1911 45 auto - Page 4

bac1023 · August 14, 2023, 09:01 AM

I guess I’m not understanding the whole TISAS craze. I get buying one as a low cost option if you don’t mind Turkish guns. However, I see people on the forums with a whole collection of these and other entry level 1911’s (as in a dozen or more) instead of buying a couple high end models.

Of course, I never understood the concept of quantity over quality either. Maybe someone can enlighten me.

RickB · August 14, 2023, 09:54 AM

Tisas is the current best-bang-for-the-buck 1911, following in the footsteps of Norinco and Sistema.

A lot of 1911 fans are forged steel snobs, Tisas pistols have forged slides and frames, so they're more attractive than, say, RIA, or Auto Ordnance, which have cast frames.

Tisas has an extremely broad selection, so there's something for everyone, whether you want a military clone, or a competition pistol with all mod cons.
I find the most basic, least expensive models most appealing, as the good bones can be a basis for whatever you want.

I don't own one, and I'm not really in the market for a new 1911, but might have to buy one, anyway.

ballardw · August 14, 2023, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bac1023

Of course, I never understood the concept of quantity over quality either. Maybe someone can enlighten me.

Quantity means you have some to share with friends when the zombie horde attacks...

jar · August 14, 2023, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bac1023

I guess I’m not understanding the whole TISAS craze. I get buying one as a low cost option if you don’t mind Turkish guns. However, I see people on the forums with a whole collection of these and other entry level 1911’s (as in a dozen or more) instead of buying a couple high end models.

Of course, I never understood the concept of quantity over quality either. Maybe someone can enlighten me.

My 1911 journey was a Colt 80 series in the mid 80s that was never reliable even after three trips back to the Mothership and so sent off to a Forever Home for Miscreant Children; a Dan Wesson semi-custom Pointman/Patriot about a decade later that was again totally unreliable and while beautiful it was horrid so it too got sent to a Forever Home for Miscreant Children; and the four Tisas 1911s that have simply worked, worked with any magazines from any makers except a couple Wilson Combat 920 (and even those worked once I changed the follower to a standard CheckMate) with any ammo and without have to adjust anything or add anything (again with the exception of adding a Tisas Duty slide I found on sale to compensate for my Operation Torch Era Mk 1 eyes).

For me, quality is having something that works as it should and meets all of my needs without me having to change what I do or adjust or repair or enhance the object to get it to meet my needs.

44caliberkid · August 14, 2023, 05:26 PM

My first 1911 was the GI one I was issued as an MP in the US Army. While in service I bought a Colt Government Model in 38 Super. It ran 130 grain ball just fine but choked on anything with a truncated nose or hollow point. It is a trait of any 38 Super 1911 I’ve had, but remedied by a ramped barrel. In the 80’s, when the first Norincos hit our shores I bought one, 45 ACP,for $350 and was quite pleased with it. So much in fact I sent it to my 1911 ‘smith to have a set of Wichita sights installed and a wider, 3 hole trigger with over travel adjustment. He told me machining the dove tails in the slide was a bugger, steel harder than Colt’s. I used it for bullseye competition for 10 years with the stock barrel and bushing. People gave me crap about my Chinese gun, but most of them scored lower than me. A friend of mine that I was coaching in target shooting had a custom ordered bullseye gun from Springfield, about $1000 in 1991, and my Norinco shot better, for me anyway.
Somewhere along the line in picked up a Colt Gold Cup. More recently I obtained two Iver Johnson’s, a bright chrome 38 Super and an Eagle XL in 10mm. Newest acquisition is a Springfield Garrison because Springfield just discounted them about $200 because they weren’t moving. Other than a better polish job on the sides of the slide and real blued steel (no spray on finish) it is very comparable to the Phillipino pistols. Haven’t tried a Tisas yet, but have looked at a bunch of them in a gun shop that has and sells them in droves. The Tank Commander model interests me but it is higher priced, for another 100 bucks I could get a similar Kimber.

rodfac · August 14, 2023, 08:41 PM

Rugers are a good choice if the current crop are akin to my 6 yr old SR1911 and CMD. Both are 2" at 25 yd guns from a rest with well made target level handloads. Both have been utterly reliable with a combined total of 5000+ rounds. Both sport parts that are 100% interchangeable with Colt Series 70 1911.

