largest game that can be humanely taken with a 9mm carbine?

Freetacos · September 28, 2006, 03:00 PM

Is a deer about a large as you should go with a full house 9mm load?

mikejonestkd · September 28, 2006, 03:10 PM

I wouldn't even consider a 9mm as a potential deer round. there are 100's of better choices out there.

The .357 is marginal for deer and the 9mm is less powerful than the .357. You are looking at wounding a deer and having it die a slow death....

arizona hunter · September 28, 2006, 03:19 PM

Do you have anything larger???? If that is the only rifle you have you better limit your shots to bow range (like 30 yards) and the deer had better be on the small side.

Better yet, barrow something with suitable like a 30-30, .243, .270, .3006 etc.

rlong5 · September 28, 2006, 03:22 PM

Groundhogs.

Scorch · September 28, 2006, 03:42 PM

I am not sure I would choose a 9mm for any game animal. It has just barely enough muzzle energy to pierce hide and penetrate to vitals. I suppose you could take a smallish deer, but that would have to be at point blank range.

And that does not even deal with the legality of using that cartridge for game animals. Or the ethical considerations.

Freetacos · September 28, 2006, 03:47 PM

I also have a 7.62x39 autoloader. I am not really much of a hunter, but I am curious about the limitations of these rounds in the hunting sphere.

FirstFreedom · September 28, 2006, 04:17 PM

coyote/beaver

Freetacos · September 28, 2006, 04:56 PM

coyote, bingo

Clayfish · September 28, 2006, 05:44 PM

coyote within 20 yards.

Bigfatts · September 28, 2006, 06:27 PM

Out of your choices? Use the 7.62, keep it close, use the best hunting ammo you can find, if you hand load even better, get lots of practice. I live in Florida where the deer aren't exactly monsters. Quite a few people in my circle of aquaintances use 7.62x39 for Whitetail (again, smallish Whitetail).

If you're looking to take larger game, go spend $90 or so and get an excellent condition Mosin Nagant M38. Good hunting ammo with plenty of oomph, good enough accuracy for hunting at reasonable distances, cheap, a blast to shoot. These are very popular in the area near here for pig/brush guns.

dave0520 · September 28, 2006, 06:40 PM

If you use the 7.62x39, I'd say deer up to about 150 yards is reasonable if you can shoot that well. I wouldn't even consider the 9mm.

Fat White Boy · September 28, 2006, 11:32 PM

Usama bin Laden...

Benonymous · September 28, 2006, 11:33 PM

A canary.

rlong5 · September 28, 2006, 11:55 PM

cockroaches?

oldbillthundercheif · September 29, 2006, 01:10 AM

Spur0701 · October 2, 2006, 11:48 AM

I've taken a 200 lb russian boar with a 9mm carbine (147 grain Federal Hydrashok) with no problems.

john in jax · October 2, 2006, 02:34 PM

I've got a 9mm Ruger Police Carbine that shoots real well and:
a) on a calm day
b) deer standing still
c) +/- 40 yards
I think I could confidently make a head shot and drop a deer, but there are to many factors/variables that could prevent you from being able to get such a perfect shot.

Shooting +P+ hollow points at varmits such as coyote, raccons, armadillos, etc... at 50 yards or less should take them humanely.

And I agree with everyone above, the 7.62x39 is a much more powerful round and will outperform the 9mm as a hunting cartridge in every way. There are numerous hollow point and soft point hunting round choices available in 7.62x39.

FirstFreedom · October 2, 2006, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Usama bin Laden...

I can dig it. Prefer to see him hit with a .50 bmg or a 2,000 lb bomb, but a 9mm is better than nothing, and should do the job.

billykaldrich · October 7, 2006, 07:25 AM

squirls,rabbits

rem33 · October 7, 2006, 06:41 PM

9MM is not a hunting round and should not be used as one.
How bout ground squirrels you have them in Southern calif.

taylorce1 · October 8, 2006, 09:14 PM

Check your State hunting regulations to find out if your 9mm carbine is legal or not. I'll bet that if your State has any kind of foot pound requirements for rifles your 9mm will fall short. My State requires 1000 ftlb of energy at 100 yards for rifles as a minimum, and I'm sure that a 9mm carbine is well under that requirment. I think you could have some fun using it on small game at close ranges but I wouldn't use it on deer.

springmom · October 8, 2006, 10:11 PM

You will have to check your state hunting regulations. Ethically, I'd say "possum, rabbit, skunk" but NO WAY would I shoot a deer with one.

Springmom

mikejonestkd · October 9, 2006, 07:54 AM

I find it interesting that no one considers the 9mm out of a carbine/ rifle a viable deer hunting round but have no problem using the same round out of a pistol for self defense against roughly the same sized critters....humans..

I'm not trying to start a caliber war but I also find it odd the when you mention the .223 at the tactical side of the range and they they think it's da bomb as a round.....when you mention it to a hunter they think of prairie poodles and wood chucks - 5 to 20 pound animals.....

springmom · October 9, 2006, 08:54 AM

The scenarios (please excuse that word, couldn't think of a better, I haven't had my coffee yet) are different.

