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Old July 14, 2021, 07:28 AM   #1
hounddawg
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what new powders are you experimenting with ?

the Ramshot Hunter thread got me to thinking. The shortages on a lot of our old standbys has us experimenting with other powders.

As I start to use up my H4350, 8208, Varget and 4831 SC I plan on trying several other powders such as several of the Vihtavuori as well as Shooter World offerings. Recently I have switched to TAC in my .308 to replace Varget and H322 in my .223's. Getting great results I might add.

So what new powders have you been experimenting with or plan on trying in the near future to replace your old standbys?
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Old July 14, 2021, 07:51 AM   #2
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I was fortunate to buy 8# of Green Dot and 8# of 231 during the pandemic. I was already playing with Power pistol and CFE Pistol. Green Dot and 231 cover most of my needs for shotgun and handgun. I do have a pound of 2400 and a dab of H110 for the .44. I don't really do much experimenting with new powders just for the fun of it. Currently using WST in 45 and .38 and Tite Group in 9mm, when it's gone it'll be G D and 231.
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Old July 14, 2021, 08:03 AM   #3
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Quote:
I don't really do much experimenting with new powders just for the fun of it
neither do I but as my supplies of Hogdon and IMR powders diminish a bit and as alternate Accurate, VV, and Shooters World powders become available I do want to get a few pounds of possible alternates to develop as standbys for the next time.
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Old July 14, 2021, 12:16 PM   #4
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Seven years ago when there was another major shortage, I bought up multiple cans of the only thing I could get my hands on for my shotshell loading - 700X (I had previously been set on Green Dot for various reasons). Ironically, life cut into my shotshell loading, but I also had an eye on my handgun needs so I have more powder for my 9mm and shotshell than I can currently hope to use.

Primers are a somewhat different story, of course, but with my shooting being mostly casual, I'm not consuming ammo in huge volumes.

Last edited by pathdoc; July 14, 2021 at 12:24 PM.
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Old July 14, 2021, 12:24 PM   #5
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Nothing this time around. Just so happens I'm in the middle of moving to Idaho and all my equipment is packed and stored in a warehouse.

But during the shortage of 2013:

I was caught flat-footed for components and made due with the crumbs I could find. I'd say during that shortage, my biggest desperation find was Power Pistol. I had barely even heard of it. My LGS got in 10#'s of it and I grabbed the 1# ration limit (which I agreed with). Power Pistol is amazing stuff. Makes bullets go fast. And although I believe it's tailored for semi-auto's (aren't they all these days ), it does extremely well in magnum revolvers, using light bullets. I'm getting 1350 f/s through a 4" bbl with 125 grain bullets. Yes, I know other propellants (2400 and the like) can exceed that. But PP does it with minimal flash and recoil compared to any of the big, slow propellants that can yield only slightly higher velocities. Just fantastic "balanced" high-performance ammo (I believe 1350 f/s is more than sufficient).

For me, Power Pistol has also delivered maximum velocity with 230g HP's for 45 ACP, with extremely low SD's. Similar results with 9mm 124's too.

Power Pistol is now a staple in my powder inventory.
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Old July 15, 2021, 05:09 AM   #6
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Staball 6.5. My first attempt was just yesterday in my 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser. I’m yet to try it in any of my 6.5CM’s since I have plenty of H4350. So far I’ve tried RE16 and IMR4350 in the Mauser with not the best results, but the Staball shows promise.
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Old July 15, 2021, 07:02 AM   #7
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If you monitor PV closely you can can pretty much find almost any of the powders eventually--the main exception to that being the most popular Alliant powders and powders by shooters world and norma. I bought quite a bit of TCM since it's been widely available and will start experimenting with it soon. I had just started using IMR's enduron powders more widely when the pandemic shortage hit--I've been very impressed with them--especially 7977.
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Old July 15, 2021, 07:21 AM   #8
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During the last shortage, I found myself low on Reloder 15 and bought a jug of IMR-4320 as a possible substitute. It certainly wasn't one-for-one, but I now load a number of my rounds with it. Ironically, during the current shortage, Re-15 has been the only Alliant Reloder series I have been able to restock.
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Old July 15, 2021, 08:15 AM   #9
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Sometimes we have to get what we can get. I usually use G D for shotgun(12 & 20), Can use 231 for handguns, not my favorite but suitable. I really like WST in .45 and .38 for target loads, Hodgdon won't give us loads with WST in 9MM for what ever reason, it can be any more dangerous than Tite Group but what ever sells powder, I guess.
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Old July 15, 2021, 11:59 AM   #10
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I reload mostly handgun and some cast bullet rifle .
And for decades only used Bullseye , Unique and 2400 ... but during the 2012 shortage I "discovered" : Accurate Powders #2 and #5 , 700X , Red Dot , TiteGroup , HP38 and on the back shelf of my powder closet I found two unopened cans of Alcan #5 ...rediscovery of an oldie but a goodie .
I have heard that HP38 is now the same as 231 , so I can add 231 to the list .

