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Old July 23, 2018, 09:12 AM   #1
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170 & 175 Grain Round Nose for 7mm-08

Good morning folks!

Try to make the back story as short as possible. A great uncle in the family used to own a sporting goods store in the 1960s-1990s. When he retired from it and vacated the property, there was a lot of left over merchandise that ended up in storage. As he's wrapping up his affairs (he's 94), we've gone through some stuff and he's allowing me to purchase anything for the price as it was marked when he put it all on clearance. I'm getting some 100 ct boxes of bullets for $5.00. Reloading dies for $8.00/set. It's a real treat!

One thing I'm tickled to find is a couple boxes of 175 grn Hornady Round nose in 7mm/.284. I reload for my 7mm-08, and the idea of a slower, heavy "thumper" has always appealed to me. But I there seems to be a bit paradox around the notion. All of the manuals I own have data for 7mm-08 up to 175 grains. But it seems that anyone you ask states that 140 grain is about the max for 7mm-08 due to overall length.

If I proceed, I know I may have magazine length issues. But what else might I encounter? If anyone has done this, I'd love some pointers.

Thank you in advance!
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Old July 23, 2018, 10:05 AM   #2
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There may be less issue than you think. Hornady still has data for that 175 RN bullet, but it is seated to 2.855", which may or may not fit your magazine; you'll have to try it and see. However, if you knock their maximum charge weights down about a grain and seat the bullet to 2.800" it still works. You lose a very few fps of velocity. You have a small gap around the case mouth because it is overhanging part of the ogive. You can't crimp into the cannelure, but that's usually not necessary anyway unless you are going to subject the round to loading in a machine gun or combat-rough handling, like cargo-parachuting it into your elk camp.

If your cases have been reloaded many times, they can have an internal donut build up where the base meets the neck, and the deeply seated bullet may be occupying that space, so you want to be sure you've used an internal reamer to cut that donut out if you can feel one probing with a toothpick or a bent tip length of paperclip wire.
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Old July 23, 2018, 10:26 AM   #3
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Unclenick - Thanks! That's encouraging, and lot of helpful information there! The brass has all been shot once at the most, but I'll check for that regardless.

About the cannelure - it's interesting: I have 175 grn hornadys and 170 grn Sierras - both round nose. The cannelure on the Hornadys, the heaveier bullet, is 0.358" from the base, but the cannelure on the lighter Sierras is 0.392". Granted, my experience is limited, but I've never before seen a difference that drastic in bullet sizes that similar.
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Old July 23, 2018, 11:00 AM   #4
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Hornady has data for 7-08 with 175gr RN COL is 2.785". It's same data used 175gr Interlock COL 2.800",175gr ELD-X COL 2.800".
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Old July 23, 2018, 01:08 PM   #5
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RN bullets are short for their weight. You may not get some of the really long VLD type bullets in 175gr to work, but I don't think you'll have a problem with 175 gr RN bullets.

At that price I'd not pass them up either. I'd load 'em and shoot 'em. But I wouldn't get too excited about their usefulness on game. A quality 140-160 gr modern bullet still does everything better than those old RN bullets. Not that they won't work within their limitations, but they don't offer any advantages, only disadvantages.
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Old July 23, 2018, 02:35 PM   #6
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"At that price I'd not pass them up either. I'd load 'em and shoot 'em. But I wouldn't get too excited about their usefulness on game. A quality 140-160 gr modern bullet still does everything better than those old RN bullets. Not that they won't work within their limitations, but they don't offer any advantages, only disadvantages."

I'm not so sure I agree with you. Those 175 gr. bullets at a measly 2200-2300 FPS at the muzzle sure did earn on hell of a reputation when used in the 7x57 Mauser. They may not be the fastest killers on the block but they penetrate deeply and kill things, large and small very dead.

My biggest gripe is Sierra dropped that beautiful 170 gr. RN about 17 or so years ago and the tech got just a bit upset when I asked if they'd ever bring them back.

I'm not sure what the situation is on the 175 gr. RN from Hornady is but I hear they're discontinued or some say they're still around. All I know is I cannot find any. I did luck out on the Sierra's though. A small gun shop had they covered in dust so like the OP, I got them for the price on the box, 700 rounds for $5.95 a hundred.