For features: with Novak sights, checkered front and MSH, sensible sized slide stop and safety controls and SS construction, IMHO, they're a fine choice for 1911 suitable chores. In that regard, I do find both a bit to heavy for daily, all-day carry...but for range use and short hops, they're just fine.

Lastly, you seldom see them in used gun displays in my neck of the woods....a good measure of satisfaction in that knowledgeable shooters that buy them, hold on to them.

My 50+ years of experience with the 1911 has been with half a dozen Colts, two WWll Remington-Rands, a couple of Sigs and the aforementioned Rugers. Were I forced to settle on one, it'd be the Ruger CMD in .45 ACP. They're the best I've shot for the money....

Best Regards, Rod

S.pannell · August 28, 2023, 09:50 AM

I have gone almost completely over to RIA pistols. More bang for the buck and accuracy is equal to and better than most 1911's that cost well over $1000. The Rock Ultras are the way to go. All that's needed to tune them up is a sear spring change for $6. I use Wilson springs. Sometimes I go a little farther and use flat wound recoil springs. Shock buffs are not needed and do nothing for me. I also shoot 100% handloaded ammo using Starline brass. I also use the Lee factory crimp die. This die will eliminate all your feed issues if you have any.

darkgael · August 29, 2023, 09:47 AM

I have two 1911s. One is a Springfield Armory “loaded” that I purchased used. The other is a Colt Gold Cup. They get shot a lot. Both have been trouble free. The Gold Cup has, conservatively, 100K rounds through it. Enough said.

Kevin Rohrer · August 30, 2023, 08:04 PM

Go over to 1911Addicts and see what is available. There is a lot of bad advice being peddled here. You deserve better than foreign-made junk.

**Aguila Blanca** · August 30, 2023, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Rohrer

There is a lot of bad advice being peddled here. You deserve better than foreign-made junk.

Please identify -- specifically -- the bad advice given here, and please identify -- specifically -- which 1911s currently available are foreign-made junk.

Jim Watson · August 31, 2023, 10:07 AM

I don't know if it makes it "junk" but a lot of the foreign made copies seem to get a lot of DIY gunsmithing: "My Slobovvian Service Special shoots just great now that I have replaced the hammer and trigger and barrel and springs with genuine 'Murrican titanthium parts."

I am sure there are people out there shooting stock guns, but you wouldn't know it from the internet gun boards.

**Aguila Blanca** · August 31, 2023, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Watson

I don't know if it makes it "junk" but a lot of the foreign made copies seem to get a lot of DIY gunsmithing: "My Slobovvian Service Special shoots just great now that I have replaced the hammer and trigger and barrel and springs with genuine 'Murrican titanthium parts."

Conversely, curiously enough most of the foreign-made 1911s seem to work out of the box, but they may not deliver master-class bullseye accuracy. On 1911-specific sites, the forums are full of threads started by people who bought a $500 foreign 1911, threw in another $500 or more of "billet steel," "tactical grade" parts from several different name brand parts mongers ... and then they come to the forums complaining because their "foreign-made" gun is junk because it doesn't work.

It's like the old saying in the Jeep world: "If it ain't broke -- fix it 'til it is."

Jim Watson · August 31, 2023, 01:51 PM

And we have major big brand names that have to deliver "good customer service" after they deliver a gun that doesn't work, too.

**44 AMP** · August 31, 2023, 03:29 PM

I'd say the major difference between foreign made junk and US made junk is the cost, and import markings,,,,

bac1023 · September 1, 2023, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Go over to 1911Addicts and see what is available. There is a lot of bad advice being peddled here. You deserve better than foreign-made junk.

While I’m not a fan of foreign 1911’s, some of the finest pistols in the world are built overseas. I own many.

**Aguila Blanca** · September 1, 2023, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

I'd say the major difference between foreign made junk and US made junk is the cost, and import markings,,,

Junk is junk, regardless of the point of origin.

