S&W M&P 10mm

[Siggy-06]

S&W is finally producing a M&P 2.0 in 10mm chambering. At the moment there are 4 models, 2 with 4 inch barrels(with or without safety) and 2 with 4.6 inch barrels(with or without safety). All models hold 15 rounds in the full size grip. Hopefully they will add a compact model soon.

https://www.smith-wesson.com/article/mp-10mm

[JustJake]

Yes, but regardless of which variation you choose, the real issue - as always - with any new 10mm pistol is: will it hold up to a sustained diet of real 10mm ammo without malf-ing or hiccuping? ...

... Or does it only appear to look good when fed the watered-down 40-level "10mm" ammo?

Once upon a time S&W built a line of all-steel 10mm pistols (i.e., the 3rd Gen 10XX-series) that garnered a pretty solid rep over time for being able to handle the cartridge in its undiluted, high-performance form.

So if the past is any sort of prologue, it's reasonable to believe that S&W's engineering staff took the time and spent the R&D $$$ to thoroughly vet several prototype 10mm M&P guns before bringing a 10mm model to market.

But as always in the Gun World, we'll just have to wait and see.

[jmr40]

I'm betting they do just fine. I'd be interested in one if the price isn't too bad.

And there is no reason to feed any pistol, in any chambering a sustained diet of full power loads. I don't do that with my 9mm pistols or 357 and 44 mag revolvers, nor any of my centerfire bolt rifles. No reason to do so with my Glock 10mm pistols.

I even shoot a lot of 40 S&W through my G20 and G29. I'd be more interested to know if the new M&P's in 10mm will do the same.

[TruthTellers]

Who is making a 10mm that can't hold up to sustained full power 10mm? Is it the 1911's that are causing this problem? The 1911 isn't exactly a robust design, I can see that platform having problems with full power 10mm, but a modern pistol? It should hold up for a long time.

[Mike Irwin]

I want one in .38 Super, so I contactedk S&W.

They say there are no current plans to so chamber one.

I'm a sad panda.

If they do offer one in .38 Super, I'll be first in line to buy one.

[JustJake]

Who is making a 10mm that can't hold up to sustained full power 10mm?

Still early in the game for S.A.'s 10mm XDMs but there were a few reports of 'teething' issues when they had just come out, to include lauching the fiber-optic front sight into orbit while shooting full power ammo.

There was also the polymer Grand Power GP-40, a Croatian made 10mm pistol with "sorta" CZ-ish lines. Haven't seen anymore imported in a while, but there were feeding issues and magazine problems reported. Some of these can be found in YouTube vids. Hit or miss. Some ran fine on the high-performance loads, others didn't.

The 1911 isn't exactly a robust design, I can see that platform having problems with full power 10mm, but a modern pistol? It should hold up for a long time.

The 1911 is designed around a low-pressure round, which the 10mm ain't. The .45acp and 10mm share an almost identical COAL, but that's about it.

If they're properly sprung and maintenanced, a 1911 in 10mm can easily run a thousand rounds without issues even if most of those are full-throttle loads. The master 1911 'smiths (e.g. Heinie, Tibbets) have devised a host of little 'tricks' to tune a 1911 to handle the 10mm cartridge, such as installing a heavier MS, fitted EGW f.p. stop, etc. On one of the 1911-boards somewhere there's even a published list of these little tuning tricks for the 10mm guns.

We come a long way since the first generation of Delta Elites in 1987.

[JustJake]

I'm betting they do just fine. I'd be interested in one if the price isn't too bad.

Same here.

And there is no reason to feed any pistol, in any chambering a sustained diet of full power loads. I don't do that with my 9mm pistols or 357 and 44 mag revolvers, nor any of my centerfire bolt rifles. No reason to do so with my Glock 10mm pistols.

Then you don't get what the 10mm AUTO is about, apparently.

The retail 40-level/FBI-Lite 10mm ammo is a waste of $$$. Why pay more for the pricey 10mm case only to receive watered-down ballistic performance? (Especially the factory ammo that's topped with a "premium" bullet).

