Gracey Trimmer for 223

Wrangler5 · July 16, 2006, 12:35 PM

I've used a Gracey trimmer happily for years trimming Lake City 308 brass. Just got a 223 rifle, and bought the 223 case bushing from Gracey to do about 1,000 cases before starting an accuracy load hunt. I've adjusted the cutters, but have not yet done any serious trimming because there seems to be a problem with the case bushing.

With the 308 setup, when you push a case into the case bushing it just slides in easily until the shoulder hits the end and then stops - case is solidly in place, cannot be pushed farther in, has no lateral wobble, but can be rotated and removed easily. With the 223, though, the case goes in until it hits some resistance, but then can be pushed in another 0.050 to 0.090 (against increasing resistance - feels like it's being wedged.) At this point it is solidly bottomed out, but cannot be rotated and sometimes needs pliers to extract it from the bushing.

Cases are once fired Lake City brass, which have been full length resized with a new Lee die, then case lube removed. Had to shoulder length after sizing is correct according to my Forster case length gauge. The inside of the case bushing is clean and dry. The Gracey trimmer requires each case to be pushed in firmly (to the same point - shoulder contact on the inside of the case bushing) to assure case length trimming consistency. I just can't do that with these 223 cases, unless I push to the point I need pliers to extract the case (which slows down the process something awful

)

Strangely, commercial rounds from Win and Rem drop into the case bushing like the 308 cases did - easy insertion, solid stop, and can be rotated but without lateral slop. This makes me think that the 223 resizing die is not shaping the LC brass the same as the commercial loads, yet both the resized cases and the commercial loads seem to fit (and measure) exactly the same in my Forster case length gauge.

If the sized cases check out OK in the Forster gauge I don't think I can blame the Lee dies. I'll call Gracey next week to see if they have any ideas, but am wondering if any of you have had this experience, or perhaps a suggestion for a solution?

Bullet94 · July 16, 2006, 01:34 PM

Sounds like maybe the case rims are bent. Might have been loaded hot. I’ve loaded some LC brass pretty hot and had the same trouble your having, but not in a Gracey. I had trouble getting them in a 223 case holder. Did they fit easily into your case holder when you sized them?

Wrangler5 · July 16, 2006, 03:17 PM

Well, I don't think it's a rim issue. The Gracey case bushing only covers the top half of the case. You hold the rim and push the case into the case bushing, which you index to be the proper distance from the cutter assembly. You push the case into the bushing until the case shoulder contacts the "chamber" shoulder inside the case bushing, at which point you can't cut any more off the neck.

Bullet94 · July 16, 2006, 05:42 PM

Sorry. Guess you can tell I don't have a Gracey trimmer.

arthurrh · July 17, 2006, 03:58 PM

I just got the trimmer and only have the .223 bushing, but mine does the same thing. I'm planning on calling them to see if they can assist.

Wrangler5 · July 17, 2006, 11:59 PM

I called them this morning and they were very apologetic, offered no excuses, and they said they'd put another bushing in the mail today. Swore they'd check it with some properly sized rounds first.

I wondered if it might have just been the wrong bushing, but was told that the 223 bushing is the only one with a hex head (as mine had) - which is why it didn't have a caliber marking on it like my 308 bushing does.

When set up and running properly, the trimmer is a real trooper. Push a case in until it stops and you've got a chamfered, deburred case mouth on a case of the proper length. There's no doubt when the case reaches the end of its travel - it stops solidly, but withdraws easily. I want that in the 223 size as well, and I'll be a happy camper. Hope the new bushing does the trick.

arthurrh · July 18, 2006, 01:30 PM

I talked to them this AM and got a very similar response.

Radar45 · July 19, 2006, 08:00 PM

I have a gracey for 223 and love it! I have had the same problem with some rounds and checked them in a dillon head space guage and they stuck out . VERY slight bulge below the shoulder. tried this took a file ran it around the case at the and it fit then CANNED the case. Just 1300 cases and about 50 were this way. Oh these were suppose to be once fired. in my dreams.

Wrangler5 · July 22, 2006, 05:58 PM

My problem is that all of the cases I reload fit perfectly in a Forster case gauge - drop in, fall out. But they WEDGE in the Gracey case holders. I got a replacement from Gracey a few days ago, and it does the same thing.