On the other hand, the difference between an excellent, fully functional foreign-made 1911 and an equally excellent, fully functional (but no better) U.S.-made 1911 can be anywhere from $500 to $2,500.

bac1023 · September 2, 2023, 12:26 PM

Quote:

On the other hand, the difference between an excellent, fully function foreign-made 1911 and an equally excellent, fully functional (but no better) U.S.-made 1911 can be anywhere from $500 to $2,500

.

…and exactly which foreign 1911 is just as excellent as a US built model costing $2500 more?

That Turkish crap is $500+ or -, so that would make them just as excellent as an American built $3000 semi custom?

jar · September 2, 2023, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bac1023

.

…and exactly which foreign 1911 is just as excellent as a US built model costing $2500 more?

That Turkish crap is $500+ or -, so that would make them just as excellent as an American built $3000 semi custom?

What features of a Tisas Duty 1911 would you consider crap?

The forged and hardened before machining frame and slide?

The forged and chromed barrel?

The lack of MIM parts?

The fit and finish?

The fact that the four I've purchased all worked while the Colt series 80 and Dan Wesson Pointman/Patriot did not?

Hawg · September 3, 2023, 08:43 AM

My 1911 of choice is a RIA but if I wanted to get as close to a government model as I could get it would be a Tisas Army.

Ricklin · September 3, 2023, 05:19 PM

Fully agree, it is all about the Benjamins. US labor cost make that so.

bac1023 · September 3, 2023, 09:59 PM

Quote:

What features of a Tisas Duty 1911 would you consider crap?

The forged and hardened before machining frame and slide?

The forged and chromed barrel?

The lack of MIM parts?

The fit and finish?

The fact that the four I've purchased all worked while the Colt series 80 and Dan Wesson Pointman/Patriot did not?

If you like them that’s what matters. I only buy high end pistols, so I’m not one to ask. Not a fan of the Turkish pistols I’ve handled. All they do is produce clones with darn near slave labor. I’ll pass.

**Aguila Blanca** · September 4, 2023, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bac1023

Not a fan of the Turkish pistols I’ve handled. All they do is produce clones with darn near slave labor.

Actually, just like Armscor/RIA and the other Philippine gun makers, they don't use near slave labor, they use CNC machining, just like the American makers. The Tisas guns generally go Bang when you pull the trigger. If you want to buy an American-made pistol for patriotic or political reasons, I'm all for that. But please don't allow your politics to lead you to making unsubstantiated comments about the quality of the firearms. That's a separate issue.

Not everyone can afford to buy high-end firearms.

saleen322 · September 4, 2023, 12:42 AM

You first have to decide what features you want on your 1911. Features I have to have on a 1911 includes quality adjustable sights and good out of the box accuracy as I still shoot some formal matches. Gun prices follows the pattern of quality 22 LR ammo, the more expensive shoots better but you will hit a point of diminishing returns. You have to decide where that point is for you. A Springfield Range Officer (RO) is a good deal at around $850 for what you get for your money. I have a RO in 9mm that I got a 38 Super barrel for, a fitted bushing, and some magazines. It shoots 38 Super very well and is definitely a keeper. Never owned a RIA 1911 but shot them some and I thought it was a good pistol. Good luck with what you decide.

Jim Watson · September 4, 2023, 12:52 AM

There were some deluxe gunsmithing projects on Chinese copies.
I’ve seen a lot of minor fixups on Filipino and Turkish imports but nothing fancy.
Have I missed them or is it just not a 21st century fad?

Jim567 · September 4, 2023, 04:19 AM

Tisas Tank Commander and 1911A1 US Army, both .45 cal.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/03eH...4QsfHdzinX4iig

https://share.icloud.com/photos/0e7e...d9wBHzOwhBe4CA

https://share.icloud.com/photos/0e1a...YOlV6_k2EdQORg

Sorry having problems with pictures.

1” at 7 yards 6 rounds

1.75” at 15 yards 6 rounds

68 year old eyes. The US Army did slightly better at 15 yards but I didn’t have a picture of that target.