If all you wanna do is shoot 40-level ammo, don't get a 10mm. Just get a 40 pistol and be done with it. You get a 9mm-size gun that shoots generally cheaper ammo.

I even shoot a lot of 40 S&W through my G20 and G29. I'd be more interested to know if the new M&P's in 10mm will do the same.

I've got aftermarket .40 drop-in tubes for my G20 and G29. Running those in my 10mm Glocks with standard 40 ammo makes it seem like I'm shooting 9mm plinkers after a range session with my full-power 10mm handloads.

Then I get bored, take out the 40 barrels, and go back to enjoying the 10mm in all its undiluted glory.

[stagpanther]

I run two Glock 20's with full power 10mm loads, never a problem with the right full case support barrel and heavy enough main spring (other than controlling the recoil muzzle flip).

[TruthTellers]

Originally Posted by JustJake

Still early in the game for S.A.'s 10mm XDMs but there were a few reports of 'teething' issues when they had just come out, to include lauching the fiber-optic front sight into orbit while shooting full power ammo.

There was also the polymer Grand Power GP-40, a Croatian made 10mm pistol with "sorta" CZ-ish lines. Haven't seen anymore imported in a while, but there were feeding issues and magazine problems reported. Some of these can be found in YouTube vids. Hit or miss. Some ran fine on the high-performance loads, others didn't.


The 1911 is designed around a low-pressure round, which the 10mm ain't. The .45acp and 10mm share an almost identical COAL, but that's about it.

If they're properly sprung and maintenanced, a 1911 in 10mm can easily run a thousand rounds without issues even if most of those are full-throttle loads. The master 1911 'smiths (e.g. Heinie, Tibbets) have devised a host of little 'tricks' to tune a 1911 to handle the 10mm cartridge, such as installing a heavier MS, fitted EGW f.p. stop, etc. On one of the 1911-boards somewhere there's even a published list of these little tuning tricks for the 10mm guns.

We come a long way since the first generation of Delta Elites in 1987.

So one Croatian company makes a 10mm that has problems and suddenly all 10mm's are suspect? That makes no sense.

Fiber optic sights breaking off under recoil is an issue with those, it's not a 10mm specific problem.

I agree w/ you on the 1911 stuff, but it's still a design that I don't think adapts to 10mm as well as a pistol built from the ground up to be a 10mm, hence why the Glock 10mm is still a top choice after 30 years.

[Road_Clam]

Originally Posted by Siggy-06

S&W is finally producing a M&P 2.0 in 10mm chambering. At the moment there are 4 models, 2 with 4 inch barrels(with or without safety) and 2 with 4.6 inch barrels(with or without safety). All models hold 15 rounds in the full size grip. Hopefully they will add a compact model soon.

https://www.smith-wesson.com/article/mp-10mm

Speaking from an experienced 10mm 1911 Long Slide owner, understand what you are getting into. There's always so much hype and appeal to a new gun want, but as with 10mm beware that loaded ammo is very expensive. Also 10mm is going to pack a punch as far as recoil. My Kimber LS is just a dream to shoot 10mm but it's also respectively heavy, especially vs a polymer framed gun. If you plan to reload 10mm the same applies you can't find primers, and .40 cal bullets are available but again expensive.10mm brass is very scarce right now as well. You will also need a unique powder as 10mm has it's own needs that really don't crossover from other calibers. Just some things to think about before purchasing.

[sparkyv]

I frequently shoot full house 10mm loads. I broke the bottom bbl lug on my USA-made 10mm 1911, but my Croatian 5.25" 10mm has been problem free...so far. The M610 is a strong, over-built 10mm platform, so S&W does still know how to build handguns that handle the hot 10mm, but time will tell if the M&P 10 was done right.

[Siggy-06]

I watched a few video reviews on them so far. One reviewer was having cycling issues with full power loads, but the gun ran fine with the watered down factory loads. Might need a heavier spring.