They'll come in handy as I've taken a great interest in the 7x57 and it's reputation with those heavy 170/175 gr. bullets. Most of the shots I've had on elk where I hunt have been 200 yards or less, mostly less. My elk last year was shot at 75 yards. Only had one long shot on an elk and that one was 350 yards.

FWIW, I can duplicate 7-08 loads in my Winchester M70 FWT without any problem. I wonder if I'll see the need?
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Old July 23, 2018, 08:48 PM   #7
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Besides fitting into the magazine and feeding , check to make sure the throat is long enough . These new modern rifles are cut for spitzers and give short shift to the old heavy for caliber round nose designs.
The 154 gr RN out of my 7x57 model 95 Spanish Mauser is deadly on white tail deer.
Just because a load and OAL is listed in a book that doesn't insure it will fit your rifle. so make a "dummy" or two and test them.
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Old July 24, 2018, 07:45 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmr40 View Post
RN bullets are short for their weight. You may not get some of the really long VLD type bullets in 175gr to work, but I don't think you'll have a problem with 175 gr RN bullets.

At that price I'd not pass them up either. I'd load 'em and shoot 'em. But I wouldn't get too excited about their usefulness on game. A quality 140-160 gr modern bullet still does everything better than those old RN bullets. Not that they won't work within their limitations, but they don't offer any advantages, only disadvantages.
I hear what you're saying, but in a way, I'm looking for something a tad less "effective" than a good modern 140 grain spritzer, hunting bullet. The deer I hunt tend be in the 100lb - 175lb range. I've had modern Nosler, Hornady, and Sierra bullets blow up a fair amount of meat on the exit if it's anywhere near the shoulder. What I'm envisioning and hoping for is something that will hit hard, but slower, and expand just as much or more while fragmenting a little less. Maybe I'm living in a fantasy world, but for the price, it's worth a try. Thanks for the feed back!
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Old July 24, 2018, 07:55 AM   #9
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gwpercle - Thanks, that's a good point for me to check as the rifle is a 2 year old Ruger. I may be in for a headache chambering. Appreciate it!

Paul B. - It sounds like you and I are thinking alike. Sadly, of the boxes I found, 4 are the Hornadys, but only two are the Sierra's.

I also found something I'd never heard of... a box of Speer hot core 160 grain flat nose. They look something you would want for a lever gun. I may try some of them too, but I'm not sure what sort performance to expect.
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Old July 24, 2018, 10:40 AM   #10
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I think the cannelure placement just reflects one bullet designer trying to keep the finished round within the 2.800" SAAMI COL limit and the other giving up on that and assuming single loading.

At what range are you typically taking deer? Excessive destructiveness can mean the bullet was expected to impact at a lower velocity. Someone who lives in the plains and has 350-yard shots at antelope may have the velocity fall to the less destructive range, where a hunter in Eastern woods may never see a clear shot over 75 yards and can have that same bullet arrive going too fast.

If your ranges are short and you can place shots reasonably well, you may want to consider a very hard cast or solid bullet with a flat meplat bullet rather than an expanding one. At rifle or even near rifle velocities, these can be surprisingly effective and are less destructive of meat.
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Old July 24, 2018, 10:46 AM   #11
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UnlceNick,

My shots vary from 40 yards to 300 yards. I generally hunt in a tree line, sometimes the deer are in the trees, sometimes out in the field. You're correct in that the most destructive shots are inside 100 yds.

(Sorry, this seems to be somewhat crossing over into Hunting as much as reloading.)
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Old July 25, 2018, 07:19 AM   #12
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That can happen. But now nobody will suggest a thin-skinned target bullet.

Because of the closer shots, you may prefer a bonded bullet, so it doesn't disintegrate on close impact. Hornady's Interbond comes to mind. They have both a 139 grain and a 154 grain version in .284". Call Hornady's call line and they will tell you the design's expansion velocity range. To minimize close-shot meat damage, see if you can get one out at a velocity that remains just above the bottom of the expansion velocity at 300 yards, but that is still below its maximum impact velocity range at 40 yards. Use a ballistic program and ballistic coefficient to confirm this.
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