The one thing these shortages did force me to do was try new powders ... and that was a good thing ... Accurate #2 & #5 and Red Dot are quickly becoming "new" favorites !
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Old July 15, 2021, 12:14 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete2 View Post
Hodgdon won't give us loads with WST in 9MM for what ever reason, it can be any more dangerous than Tite Group but what ever sells powder, I guess.
And neither did Winchester....maybe those reasons are related to safety.
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Old July 15, 2021, 01:32 PM   #12
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This is a very interesting thread and I hope to learn something, and maybe get some suggestions on what to try and what to shy away from.

I load Reloder 15 for .223 for Service Rifle and Midrange Prone, and IMR 4895 for the Garand. Last winter I ran low on Re-15 and 4895 and a friend sold me an 8-lb can of IMR 4064, which is a known "good powder" for the Garand. Looked up some .223 loads and it was supposed to be good in that cartridge, but it meters poorly.

Long story short, I started trickling every charge for 600 yard XC, and for 300 and 600 MR. Tedious but it worked to improve my scores - probably having to do with confidence rather than accuracy, but who knows?

I've seen AA 2460, 2520, and 2495 listed as usable for both Garand and .223 / AR-15. I've never loaded any of them.

Also a few other powders - H335 among them (used that years ago, no issues and not sure why I stopped loading it) - and Winchester 748 (years ago had a reputation for temperature sensitivity - not sure if it is true or not).

Having shot up the best part of the 4064 I'm wondering what to try next, if No Re-15 or 4895 are available. I'd buy another 8-lb of 4064 in a heartbeat, but one has to be open to trying new things.

So I watch this thread to find out what other people are trying, and if anyone has any suggestions or warnings I'll take them to heart. Thanks.
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Old July 15, 2021, 03:31 PM   #13
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9mm I got back into last year, had been a few years. I tried N350, AA #7, HP-38, and Power Pistol. I settled on power pistol and it dried up before I could get more so I ended using HP-38. I scored some Power Pistol yesterday so I'm keeping the HP-38 for other things.

38spl Just started loading for this. Tried HP-38 and Power Pistol. Both got me where I wanted to be, just under 1000fps with some 160g cast lead round flat points. Decided to save the Power Pistol for 9mm

357 mag, just starting to load for this as well. Using Hodgdon Lil'Gun. I was able to get a 158g Hornady XTP up above 1400fps using published data. I m looking into some loads using HP-38 or power pistol for some lighter 125g bullets. Also tried some H110. with some 125g bullets. it was ok. got more tinkering to do.

223 I was using benchmark. However that dried up. I ended up switching to CFE223. No my favorite powder but it seems to work ok and I was able to get enough to last me a while.

30-06 I had settled on varget, then it was gone. I switched over to Big Game and have been getting ok results. I also picked up some BL-c(2) to try but have not had a chance to try any of it yet but it was working well in 308.
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Old July 16, 2021, 01:46 PM   #14
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After using Unique for the last 20 years, I tried Universal 15 month ago and like it. It's similar in burn rate and was available. I just recently found some CCE-Pistol. While the price was not great, it shoots fine. Between the two, I should be able to keep shooing my nines for another couple of years now.
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Old July 16, 2021, 02:22 PM   #15
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Interesting thread.
My new powders that Im trying are,
1. Rl33
2.N170
3. 2495
4.N540
5. H414
These powders were bought at the middle of the Pandemic crunch.
The slow powders are being tested with heavy bullets in 7 Rem and .300 Mag, while the others are being tested in .223 rem and .308 Win.
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Old July 16, 2021, 02:48 PM   #16
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Swapped some R-17 to try R-19 into 30-06 (175 gr Bullets)

Result was not a bad group (1/2 MOA) but at an astonishing 2850 fps (should have been around 2550-2600)

Going to pull the bullets and download it to a more sane velocity. Its target shooting and I am not out to emulate a 300 WM
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Old July 16, 2021, 06:15 PM   #17
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Next week I plan on starting to spend some time with my .308 build and will be using TAC with 175 gn Barnes Match Burners. I have always used TAC in my .223 gas guns and before that in a .204 Ruger bolt rifle but never in a .308.