If I shoot a deer, he is trying not to be seen, and if he sees me, he's going to run. I have to shoot by utter stealth, and the ONE shot I make had better be fatal or else I run the risk of leaving a wounded deer to die of infection somewhere in the bush;

If I shoot a human, it is because he is trying to kill me. One shot needs to do the deed, all right; but if I need two or three, I'm not going to take those second or third shots while he's bounding away at 20 mph, like a deer would be.

So you're comparing apples and oranges. A better comparison would be using the 9 for a sniper rifle and using the 9 for hunting. I may be all wet, but I don't think ANY SWAT or sniper type folks use 9mms in their sniper rifles. If they are "hunting" a BG, they put something else in those rifles...something more like what we'd use for....DEER!

HTH.

(I like the 9mm for range shooting. I don't personally think it's "too little gun" for SD. I carry a .38spl a lot, and that IS essentially a 9, albeit with a VERY long case

But I want that deer down and dead ASAP for the sake of the animal, so I want to use a rifle cartridge, with higher energy and more damage done, than my 9. )

Springmom

mikejonestkd · October 9, 2006, 09:33 AM

Springmom,

I agreed with most of your assessment and opinion on the differences, IMO I would still be over gunned in a SD situation ( as long as I can handle and shoot it well ) and use just enough gun for hunting.

I do find it funny that a few friends tell me all about the magical properties of their round of choice ( say the 9mm or the .223 ) and the oldtimers and hunters look at them as woefully inadequate for most hunting situations.

September 28, 2006, 03:00 PM	#1
Freetacos Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2006 Location: California Posts: 441	largest game that can be humanely taken with a 9mm carbine? Is a deer about a large as you should go with a full house 9mm load?

September 28, 2006, 03:10 PM	#2
mikejonestkd Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2006 Location: Brockport, NY Posts: 3,716	No I wouldn't even consider a 9mm as a potential deer round. there are 100's of better choices out there. The .357 is marginal for deer and the 9mm is less powerful than the .357. You are looking at wounding a deer and having it die a slow death....

September 28, 2006, 03:42 PM	#5
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	I am not sure I would choose a 9mm for any game animal. It has just barely enough muzzle energy to pierce hide and penetrate to vitals. I suppose you could take a smallish deer, but that would have to be at point blank range. And that does not even deal with the legality of using that cartridge for game animals. Or the ethical considerations. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

September 28, 2006, 06:40 PM	#11
dave0520 Senior Member Join Date: September 25, 2005 Location: Philadelphia suburbs Posts: 394	If you use the 7.62x39, I'd say deer up to about 150 yards is reasonable if you can shoot that well. I wouldn't even consider the 9mm. __________________ si vis pacem, parabellum

October 2, 2006, 02:34 PM	#17
john in jax Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2005 Posts: 1,177	shot placement I've got a 9mm Ruger Police Carbine that shoots real well and: a) on a calm day b) deer standing still c) +/- 40 yards I think I could confidently make a head shot and drop a deer, but there are to many factors/variables that could prevent you from being able to get such a perfect shot. Shooting +P+ hollow points at varmits such as coyote, raccons, armadillos, etc... at 50 yards or less should take them humanely. And I agree with everyone above, the 7.62x39 is a much more powerful round and will outperform the 9mm as a hunting cartridge in every way. There are numerous hollow point and soft point hunting round choices available in 7.62x39. __________________ America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards. Claire Wolfe

September 28, 2006, 03:19 PM	#3
arizona hunter Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2005 Location: phoenix, AZ Posts: 212	Do you have anything larger???? If that is the only rifle you have you better limit your shots to bow range (like 30 yards) and the deer had better be on the small side. Better yet, barrow something with suitable like a 30-30, .243, .270, .3006 etc.

September 28, 2006, 03:22 PM	#4
rlong5 Member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Location: Colorado Springs Posts: 93	Groundhogs.

September 28, 2006, 03:47 PM	#6
Freetacos Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2006 Location: California Posts: 441	I also have a 7.62x39 autoloader. I am not really much of a hunter, but I am curious about the limitations of these rounds in the hunting sphere.

September 28, 2006, 04:17 PM	#7
FirstFreedom Junior member Join Date: May 31, 2004 Location: The Toll Road State, U.S.A. Posts: 12,451	coyote/beaver

September 28, 2006, 04:56 PM	#8
Freetacos Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2006 Location: California Posts: 441	coyote, bingo

September 28, 2006, 05:44 PM	#9
Clayfish Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2005 Location: Valdosta, GA Posts: 953	coyote within 20 yards.

September 28, 2006, 06:27 PM	#10
Bigfatts Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2005 Location: Lutz Posts: 1,528	Out of your choices? Use the 7.62, keep it close, use the best hunting ammo you can find, if you hand load even better, get lots of practice. I live in Florida where the deer aren't exactly monsters. Quite a few people in my circle of aquaintances use 7.62x39 for Whitetail (again, smallish Whitetail). If you're looking to take larger game, go spend $90 or so and get an excellent condition Mosin Nagant M38. Good hunting ammo with plenty of oomph, good enough accuracy for hunting at reasonable distances, cheap, a blast to shoot. These are very popular in the area near here for pig/brush guns.

