Man Member Join Date: May 28, 2007 Location: DFW, Tx Posts: 17	Chris, Thats interesting. Action Pursuit advertised silencers years back when I use to look through their magazine. I wonder if they just were not very effective or if those companies were walking on thin ice.

August 13, 2007, 06:05 AM	#61
tatera Member Join Date: March 6, 2007 Posts: 58	Production Noise Reduction Here is a review of Gamo's air rifle having an integrated silencer. http://www.gatewaytoairguns.com/airg...d=28077#M28077 They described the difference with super sonic pellets like going from a .22 long to a .22 short. With regular pellets, it doesn't seem to offer much reduction. This would seem to be insuffient for urban or even suburban target shooting. If you shoot something that sounds like a .22 in close quarters, it seems like you should expect a visit from the police. Nonetheless - it does demonstrate a flexibility by the BATF in regards to the employ of silencer techonology on air rifles. It is absolutely legal to suppress an air rifle. The trick is getting to that point without having a silencer detached from the rifle itself. A slippery legal slope.

August 14, 2007, 03:47 PM	#62
barnetmill Senior Member Join Date: January 25, 2005 Posts: 121	Has anyone ever asked the ATF if possession of a small gasoline engine with a detachable muffler is a firearms violation? Some of these could be slipped over the muzzle of a .22 rifle and I am sure that the decibel level would be reduced by at least one db. In England engine mufflers are called silencers. I have read the Beeman article and under no conditions would I construct my own air gun silencer without a BATFE letter of approval. $200 hundred dollars is a lot cheaper than paying the cost of a trial and getting convicted. I would buy a legally imported airgun with a silencer if the ATF has approved it with a letter as they do for the sale of "assault weapons".