A few weeks back I screwed on a old Savage factory barrel with a low round count and did a quick velocity check. I was able to get a few decent groups and single digit SD's even on a rough load test. I have been waiting on a new Shilen barrel to do any further testing but I really would like to shoot this rifle in my next 800 match so I am going to see what I can get out of the factory barrel while waiting.

Also been playing with N133 with 68 gn Berger flat bases in my 6BR, which is another bullet/powder I have never tried. It's makes a good combo and while a bit wind sensitive past 300 at 100 to 200 yards it is stupid accurate.

I have a few odds and ends of other powders and bullets I want to try as time goes by but have gotten caught up with rimfire fever recently and that has ate up most of my range time as of late
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Old July 16, 2021, 07:17 PM   #18
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Quote:
but have gotten caught up with rimfire fever recently
I feel your pain.
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Old July 17, 2021, 09:29 AM   #19
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Ramshot XTerminator is new to me with the 223. IMR8208XBR is also kindof new for 308 because I couldn't get H4895.
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Old July 19, 2021, 01:10 PM   #20
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Another question - possible a stupid question but I'll risk it.

Does anyone have any information on Accurate Arms 4064 versus IMR 4064?

I was googling and found an old TFL thread https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=516631 that seemed to suggest it was worth trying - not to directly substitute, but ballpark enough to buy some and work up loads.

Actually found it in stock at https://shop.hodgdon.com/accurate/accurate-4064r but hesitated - too good to be true?

So looking for y'all's opinions. Thanks in advance.
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Old July 19, 2021, 02:54 PM   #21
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I googled and found that there are a lot of threads on IMR 4064 vs Accurate 4064. It is definitely not the same powder and burn rates are slightly different. If it were me I would grab a few pounds and do a load workup using the Accurate load data charts.

https://www.accuratepowder.com/wp-co...d_data_3.5.pdf

edit - looks like limited load data available, what cartridge you planning on using it in
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Old July 19, 2021, 03:49 PM   #22
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My grubby hands found some VV N320. Going to try it on my 9mm and 45ACP guns.
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Old July 19, 2021, 04:39 PM   #23
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hounddawg, Thanks! It is for .223 for an AR spacegun Service Rifle, as well as for the Garand. All indications are it is fine for the Garand.

I bought the IMR 4064 because I was running out of IMR 4895 for the Garand, and it worked like a charm - and found some IMR 4064 load data in the Sierra pamphlets for various weights of .223, and found it worked like a charm there, too. Have to weigh each charge for 300 and 600, but all that did was increase my confidence in the loads and reduce my SD (as measured by the ShotMarker).

As you noted, there is no .223 Rem data for AA 4064 in the Accurate .pdf so I was thrown off track.

I am not stupid enough to just try the same charge weights - they are, after all, different powders even if they have the same numerical designation. But having someone whose judgement and knowledge I respect tell me to go ahead and try it might be enough to push me over the edge.

It will not go to waste even if not good in .223; it is "known good" in Garand. Thanks!

Edited to add: ordered 8 lbs, I think it is worth a shot (pun intended) and, as stated, it is good for the Garand in any case (even in old LC cases).
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Old July 21, 2021, 02:02 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hounddawg View Post
the Ramshot Hunter thread got me to thinking. The shortages on a lot of our old standbys has us experimenting with other powders.

As I start to use up my H4350, 8208, Varget and 4831 SC I plan on trying several other powders such as several of the Vihtavuori as well as Shooter World offerings. Recently I have switched to TAC in my .308 to replace Varget and H322 in my .223's. Getting great results I might add.

So what new powders have you been experimenting with or plan on trying in the near future to replace your old standbys?
Even pre-shortage, I had pretty much switched to Staball 6.5 in most of my stuff. That's the best powder ever to be manufactured if it is the right burn rate for your application.
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Old July 21, 2021, 11:57 PM   #25
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Local shop finally got primers, powder and bullets in stock, (since I moved and cannot run my lead pot right now), and I bought some HS-6 to try with 9mm. I haven't actually LOADED any yet, but I have it to try. Never used it before.
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