September 28, 2006, 11:32 PM	#12
Fat White Boy Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2005 Posts: 1,276	Usama bin Laden...

September 28, 2006, 11:33 PM	#13
Benonymous Senior Member Join Date: January 6, 2005 Location: NSW Australia Posts: 254	A canary.

September 28, 2006, 11:55 PM	#14
rlong5 Member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Location: Colorado Springs Posts: 93	cockroaches?

September 29, 2006, 01:10 AM	#15
oldbillthundercheif Junior member Join Date: April 21, 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 2,450

October 2, 2006, 11:48 AM	#16
Spur0701 Senior Member Join Date: February 2, 2005 Posts: 208	I've taken a 200 lb russian boar with a 9mm carbine (147 grain Federal Hydrashok) with no problems.

October 7, 2006, 07:25 AM	#19
billykaldrich Member Join Date: September 9, 2004 Location: Kalifornia Posts: 48	squirls,rabbits

October 7, 2006, 06:41 PM	#20
rem33 Junior member Join Date: March 31, 2006 Posts: 1,528	9MM is not a hunting round and should not be used as one. How bout ground squirrels you have them in Southern calif.

October 8, 2006, 09:14 PM	#21
taylorce1 Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2005 Location: On the Santa Fe Trail Posts: 8,248	Check your State hunting regulations to find out if your 9mm carbine is legal or not. I'll bet that if your State has any kind of foot pound requirements for rifles your 9mm will fall short. My State requires 1000 ftlb of energy at 100 yards for rifles as a minimum, and I'm sure that a 9mm carbine is well under that requirment. I think you could have some fun using it on small game at close ranges but I wouldn't use it on deer.

October 8, 2006, 10:11 PM	#22
springmom Senior Member Join Date: October 26, 2005 Location: Houston area Posts: 1,823	You will have to check your state hunting regulations. Ethically, I'd say "possum, rabbit, skunk" but NO WAY would I shoot a deer with one. Springmom __________________ I will not be a victim home on the web: www.panagia-icons.net (my webpage) www.nousfromspring.blogspot.com (Orthodoxy) "I couldn't hear you. Stop firing the gun while you're talking!" Frank Drebin, The Naked Gun

October 9, 2006, 07:54 AM	#23
mikejonestkd Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2006 Location: Brockport, NY Posts: 3,716	I find it interesting that no one considers the 9mm out of a carbine/ rifle a viable deer hunting round but have no problem using the same round out of a pistol for self defense against roughly the same sized critters....humans.. I'm not trying to start a caliber war but I also find it odd the when you mention the .223 at the tactical side of the range and they they think it's da bomb as a round.....when you mention it to a hunter they think of prairie poodles and wood chucks - 5 to 20 pound animals..... __________________ You are the bows from which your children as living arrows are sent forth.

October 9, 2006, 08:54 AM	#24
springmom Senior Member Join Date: October 26, 2005 Location: Houston area Posts: 1,823	The scenarios (please excuse that word, couldn't think of a better, I haven't had my coffee yet) are different. If I shoot a deer, he is trying not to be seen, and if he sees me, he's going to run. I have to shoot by utter stealth, and the ONE shot I make had better be fatal or else I run the risk of leaving a wounded deer to die of infection somewhere in the bush; If I shoot a human, it is because he is trying to kill me. One shot needs to do the deed, all right; but if I need two or three, I'm not going to take those second or third shots while he's bounding away at 20 mph, like a deer would be. So you're comparing apples and oranges. A better comparison would be using the 9 for a sniper rifle and using the 9 for hunting. I may be all wet, but I don't think ANY SWAT or sniper type folks use 9mms in their sniper rifles. If they are "hunting" a BG, they put something else in those rifles...something more like what we'd use for....DEER! HTH. (I like the 9mm for range shooting. I don't personally think it's "too little gun" for SD. I carry a .38spl a lot, and that IS essentially a 9, albeit with a VERY long case But I want that deer down and dead ASAP for the sake of the animal, so I want to use a rifle cartridge, with higher energy and more damage done, than my 9. ) Springmom __________________ I will not be a victim home on the web: www.panagia-icons.net (my webpage) www.nousfromspring.blogspot.com (Orthodoxy) "I couldn't hear you. Stop firing the gun while you're talking!" Frank Drebin, The Naked Gun

October 9, 2006, 09:33 AM	#25
mikejonestkd Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2006 Location: Brockport, NY Posts: 3,716	Springmom, I agreed with most of your assessment and opinion on the differences, IMO I would still be over gunned in a SD situation ( as long as I can handle and shoot it well ) and use just enough gun for hunting. I do find it funny that a few friends tell me all about the magical properties of their round of choice ( say the 9mm or the .223 ) and the oldtimers and hunters look at them as woefully inadequate for most hunting situations. __________________ You are the bows from which your children as living arrows are sent forth.