1841 Pattern US "Mississippi" Rifle

djdasher · July 21, 2013, 07:18 AM

Hello All,

A friend offered to sell this rifle to me. It's a Navy Arms reproduction that was manufactured by Antoni Zoli & Co. in Italy. As you can see from the pictures, it's got a little rust in the bore and some rust near the nipple and hammer. I'm not sure that it matters, but the serial number is in the 6XXX range. I believe that this rifle will clean up very nicely. Can anyone provide an approximate value on this rifle? I think that he wants in the neighborhood of $200.00.

I will have other questions about this rifle, but first I'd like to establish a value.

Thanks,

DJ

springfield 720 · July 21, 2013, 08:23 AM

I think I would ask him to fire it first... If it fires, its worth more than he asking.. if it doesn't, you really can't go wrong with it being over the mantel as a conversation piece of collectibles...

Doc Hoy · July 21, 2013, 08:24 AM

I examined a rifle very much like the one you posted while on vacation. It was not for sale. It was owned by a former re-enactor (Gave it up due to bad hips.) who owned the B&B we stayed in.

It was made sometime around 1967, a Navy Arms, Zoli. I thought the fit and finish on the rifle I examined was not outstanding. It was not well cared for and had suffered a bit from neglect. Still very shootable and easily could be brought back to good condition considering it is not a collectable piece.

I am not up on the values of muskets and rifles but I think (depending upon what kind of friend the person is), I would start a little lower and let him work up to 200.00. As a cautionary comment, that strategy invites the situation in which the friend feels compelled to take your first offer even though he thinks (or worse yet, discovers at a later time) that he is being taken for a ride.

**4V50 Gary** · July 21, 2013, 08:25 AM

It's cheap at $200. Buy it.

Doc Hoy · July 21, 2013, 08:28 AM

...I want to emphasize my lack of familiarity with the values of muskets and rifles. I may be good bit low on the price range.

I'd buy it at 175.00 but not 200.00 but then I don't mess with pieces such as this.

I could be way off.

**4V50 Gary** · July 21, 2013, 10:14 AM

Think of it as another rifle. What's a used Hawkins going for? I think the one piece Zoli repro is a sturdier rifle than those two piece stock Spanish guns that pass themselves off as "long rifles."

A re-enactor would have to consider if its accurate for the time or period he's protraying. A shooter on the other hand looks at the gun as a gun. Want a percussion round ball rifle? If yes, is the price right?

djdasher · July 21, 2013, 10:23 AM

I like the rifle. I've begun to work on the barrel and found that the rusting only extends for the first inch or so from the muzzle. Plus, the brass fittings are a little more ornate than the 1861's, etc. I'm going to buy it. I'll pay $200.00, as from what I've read here, it's a good deal.

I'm going to begin to restore the rifle somewhat. I'll post another thread later today with some questions and requests for opinions. Thanks...

DJ

Doc Hoy · July 21, 2013, 10:40 AM

No surprise about the situation you described regarding the rust at the muzzle.

Congrats on the decision.

Hawg · July 21, 2013, 10:45 AM

Ones without the rust and good bores are going for around 300-400. I think 200 is a fair price if the bore is good.

maillemaker · July 21, 2013, 10:56 AM

That gun looks to be in fine shape. Very light rust. I bet a good cleaning gets it in fine order right away. $200 is a deal.

Steve

djdasher · July 28, 2013, 08:41 AM

I just got the latest Dixie catalogue and found this rifle for just under a grand. Holy cow! I guess that I got a nice deal. I paid $200.00 cash. Now, for some molds, flasks, spouts, FFG powder, lead, etc.

**4V50 Gary** · July 28, 2013, 01:02 PM

You may want to make your own horn & bullet bag and possibles bag.

That said, I suspect that the men who carried the 1841 were issued cartridge boxes with which they carried their paper cartridges. After all, when in in the military, go with military stuff and not mountain man stuff.