The "binding" problem seems to be about half way back on the case body, NOT at the neck/shoulder which I expected. If I really push the case into the holder and rotate it I get rings of scratches several places around the case body. Again these (full length sized) cases just drop in and out of a Forster gauge.

I've taken a Dremel and started to polish the inside of one of the Gracey case holders. It's getting real shiny, but still binds and scratches the middle of the body of a resized case. A virgin Winchester case drops into the Gracey holder and can be turned, although not completely freely, and comes out with some (lighter) scratches in the same place as a sized case. A once fired and resized (in new Lee dies) Winchester case locks up tight, as does the once fired military brass I was using at first. Again, all resized cases check out OK in a Forster gauge.

I'm guessing that the Lee dies aren't squeezing the case body down quite enough to fit in the Gracey holder. The cases seem to function fine in my AR-15 (~500 rounds through it with zero failures of any kind - although most of them were individually loaded, they slid easily and fully into the chamber with no pushing needed, just a snick of the finger.) But I guess they could be sized down even further with a small base die, which I may order one of next week, if I can't get the Gracey holder polished out enough to work smoothly with my Lee-sized cases.

444 · July 23, 2006, 11:15 AM

Please keep us informed as to what happens.

Why not see if you can borrow someone elses sizing die and see what happens.

**Unclenick** · July 23, 2006, 12:36 PM

Eeew! This doesn't sound good. My dad has a .308 Garand that does this. I discovered the cause of the problem is the "gunsmith" who built it didn't realize you have to use a floating reamer holder when reaming a chamber in a lathe. He was just chucking it in his tailstock's drill chuck, and that can be out several thousandths even if the tailstock offset has been correctly adjusted. The result is that the tip of the reamer, guided by the pilot, cuts correctly at the neck and shoulder, but as you come to the rear edges of the reamer, it is deflected to the side by the chuck error and cuts the rear portion of the chamber too wide. The result is that ejected cases are fireformed progressively fatter toward the case head.

You need to measure the case diameters, and not just the shoulder length. See the illustration below for a couple of data points for a new case. It sounds like the fireformed and resized case is wedging into the Gracey holder well-behind the shoulder. If these were sized after firing in someone else's chamber, then, especially in harder military brass, brass springback may be preventing them from sizing down diametrically. You will need to use a small-base die for at least one resizing cycle to correct it. If they are behaving like this coming our of your gun, have your chamber diameters checked.

Wrangler5 · July 23, 2006, 07:06 PM

Unclenick, thanks for the info. I don't have any fired, unsized cases (I got 'em all sized the other day, ready to reload) but my new Win cases measure 0.350 (Starrett caliper) at the shoulder, 0.372 above the base and 0.374 at the base. Smaller than the dimensions in your drawing. A once-fired and resized Win case (from the same bag of virgin brass) measures 0.353 at the shoulder, and 0.374 at both places near the base. So the fired case is not getting sized down to the original case size.

Both the new and fired/resized cases drag in the Gracey case holder, but the resized one is much tighter. A Lake City loaded round, which drops in and out of the Gracey holder "normally" seems to be about 0.001 smaller in the middle of the case body than the new Win case at the same point, and the new Win case is about 0.001 smaller than the resized case.

A small base RCBS sizing die isn't very expensive from Midway and can be here day after tomorrow. I use an RCBS small base die when reloading for my M1A, so this would be consistent with my prior practice with autoloaders. I gather that the small base die will put just a bit more squeeze on the case all the way down, and that should solve my trimmer problem.

OTOH, I have a friend with a lathe and good mechanical skills, and I may just ask him if we can chuck up the "extra" Gracey case holder and take off a quarter thousandth with a boring bar. As long as they work properly in my rifle, I'd rather not size my cases down any farther than necessary.

**Unclenick** · July 23, 2006, 07:52 PM

Sounds like Gracey is just making the holder a fraction undersize or needs to offer two holders; one for people using standard dies and one for those running small base dies. Ideally, for brass life and accuracy both, you want to be able to choose the dies that allow you to minimize how much you work the brass and still get reliable feeding.

