Is a primer arm/feeder a worthy upgrade for a relic turret press?

[flyboy015]

A few months back I was generously gifted a (mostly) complete reloading kit of odds and ends- including a vintage Lyman T-Mag Turret press, and a Lee auto prime handheld priming tool, among others. The auto prime is one of the older ones it seems, with the circular tray, which I've heard are better than the more modern versions. Of course I bought a set of shell holders specific to the tool. The auto prime looks to be NIB and gently used, if used at all.

As I've been doing my research, I come across a lot of people who say "get a primer tool for your press, the handheld ones suck" or something similar.

Being that this press has a 6-die turret, would I benefit from a universal primer arm and auto primer feed from Lyman? It looks like it would cost me close to $60...would this greatly increase the speed of the priming process? Would the press-mounted primer seat primers more easily, or with more consistent depth, etc?

I plan to mostly reload 9mm and .223 for the foreseeable future, if that has any bearing on the subject.

[ammo.crafter]

Hello fellow Keystone resident.

I try my best to eliminate touching primers with my hands as the oils on your hands could effect primer performance.

An auto priming arm is a smart accessory to add to your present reloader. Go for it.

[pete2]

The Lee primer tool is about 50 times better than priming on the press. Even a single shot hand primer tool is better. I have the old Lee and a later RCBS tool, both way better than the primer arm deal. The Lee is delicate, it can break or parts wear out but they are cheap to replace. It doesn't hurt to have 2 of them. 1 for large primers, one for small. You'll also have a spare when one goes down.
My 2 cents, your mileage may vary.

To be clear, I'm not talking about priming on a progressive press, my Dillon works great. The single stage press with the priming arm is what I was referring to. This includes turret presses like the Lyman, crappy way to prime cases.

[Aguila Blanca]

I prime off the press, using the same original Lee Auto Prime handheld priming tool.

Reading about reloading on progressive presses, it seems that the aspect most usually responsible for problems is the priming mechanism. I could load a little faster by using some sort of on-press priming system, but I prefer not to deal with the potential aggravation.

[Wyosam]

I’ve never figured out why priming on the press gets such a bad rap. I’ve never had an issue with it (lee classic turret). Loading 9mm and 223, I’d spend that $60 in a heartbeat. If you were only loading low volume rifle rounds, it might not be worth it, but especially for 9mm I’d get set up to crank out some volume.


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[wjhenderson]

Sometimes I prime on the press. My Lyman s-stage came with an RCBS universal primer arm but was missing the cups. I called RCBS to order a new assy and they sent me a complete arm assy including lg and small cups free of charge. Amazing. I usually prime with a Frankfort Arsenal hand primer. It's heavy metal and works circles around the Lee Auto Prime (round tray version) which I also have.

[LAH]

Like Wyosam I would spend the 60 bucks. I had the hand primers but didn't care for them at all. I do all my priming on the press regardless of which press.

[jaguarxk120]

I use two stand alone priming tools mounted on the bench.
They are both older RCBS tools but work great.
They use standard shell holders and will hold 100 primers in a tube.

[Unclenick]

I have an old Lyman Spartan Turret (Spar-T) press that came with the priming arm. I used it at first, but gave it up for the original Lee Autoprime hand tool. The time it takes to get the primers into the feed tube from a tray when, unlike a Dillon, you can't preload multiple extras, is longer than the time it takes to get them mouth-up in the hand tool, plus, I can sit in front of the TV and prime with the hand tool. Saves time standing at the bench.

[Marco Califo]

I used a Spar-T Lyman turret or many years. I did use the primer arm, but not the tubes. I have a newer model, with that same old priming arm I left in place. In actual practice though I use a RCBS hand primer for all priming. I like the feel and instant visual feedback. Then I take primed brass to whichever press I am using.

[44 AMP]

The time it takes to get the primers into the feed tube from a tray when, unlike a Dillon, you can't preload multiple extras,

You can "preload" as many Lyman primer tubes as you have tubes. I did it for decades using a Lyman Spartan and Spar-T presses, Also exactly the same thing using RCBS JR and Rockchucker.

The main advantage to on press priming is just that, its on the press. You don't have to remove the case, prime it, then put it back in the press.

The downside is, "its on the press". You don't get the same "feel" you get with a hand priming system. There are parts in the on press systems that simply have to work together properly, and often do not. You have to pay attention to the primer feed, ensure each primer drops into the cup CORRECTLY. I've had many, over the years that drop in tilted, on edge, or even completely upside down (and I KNOW they were right side up when they went in the tube...)

I have, somewhere, one of the old Lee hand tools, worked well, but I stopped using it in favor of the larger RCBS one, which uses the same shell holders as my press.

These days I reload in "batches", on a single stage press. I've done the turret press and the progressive press thing, and I'm done with them. Too many things that can potentially screw up.

All the brass I'm going to load in a particular caliber gets processed in batches, one loading step at a time. All get sized (measured and trimmed if needed), then all get primed. I do powder charging and weighing off the press, cases in multiple loading blocks (empties base up). Block full, visual inspection of powder level, all cases. Then bullet seating.

ITs not the fastest possible method, but I'm no longer interested in speed loading. It works for me, you do what you want to do. But when you crush a primer or load one upside down, don't say you weren't warned!