[Admin edit: URL tgs repaired. AB]

August 14, 2023, 09:54 AM	#77
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,541	Tisas is the current best-bang-for-the-buck 1911, following in the footsteps of Norinco and Sistema. A lot of 1911 fans are forged steel snobs, Tisas pistols have forged slides and frames, so they're more attractive than, say, RIA, or Auto Ordnance, which have cast frames. Tisas has an extremely broad selection, so there's something for everyone, whether you want a military clone, or a competition pistol with all mod cons. I find the most basic, least expensive models most appealing, as the good bones can be a basis for whatever you want. I don't own one, and I'm not really in the market for a new 1911, but might have to buy one, anyway. __________________ Runs off at the mouth about anything 1911 related on this site and half the time is flat out wrong.

August 14, 2023, 08:41 PM	#81
rodfac Senior Member Join Date: January 22, 2005 Location: Kentucky Posts: 3,657	Rugers are a good choice if the current crop are akin to my 6 yr old SR1911 and CMD. Both are 2" at 25 yd guns from a rest with well made target level handloads. Both have been utterly reliable with a combined total of 5000+ rounds. Both sport parts that are 100% interchangeable with Colt Series 70 1911. For features: with Novak sights, checkered front and MSH, sensible sized slide stop and safety controls and SS construction, IMHO, they're a fine choice for 1911 suitable chores. In that regard, I do find both a bit to heavy for daily, all-day carry...but for range use and short hops, they're just fine. Lastly, you seldom see them in used gun displays in my neck of the woods....a good measure of satisfaction in that knowledgeable shooters that buy them, hold on to them. My 50+ years of experience with the 1911 has been with half a dozen Colts, two WWll Remington-Rands, a couple of Sigs and the aforementioned Rugers. Were I forced to settle on one, it'd be the Ruger CMD in .45 ACP. They're the best I've shot for the money.... Best Regards, Rod __________________ Cherish our flag, honor it, defend it in word and deed, or get the hell out. Our Bill of Rights has been paid for by heros in uniform and shall not be diluted by misguided governmental social experiments. We owe this to our children, anything less is cowardice. USAF FAC, 5th Spl Forces, Vietnam Vet '69-'73.

August 29, 2023, 09:47 AM	#83
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	I have two 1911s. One is a Springfield Armory “loaded” that I purchased used. The other is a Colt Gold Cup. They get shot a lot. Both have been trouble free. The Gold Cup has, conservatively, 100K rounds through it. Enough said. __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member

August 30, 2023, 08:04 PM	#84
Kevin Rohrer Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2010 Location: Medina, Ohio Posts: 1,050	Go over to 1911Addicts and see what is available. There is a lot of bad advice being peddled here. You deserve better than foreign-made junk. __________________ Member: Orange Gunsite Family, NRA--Life, ARTCA, and American Legion. Caveat Emptor: Cavery Grips/AmericanGripz/Prestige Grips/Stealth Grips from Clayton, NC. He is a scammer

August 31, 2023, 03:29 PM	#89
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 30,189	I'd say the major difference between foreign made junk and US made junk is the cost, and import markings,,,, __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

August 14, 2023, 09:01 AM	#76
bac1023 Senior Member Join Date: February 2, 2008 Posts: 1,196	I guess I’m not understanding the whole TISAS craze. I get buying one as a low cost option if you don’t mind Turkish guns. However, I see people on the forums with a whole collection of these and other entry level 1911’s (as in a dozen or more) instead of buying a couple high end models. Of course, I never understood the concept of quantity over quality either. Maybe someone can enlighten me.