Nick

Wrangler5 · July 25, 2006, 07:18 PM

The RCBS Small Base sizing die fixes things right up. New Win cases sized in this die drop into the Gracey case holder (which I'm holding in my hand) and bottom solidly on the shoulder, can be rotated easily when being pressed in toward the shoulder (as you do when using the trimmer,) and fall out with no marks of the cases.

So the immediate problem is solved. I haven't gotten with my machinist friend yet (he was on vacation until yesterday) but I think I'll still pursue the idea of opening up the "spare" case holder I have to work with cases sized in my "regular" die, just to minimize working the brass.

Thanks for all the suggestions. Arthurrh, this may be a solution for you if Gracey won't fix you up with a case holder that works with your cases and existing sizing die.

arthurrh · July 27, 2006, 05:28 PM

I got my new gracey holder and it works just fine now. They apparently had some holders get cut to the wrong size, so if it's still too tight, either have them check a new one, or better yet send them a piece of your brass and have them check before they send the replacement holder, they seem to be a very easy company to work with.

Wrangler5 · July 27, 2006, 11:00 PM

I had lunch with my machinst buddy yesterday - his brother was in town and joined us. His brother is big in the lapidary field, and his immediate solution to my "problem" case guide was something like "I'd just put some of my 1000 grit diamond paste on a case and spin it in and out of the case guide for a while with a power drill."

It sounded like a pretty workable plan. I dropped the case guide off with him this afternoon, and will wait to see what comes of it.

I do like the idea of getting a properly fitting case guide from Gracey, and probably will pursue that if the polishing trick doesn't do the job.

arthurrh · July 31, 2006, 02:49 PM

Wrangler, let me know how that works. Upon further inspection I found that my new bushing still is too tight. It was luck of the draw that it worked ok for the first couple of cases I tried.

I spent some time last night with a caliper and found that the measurement at the shoulder for a .223 should be .354 so I measured some of my cases. I found that most of mine were around .353 which should be ok. I measured some new rounds (winchester 45 gr white box) and found them to be around .350, a bit small IMO. Those new rounds fit beautifully into the bushing however.

I think the bushing it just too small, I'm going to call Gracey and see what we can do. Worst case I'll send a couple of my resized cases in and have them make me a bushing that works.

Wrangler5 · August 1, 2006, 04:07 PM

Well, my friend's brother (the rock hound) had my friend make up a polisher out of phenolic rod mounted on a (Dremel size) shank of drill rod, and they impregnated the surface with 600 grit (I think it was) diamond paste. They polished around on the inside of my "spare" case guide and got it nice and shiny, but it still grabs the sides of my Lee-sized cases. The RCBS small-base-sized cases drop right in, of course. As do all commercial rounds I've tried in both of my case guides. I have the polishing tool, but haven't used it yet to try to further expand the inside diameter of the case guide.

At the moment my solution is just to run the small base sizing die all the time. I'd rather use the Lee die because of its collet controlled decapper pin, which will slide before it breaks (the RCBS pin seems to be on the end of a locked, threaded rod) but I'll make do with the RCBS for the time being.

I had to trim about 100 cases last night, and just used the Lee trimmer and chamfer tools, with the Lee "chuck" spinning the case with an electric drill. Not as elegant as the Gracey, but no hassle either. I've also got an old Lyman power trimmer, which I never liked using for some reason but which did seem to work reliably, as I recall. I also recently bought my first Forster case tool (an outside neck turner for 223) and was VERY impressed with its quality and functionality. I see Forster makes a hand-cranked case trimmer, and I'm actually thinking of maybe just getting one of those and dumping the Gracey machine entirely. All just to avoid making another complaint call to Gracey - strange, but that's how I'm feeling at the moment.

arthurrh · August 2, 2006, 05:26 PM

I made the call to Gracey again yesterday. I told them about measurements etc. and they decided that rather than try to figure it all out, just asked me to send in some resized brass and they'll make me one that fits for sure. They're awfully easy to work with, I can't wait till I can get this .223 trimmer going, my brass pile is growing!