[Unclenick]

I didn't remember those tubes being as easy to fill as the Dillon. I only owned the two that came with the press. I'll have to dig them out and refresh my memory.

[FrankenMauser]

I had a Lyman T-Mag II turret, and still have a Redding T-7. They use different styles of automatic priming.

Both get in the way.
Both annoyed me.

I stuck with hand priming 99% of the time (RCBS hand prime, in my case), whether loading on the turret presses or the single-stage presses.

However, I snagged an RCBS automatic bench primer on clearance, a couple (few?) years ago. That is now my go-to priming tool.
You won't see me priming on a press again, unless it's a progressive press.
Even the hand priming tool hasn't seen more than about 100 cases through it, since the bench prime got mounted to the bench. (And even that was only because I had a bunch of crap stacked up, preventing easy access to the bench priming tool.)


So, my opinion?
Hand priming is better.
Bench priming is better still.

[44 AMP]

I didn't remember those tubes being as easy to fill as the Dillon.

Both work the same way, The Dillon tubes I used had a plastic part at the pickup end, and required a little less effort to push the primer in, compared to the split end metal tube Lyman used. I felt it a very minor thing.

With the retaining pin in place, both kinds can be "preloaded" and ready for use, equally.

[flyboy015]

I appreciate all the input!

Having used the Lee hand tool this past weekend, I have to say, having the tactile feedback and instantly knowing when the primer has bottomed out in the primer pocket, seems pretty invaluable. I think for now I'll stick with it, maybe check out an RCBS or Franford Arsenal hand primer in the near future.

[pwc]

I don't understand everyone's statements about the tactile feedback and knowing when the primer is seated. I have pnly one press, an 80yr old Pacific "C" with primer feed attch. I can easily feel the primer slide in and bottom out. I've never crushed a primer in 37 yrs, 2 upside down, and one sideways, all the operator's (me) fault.

Maybe it's because my rig isn't moving so much mass and doesn't use a toggle link.

[FrankenMauser]

Take what you feel with the C press (I have one as well), and multiply that by about 20 for a hand priming tool or the RCBS bench prime.

[pwc]

FrankenMauser - how much "feel" is enough?

[FrankenMauser]

That depends on how much you care.

But if you do care; the more, the better.

[pwc]

Originally Posted by FrankenMauser

That depends on how much you care.

But if you do care; the more, the better.

No, if by "care" it is meant to denigrate on press seating in favor of hand held seating, fact is fact; when it is seated, it's seated.

How it gets there is personal preference only, one is not better than the other.

[FrankenMauser]

Absolutely.
If all you care about is smashing primers into primer pockets, then that is the perfect attitude to have. "Seated is seated."


But if you want to feel the anvil touch down, and feel the pellet compress as the cup continues seating, then you need a better tool.
On-press priming does not allow that, on any press that I have ever used.

How it gets there is personal preference only, one is not better than the other.

Oh, but it is.
Several benchrest shooters have published articles on testing properly seated primers against primers left flush with the case head and primers simply 'smashed' into the primer pocket (a la "seated is seated"), and shown that properly seated primers offer more reliable and more consistent ignition. (Meaning better extreme spreads and lower standard deviations, resulting in less vertical dispersion.)

At one point in time, there was an Accurate Shooter article by Frank Galli, going over methodical testing of primer seating depth and how much "pre-crush" of the priming pellet was ideal. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be up any more. (Perhaps because of his move to Snipers Hide. I don't know.)
His conclusion and what the data showed: It matters if you want the best ammo you can put together.

But if you just want stuff to go bang and have an angry mass of precious metal come out the dangerous end.... Well, there's always "seated is seated".
...Until you over-seat enough to crack the pellet to the point that it falls apart, and won't go off at all when the firing pin strikes the cup. But, hey, seated is seated, right?

[jetinteriorguy]

The Lee hand primer does offer a nice tactile feel for sure, but I like the Frankford Arsenal priming tool better. It’s built better and requires much less effort to use and it feeds primers better than the current Lee setup, in otherwords smoother and more consistent than the funky folding primer tray and funky plastic springy looking thing that lifts the primers from the tray to the chamber. Just my experience after loading thousands of rounds with both tools.

[LAH]

I have a Dillon I can feel nothing with while seating a primer. I have another Dillon which is better. I have a RCBS RC which has a great feel. I have a Pacific "C" I prime on top & can tell the instant the primer seats. These presses are all mounted solid. That makes a great difference. I loaded on a Dillon RL1000 mounted to a steel table set in concrete. Even with cases in all stations I could feel the primer seat home.

[pwc]

FrankenMauser: It's apparent that primer seating is an emotional issue with you by your chooce ov evocative language as "smashing primers" and "properly seated". As I said, I've never crushed a primer, and who are you to infer my primers are not "properly" seated? As I said before, the method of seating primers is personal choice.

[FrankenMauser]

You're the one that came looking for an argument.
You got one.
You have an opinion. I am attempting to direct you to investigate fact. (I refuse to spoon-feed people.)

Don't run away now.
The spectators were starting to get entertained.



P.S.: "Smash" and "crush" are not the same word.