August 14, 2023, 05:26 PM	#80
44caliberkid Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2017 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,251	My first 1911 was the GI one I was issued as an MP in the US Army. While in service I bought a Colt Government Model in 38 Super. It ran 130 grain ball just fine but choked on anything with a truncated nose or hollow point. It is a trait of any 38 Super 1911 I’ve had, but remedied by a ramped barrel. In the 80’s, when the first Norincos hit our shores I bought one, 45 ACP,for $350 and was quite pleased with it. So much in fact I sent it to my 1911 ‘smith to have a set of Wichita sights installed and a wider, 3 hole trigger with over travel adjustment. He told me machining the dove tails in the slide was a bugger, steel harder than Colt’s. I used it for bullseye competition for 10 years with the stock barrel and bushing. People gave me crap about my Chinese gun, but most of them scored lower than me. A friend of mine that I was coaching in target shooting had a custom ordered bullseye gun from Springfield, about $1000 in 1991, and my Norinco shot better, for me anyway. Somewhere along the line in picked up a Colt Gold Cup. More recently I obtained two Iver Johnson’s, a bright chrome 38 Super and an Eagle XL in 10mm. Newest acquisition is a Springfield Garrison because Springfield just discounted them about $200 because they weren’t moving. Other than a better polish job on the sides of the slide and real blued steel (no spray on finish) it is very comparable to the Phillipino pistols. Haven’t tried a Tisas yet, but have looked at a bunch of them in a gun shop that has and sells them in droves. The Tank Commander model interests me but it is higher priced, for another 100 bucks I could get a similar Kimber.

August 28, 2023, 09:50 AM	#82
S.pannell Junior Member Join Date: December 26, 2022 Posts: 4	I have gone almost completely over to RIA pistols. More bang for the buck and accuracy is equal to and better than most 1911's that cost well over $1000. The Rock Ultras are the way to go. All that's needed to tune them up is a sear spring change for $6. I use Wilson springs. Sometimes I go a little farther and use flat wound recoil springs. Shock buffs are not needed and do nothing for me. I also shoot 100% handloaded ammo using Starline brass. I also use the Lee factory crimp die. This die will eliminate all your feed issues if you have any.

August 31, 2023, 10:07 AM	#86
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 19,045	I don't know if it makes it "junk" but a lot of the foreign made copies seem to get a lot of DIY gunsmithing: "My Slobovvian Service Special shoots just great now that I have replaced the hammer and trigger and barrel and springs with genuine 'Murrican titanthium parts." I am sure there are people out there shooting stock guns, but you wouldn't know it from the internet gun boards.

August 31, 2023, 01:51 PM	#88
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 19,045	And we have major big brand names that have to deliver "good customer service" after they deliver a gun that doesn't work, too.

September 3, 2023, 08:43 AM	#94
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,339	My 1911 of choice is a RIA but if I wanted to get as close to a government model as I could get it would be a Tisas Army.

September 3, 2023, 05:19 PM	#95
Ricklin Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2008 Location: SW Washington state Posts: 2,279	Fully agree, it is all about the Benjamins. US labor cost make that so. __________________ ricklin Freedom is not free

September 4, 2023, 12:42 AM	#98
saleen322 Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2010 Posts: 779	You first have to decide what features you want on your 1911. Features I have to have on a 1911 includes quality adjustable sights and good out of the box accuracy as I still shoot some formal matches. Gun prices follows the pattern of quality 22 LR ammo, the more expensive shoots better but you will hit a point of diminishing returns. You have to decide where that point is for you. A Springfield Range Officer (RO) is a good deal at around $850 for what you get for your money. I have a RO in 9mm that I got a 38 Super barrel for, a fitted bushing, and some magazines. It shoots 38 Super very well and is definitely a keeper. Never owned a RIA 1911 but shot them some and I thought it was a good pistol. Good luck with what you decide.

September 4, 2023, 12:52 AM	#99
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 19,045	There were some deluxe gunsmithing projects on Chinese copies. I’ve seen a lot of minor fixups on Filipino and Turkish imports but nothing fancy. Have I missed them or is it just not a 21st century fad?

September 4, 2023, 04:19 AM	#100
Jim567 Senior Member Join Date: January 4, 2014 Location: NE FL Posts: 661	Tisas Tank Commander and 1911A1 US Army, both .45 cal. https://share.icloud.com/photos/03eH...4QsfHdzinX4iig https://share.icloud.com/photos/0e7e...d9wBHzOwhBe4CA https://share.icloud.com/photos/0e1a...YOlV6_k2EdQORg Sorry having problems with pictures. 1” at 7 yards 6 rounds 1.75” at 15 yards 6 rounds 68 year old eyes. The US Army did slightly better at 15 yards but I didn’t have a picture of that target. [Admin edit: URL tgs repaired. AB] Last edited by Jim567; September 4, 2023 at 04:49 AM.

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