July 16, 2006, 12:35 PM	#1
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	Gracey Trimmer for 223 I've used a Gracey trimmer happily for years trimming Lake City 308 brass. Just got a 223 rifle, and bought the 223 case bushing from Gracey to do about 1,000 cases before starting an accuracy load hunt. I've adjusted the cutters, but have not yet done any serious trimming because there seems to be a problem with the case bushing. With the 308 setup, when you push a case into the case bushing it just slides in easily until the shoulder hits the end and then stops - case is solidly in place, cannot be pushed farther in, has no lateral wobble, but can be rotated and removed easily. With the 223, though, the case goes in until it hits some resistance, but then can be pushed in another 0.050 to 0.090 (against increasing resistance - feels like it's being wedged.) At this point it is solidly bottomed out, but cannot be rotated and sometimes needs pliers to extract it from the bushing. Cases are once fired Lake City brass, which have been full length resized with a new Lee die, then case lube removed. Had to shoulder length after sizing is correct according to my Forster case length gauge. The inside of the case bushing is clean and dry. The Gracey trimmer requires each case to be pushed in firmly (to the same point - shoulder contact on the inside of the case bushing) to assure case length trimming consistency. I just can't do that with these 223 cases, unless I push to the point I need pliers to extract the case (which slows down the process something awful ) Strangely, commercial rounds from Win and Rem drop into the case bushing like the 308 cases did - easy insertion, solid stop, and can be rotated but without lateral slop. This makes me think that the 223 resizing die is not shaping the LC brass the same as the commercial loads, yet both the resized cases and the commercial loads seem to fit (and measure) exactly the same in my Forster case length gauge. If the sized cases check out OK in the Forster gauge I don't think I can blame the Lee dies. I'll call Gracey next week to see if they have any ideas, but am wondering if any of you have had this experience, or perhaps a suggestion for a solution?

July 16, 2006, 01:34 PM	#2
Bullet94 Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2004 Location: Kansas Posts: 723	Sounds like maybe the case rims are bent. Might have been loaded hot. I’ve loaded some LC brass pretty hot and had the same trouble your having, but not in a Gracey. I had trouble getting them in a 223 case holder. Did they fit easily into your case holder when you sized them? __________________ PRO-SECOND AMENDMENT - Live Free or Die

July 16, 2006, 05:42 PM	#4
Bullet94 Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2004 Location: Kansas Posts: 723	Sorry. Guess you can tell I don't have a Gracey trimmer. __________________ PRO-SECOND AMENDMENT - Live Free or Die

July 23, 2006, 11:15 AM	#10
444 Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 3,968	Please keep us informed as to what happens. Why not see if you can borrow someone elses sizing die and see what happens. __________________ You know the rest. In the books you have read How the British Regulars fired and fled, How the farmers gave them ball for ball, From behind each fence and farmyard wall, Chasing the redcoats down the lane, Then crossing the fields to emerge again Under the trees at the turn of the road, And only pausing to fire and load.

July 23, 2006, 12:36 PM	#11
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	Eeew! This doesn't sound good. My dad has a .308 Garand that does this. I discovered the cause of the problem is the "gunsmith" who built it didn't realize you have to use a floating reamer holder when reaming a chamber in a lathe. He was just chucking it in his tailstock's drill chuck, and that can be out several thousandths even if the tailstock offset has been correctly adjusted. The result is that the tip of the reamer, guided by the pilot, cuts correctly at the neck and shoulder, but as you come to the rear edges of the reamer, it is deflected to the side by the chuck error and cuts the rear portion of the chamber too wide. The result is that ejected cases are fireformed progressively fatter toward the case head. You need to measure the case diameters, and not just the shoulder length. See the illustration below for a couple of data points for a new case. It sounds like the fireformed and resized case is wedging into the Gracey holder well-behind the shoulder. If these were sized after firing in someone else's chamber, then, especially in harder military brass, brass springback may be preventing them from sizing down diametrically. You will need to use a small-base die for at least one resizing cycle to correct it. If they are behaving like this coming our of your gun, have your chamber diameters checked. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

July 16, 2006, 03:17 PM	#3
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	Well, I don't think it's a rim issue. The Gracey case bushing only covers the top half of the case. You hold the rim and push the case into the case bushing, which you index to be the proper distance from the cutter assembly. You push the case into the bushing until the case shoulder contacts the "chamber" shoulder inside the case bushing, at which point you can't cut any more off the neck.

July 17, 2006, 03:58 PM	#5
arthurrh Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2004 Posts: 189	I just got the trimmer and only have the .223 bushing, but mine does the same thing. I'm planning on calling them to see if they can assist.