[TruthTellers]

If anyone is getting into reloading for 10mm, the powder to get is Blue Dot. 800x may be good too, but I haven't seen any to buy for over a year now and haven't had the opportunity to try it.

[Mike Irwin]

When I reloaded for 10mm, for my EAA Witness, I used AA 7.

Great powder for that application.

[JustJake]

When I reloaded for 10mm, for my EAA Witness, I used AA 7.
Great powder for that application.

Yeah AA7 and AA9 are the good-to powders for the serious 10mm reloader.

AA7 for the light bullets up to 180gns.

From 180gns up to the 220gn/230gn slugs AA9 is the better choice for top velocity.

I load AA9 using 200grn jacketed bullets for the classic "Sonny Crockett" load (i.e., 200gns @ 1200+fps), although you can easily push that bullet to 1250fps.

I also load 220grn coated HC FP slugs with AA9 for about 1200fps from my longslide Glock 40.

The ubiquitous 180gn bullet is right in the middle - weight-wise - for both powders, and so it works fine with either one.

[JustJake]

So one Croatian company makes a 10mm that has problems and suddenly all 10mm's are suspect? That makes no sense.Fiber optic sights breaking off under recoil is an issue with those, it's not a 10mm specific problem.

Ah dude, did you actually read my post?

All new model 10mm pistols have (or had) 'teething' issues, some worse than others, starting with the original one, the Bren Ten.

I only mentioned two in my earlier post.

Tanfoglio's line of 10mm Witnesses had a lot of different problems: mags that didn't feed or even hold rounds properly; cracking slides and frames; poor barrel fitment issues; poor sight quality (especially the fragile adjustable rear sights), etc.

Worse, for warranty work, you had to return your Witness to EAA for service. Try googling the fan-feedback on that.

Supposedly in the last few years, Tanfoglio is churning out 10mm pistols with better or higher quality-control ... If true, that's good news. Still wish CZ would actually offer a 10mm model.

The 3rd Gen S&W 10mms largely avoided Q.C. issues as it relates to handling full-throttle 10mm ammo. Opinions vary on what really happened between S&W and the FBI over their 1076 models. The one I had, an ex-LE gun from a City PD that was set up the same as the FBI model, ran perfectly fine on any 10mm ammo I fed it - from mild to wild

Even the Glock 20 prototypes that were first tested by the Calif Hwy Patrol, when they were considering adopting a 10mm pistol, malf-ed so badly it failed CHiP's testing before even reaching the final round-count required by their protocols.

To his credit, Gaston took the battered prototypes back and re-engineered the weaknesses out of the design and returned a much stouter first gen G20 to the market. That's all to the good as well, and certainly my Gen4 G20 and G29 are the best 10mm Glocks to date. It just took a while to get there.

So there's good reason to be generally cautious of first-year models of anything - whether automobiles or firearms.

[Road_Clam]

My go-to 10mm full house load powder is AA9 . Forget about trying 800X IMO , I tried that powder and it is a VERY pressure spikey powder. I bought 2# many years ago during a past gun panic because it was the only powder on the store shelf, in hindsight now I know why. A tip from another forum member was to use it in my garden to help my tomatoes grow. It worked good for that !

[Mike Irwin]

AA 2 is great for 9mm, .45 ACP and .38 Special loads.

[JustJake]

Well, since S.A. just announced they're discontinuing the 10mm XDMs, I guess we'll have to see if S&W's M&Ps pan out.

Whereas S.A. did the happy dance on YouTube after one XDM (allegedly) digested 1K rounds of the diluted, make-pretend "10mm" ammo, hopefully S&W got it right and the 10mm M&Ps aren't just re-barreled .45 models with a .40-cal/10mm breech face and slide.

[cnj]

Where did SA announce they are discontinuing the 10mm XD-M pistols? I was unable to find anything of the sort.

EDIT: N.M. I found where they discontinued all non-compact 10mm pistols. I am in the market for a full-sized 10mm. It WAS between SA and S&W. Looks like it'll be S&W.