I myself am a shooter. I don't care. I want to make smoke and put lead downrange.

Hawg · July 28, 2013, 01:27 PM

Quote:

That said, I suspect that the men who carried the 1841 were issued cartridge boxes with which they carried their paper cartridges.

True but I bet more than a few went out west at the tail end of the fur trade. Or up the Oregon trail.

July 21, 2013, 08:24 AM	#3
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	What a coincidence I examined a rifle very much like the one you posted while on vacation. It was not for sale. It was owned by a former re-enactor (Gave it up due to bad hips.) who owned the B&B we stayed in. It was made sometime around 1967, a Navy Arms, Zoli. I thought the fit and finish on the rifle I examined was not outstanding. It was not well cared for and had suffered a bit from neglect. Still very shootable and easily could be brought back to good condition considering it is not a collectable piece. I am not up on the values of muskets and rifles but I think (depending upon what kind of friend the person is), I would start a little lower and let him work up to 200.00. As a cautionary comment, that strategy invites the situation in which the friend feels compelled to take your first offer even though he thinks (or worse yet, discovers at a later time) that he is being taken for a ride. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

July 21, 2013, 08:25 AM	#4
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,838	It's cheap at $200. Buy it. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

July 21, 2013, 08:28 AM	#5
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Thinking it over..... ...I want to emphasize my lack of familiarity with the values of muskets and rifles. I may be good bit low on the price range. I'd buy it at 175.00 but not 200.00 but then I don't mess with pieces such as this. I could be way off. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

July 21, 2013, 10:14 AM	#6
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,838	Think of it as another rifle. What's a used Hawkins going for? I think the one piece Zoli repro is a sturdier rifle than those two piece stock Spanish guns that pass themselves off as "long rifles." A re-enactor would have to consider if its accurate for the time or period he's protraying. A shooter on the other hand looks at the gun as a gun. Want a percussion round ball rifle? If yes, is the price right? __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

July 21, 2013, 10:40 AM	#8
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	DJ No surprise about the situation you described regarding the rust at the muzzle. Congrats on the decision. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

July 21, 2013, 08:23 AM	#2
springfield 720 Member Join Date: November 17, 2012 Location: Minn Posts: 60	I think I would ask him to fire it first... If it fires, its worth more than he asking.. if it doesn't, you really can't go wrong with it being over the mantel as a conversation piece of collectibles...

July 21, 2013, 10:23 AM	#7
djdasher Member Join Date: April 15, 2009 Posts: 47	I like the rifle. I've begun to work on the barrel and found that the rusting only extends for the first inch or so from the muzzle. Plus, the brass fittings are a little more ornate than the 1861's, etc. I'm going to buy it. I'll pay $200.00, as from what I've read here, it's a good deal. I'm going to begin to restore the rifle somewhat. I'll post another thread later today with some questions and requests for opinions. Thanks... DJ

July 21, 2013, 10:45 AM	#9
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,189	Ones without the rust and good bores are going for around 300-400. I think 200 is a fair price if the bore is good.

July 21, 2013, 10:56 AM	#10
maillemaker Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2010 Posts: 1,635	That gun looks to be in fine shape. Very light rust. I bet a good cleaning gets it in fine order right away. $200 is a deal. Steve

July 28, 2013, 08:41 AM	#11
djdasher Member Join Date: April 15, 2009 Posts: 47	I just got the latest Dixie catalogue and found this rifle for just under a grand. Holy cow! I guess that I got a nice deal. I paid $200.00 cash. Now, for some molds, flasks, spouts, FFG powder, lead, etc.

July 28, 2013, 01:02 PM	#12
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,838	You may want to make your own horn & bullet bag and possibles bag. That said, I suspect that the men who carried the 1841 were issued cartridge boxes with which they carried their paper cartridges. After all, when in in the military, go with military stuff and not mountain man stuff. I myself am a shooter. I don't care. I want to make smoke and put lead downrange. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*