July 17, 2006, 11:59 PM	#6
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	I called them this morning and they were very apologetic, offered no excuses, and they said they'd put another bushing in the mail today. Swore they'd check it with some properly sized rounds first. I wondered if it might have just been the wrong bushing, but was told that the 223 bushing is the only one with a hex head (as mine had) - which is why it didn't have a caliber marking on it like my 308 bushing does. When set up and running properly, the trimmer is a real trooper. Push a case in until it stops and you've got a chamfered, deburred case mouth on a case of the proper length. There's no doubt when the case reaches the end of its travel - it stops solidly, but withdraws easily. I want that in the 223 size as well, and I'll be a happy camper. Hope the new bushing does the trick.

July 18, 2006, 01:30 PM	#7
arthurrh Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2004 Posts: 189	I talked to them this AM and got a very similar response.

July 19, 2006, 08:00 PM	#8
Radar45 Junior Member Join Date: October 17, 1999 Location: Council Bluffs Ia. Posts: 2	I have a gracey for 223 and love it! I have had the same problem with some rounds and checked them in a dillon head space guage and they stuck out . VERY slight bulge below the shoulder. tried this took a file ran it around the case at the and it fit then CANNED the case. Just 1300 cases and about 50 were this way. Oh these were suppose to be once fired. in my dreams.

July 22, 2006, 05:58 PM	#9
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	My problem is that all of the cases I reload fit perfectly in a Forster case gauge - drop in, fall out. But they WEDGE in the Gracey case holders. I got a replacement from Gracey a few days ago, and it does the same thing. The "binding" problem seems to be about half way back on the case body, NOT at the neck/shoulder which I expected. If I really push the case into the holder and rotate it I get rings of scratches several places around the case body. Again these (full length sized) cases just drop in and out of a Forster gauge. I've taken a Dremel and started to polish the inside of one of the Gracey case holders. It's getting real shiny, but still binds and scratches the middle of the body of a resized case. A virgin Winchester case drops into the Gracey holder and can be turned, although not completely freely, and comes out with some (lighter) scratches in the same place as a sized case. A once fired and resized (in new Lee dies) Winchester case locks up tight, as does the once fired military brass I was using at first. Again, all resized cases check out OK in a Forster gauge. I'm guessing that the Lee dies aren't squeezing the case body down quite enough to fit in the Gracey holder. The cases seem to function fine in my AR-15 (~500 rounds through it with zero failures of any kind - although most of them were individually loaded, they slid easily and fully into the chamber with no pushing needed, just a snick of the finger.) But I guess they could be sized down even further with a small base die, which I may order one of next week, if I can't get the Gracey holder polished out enough to work smoothly with my Lee-sized cases.

July 23, 2006, 07:06 PM	#12
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	Unclenick, thanks for the info. I don't have any fired, unsized cases (I got 'em all sized the other day, ready to reload) but my new Win cases measure 0.350 (Starrett caliper) at the shoulder, 0.372 above the base and 0.374 at the base. Smaller than the dimensions in your drawing. A once-fired and resized Win case (from the same bag of virgin brass) measures 0.353 at the shoulder, and 0.374 at both places near the base. So the fired case is not getting sized down to the original case size. Both the new and fired/resized cases drag in the Gracey case holder, but the resized one is much tighter. A Lake City loaded round, which drops in and out of the Gracey holder "normally" seems to be about 0.001 smaller in the middle of the case body than the new Win case at the same point, and the new Win case is about 0.001 smaller than the resized case. A small base RCBS sizing die isn't very expensive from Midway and can be here day after tomorrow. I use an RCBS small base die when reloading for my M1A, so this would be consistent with my prior practice with autoloaders. I gather that the small base die will put just a bit more squeeze on the case all the way down, and that should solve my trimmer problem. OTOH, I have a friend with a lathe and good mechanical skills, and I may just ask him if we can chuck up the "extra" Gracey case holder and take off a quarter thousandth with a boring bar. As long as they work properly in my rifle, I'd rather not size my cases down any farther than necessary.

July 23, 2006, 07:52 PM	#13
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	Sounds like Gracey is just making the holder a fraction undersize or needs to offer two holders; one for people using standard dies and one for those running small base dies. Ideally, for brass life and accuracy both, you want to be able to choose the dies that allow you to minimize how much you work the brass and still get reliable feeding. Nick __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

July 25, 2006, 07:18 PM	#14
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	The RCBS Small Base sizing die fixes things right up. New Win cases sized in this die drop into the Gracey case holder (which I'm holding in my hand) and bottom solidly on the shoulder, can be rotated easily when being pressed in toward the shoulder (as you do when using the trimmer,) and fall out with no marks of the cases. So the immediate problem is solved. I haven't gotten with my machinist friend yet (he was on vacation until yesterday) but I think I'll still pursue the idea of opening up the "spare" case holder I have to work with cases sized in my "regular" die, just to minimize working the brass. Thanks for all the suggestions. Arthurrh, this may be a solution for you if Gracey won't fix you up with a case holder that works with your cases and existing sizing die.

July 27, 2006, 05:28 PM	#15
arthurrh Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2004 Posts: 189	I got my new gracey holder and it works just fine now. They apparently had some holders get cut to the wrong size, so if it's still too tight, either have them check a new one, or better yet send them a piece of your brass and have them check before they send the replacement holder, they seem to be a very easy company to work with.

July 27, 2006, 11:00 PM	#16
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	I had lunch with my machinst buddy yesterday - his brother was in town and joined us. His brother is big in the lapidary field, and his immediate solution to my "problem" case guide was something like "I'd just put some of my 1000 grit diamond paste on a case and spin it in and out of the case guide for a while with a power drill." It sounded like a pretty workable plan. I dropped the case guide off with him this afternoon, and will wait to see what comes of it. I do like the idea of getting a properly fitting case guide from Gracey, and probably will pursue that if the polishing trick doesn't do the job.

July 31, 2006, 02:49 PM	#17
arthurrh Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2004 Posts: 189	Wrangler, let me know how that works. Upon further inspection I found that my new bushing still is too tight. It was luck of the draw that it worked ok for the first couple of cases I tried. I spent some time last night with a caliper and found that the measurement at the shoulder for a .223 should be .354 so I measured some of my cases. I found that most of mine were around .353 which should be ok. I measured some new rounds (winchester 45 gr white box) and found them to be around .350, a bit small IMO. Those new rounds fit beautifully into the bushing however. I think the bushing it just too small, I'm going to call Gracey and see what we can do. Worst case I'll send a couple of my resized cases in and have them make me a bushing that works.

August 1, 2006, 04:07 PM	#18
Wrangler5 Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 326	Well, my friend's brother (the rock hound) had my friend make up a polisher out of phenolic rod mounted on a (Dremel size) shank of drill rod, and they impregnated the surface with 600 grit (I think it was) diamond paste. They polished around on the inside of my "spare" case guide and got it nice and shiny, but it still grabs the sides of my Lee-sized cases. The RCBS small-base-sized cases drop right in, of course. As do all commercial rounds I've tried in both of my case guides. I have the polishing tool, but haven't used it yet to try to further expand the inside diameter of the case guide. At the moment my solution is just to run the small base sizing die all the time. I'd rather use the Lee die because of its collet controlled decapper pin, which will slide before it breaks (the RCBS pin seems to be on the end of a locked, threaded rod) but I'll make do with the RCBS for the time being. I had to trim about 100 cases last night, and just used the Lee trimmer and chamfer tools, with the Lee "chuck" spinning the case with an electric drill. Not as elegant as the Gracey, but no hassle either. I've also got an old Lyman power trimmer, which I never liked using for some reason but which did seem to work reliably, as I recall. I also recently bought my first Forster case tool (an outside neck turner for 223) and was VERY impressed with its quality and functionality. I see Forster makes a hand-cranked case trimmer, and I'm actually thinking of maybe just getting one of those and dumping the Gracey machine entirely. All just to avoid making another complaint call to Gracey - strange, but that's how I'm feeling at the moment.

August 2, 2006, 05:26 PM	#19
arthurrh Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2004 Posts: 189	I made the call to Gracey again yesterday. I told them about measurements etc. and they decided that rather than try to figure it all out, just asked me to send in some resized brass and they'll make me one that fits for sure. They're awfully easy to work with, I can't wait till I can get this .223 trimmer going, my brass pile is growing!