October 16, 2017, 05:52 AM | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: August 11, 2016
Posts: 1,089
|
"Enhanced" CCW?
Has anyone heard of this? Anyone here live in Arkansas?
http://www.thv11.com/news/local/arka...-law/483573417 "Enhanced" CCW allowing permit holders to carry in otherwise restricted areas, so long as they pass "enhanced" training and testing (yet to be defined, but according to this article, including stuff like "Mass shooting response" and "marksmanship." Is this a good idea? A bad idea? Irrelevant? Is it a good step toward gaining CCW access more broadly? And is there value in tying "better" training to widespread carry? There's already a thread on preparedness, so I'm not trying to repeat that again. Just wondering whether anyone sees actual value in this, or whether it's just a political half-measure, etc? Also, any context or backstory would be interesting from anyone who knows how this came about, who's backing it, what launched it, etc. |
October 16, 2017, 07:14 AM | #2 |
Junior member
Join Date: February 2, 2010
Posts: 6,846
|
I might "take the test" but I certainly wouldn't up for "sheep dog duty".
|
October 16, 2017, 07:14 AM | #3 |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 14, 2008
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 2,918
|
Sounds like a good way to get yourself shot by another friendly. I'm not saying I have all the anwsers but if this is such a great idea why not just make it part of the regular ccw and go forward from their?
__________________
We know exactly where one cow with Mad-cow-disease is located, among the millions and millions of cows in America, but we haven't got a clue where thousands of illegal immigrants and terrorists are |
October 16, 2017, 08:55 AM | #4 | |
Staff
Join Date: June 8, 2008
Posts: 4,022
|
Quote:
I don't live in Arkansas, but I would not embrace that idea. |
|
October 16, 2017, 08:58 AM | #5 |
Senior Member
Join Date: August 11, 2016
Posts: 1,089
|
I'm guessing this is a sort of compromise position, hoping to get CCW allowed in more areas.
|
October 16, 2017, 08:58 AM | #6 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 22, 2007
Posts: 348
|
Enhanced permits often increase reciprocity, particularly in states with low training requirements, or no legislated requirements.
|
October 16, 2017, 09:05 AM | #7 |
Senior Member
Join Date: June 20, 2007
Location: Rainbow City, Alabama
Posts: 7,167
|
MS has an Enhanced Permit in addition to a regular permit. Regular CCW permit does not require any training. Enhanced Permit requires 8 hours of training under a certified instructor. Having a MS Enhanced Permit allows carry in many places that are off limits to normal carriers. Additionally, as stated earlier, the number of reciprocal states is greater with the Enhanced Permit as opposed to the regular permit.
|
October 16, 2017, 02:58 PM | #8 |
Member
Join Date: October 3, 2017
Posts: 18
|
Restricted areas and Gun Safe Zones are shooting galleries for nut-jobs.
__________________
Optimism is true moral courage. - Sir Ernest Shackleton http://www.anamericanwithagun.com/ |
October 16, 2017, 03:41 PM | #9 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: March 16, 2011
Posts: 489
|
Quote:
The main kicker is the standard CCW is sometimes waived for prior MIL/LE individuals with proof of firearms training (well, any ID resident can conceal carry without a permit now in state lines). You HAVE to take the class for enhanced if you want the enhanced, no matter your history. I think the class and shooting is longer too, but haven't really compared to the two side by side. This makes other states more comfortable the CCW holder is getting the same level of CCW training their state offers. |
|
October 16, 2017, 07:31 PM | #10 |
Junior member
Join Date: December 15, 2012
Posts: 164
|
Useless idea.
Requiring training to exercise ones RTKABA is as infringing as the permits themselves. Paying for a permit to do what the 2A guarantees a right to do is bad enough. Adding more requirements is just more slaps in the face. |
October 16, 2017, 07:43 PM | #11 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: August 12, 2009
Location: Athens, Georgia
Posts: 2,526
|
Quote:
If Congress passed a law requiring every able bodied citizen to receive firearm safety and use training, would that be a slap in the face to the 2nd Amendment? |
|
October 16, 2017, 11:55 PM | #12 |
Junior member
Join Date: December 15, 2012
Posts: 164
|
|
October 17, 2017, 05:00 AM | #13 |
Senior Member
Join Date: February 2, 2015
Location: Cottleville, Missouri
Posts: 1,115
|
I have to think of the number of non-shooters that I've known personally and those that I've heard of, that once they'd been introduced to shooting and touched off a few rounds, became enthusiasts.
I also have to think of the fact that familiarity quells fear. Not so sure that it would be a bad idea if use and safety training were required... just sayin.
__________________
Vegetarian... primitive word for lousy hunter! |
October 17, 2017, 07:51 AM | #14 |
Senior Member
Join Date: January 2, 2005
Location: Where the deer and the antelope roam.
Posts: 3,082
|
The most dangerous people I have ever seen is a novice with a new pistol show up to a CCW class. I do not want them shooting anywhere around me outside the controlled range environment. To require some standards before allowing people to carry in large crowds seems like a good idea.
__________________
Retired Law Enforcement U. S. Army Veteran Armorer My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon. |
October 17, 2017, 08:11 AM | #15 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 1, 2011
Location: Texas, land of Tex-Mex
Posts: 2,259
|
Quote:
|
|
October 17, 2017, 08:22 AM | #16 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: January 2, 2005
Location: Where the deer and the antelope roam.
Posts: 3,082
|
Quote:
__________________
Retired Law Enforcement U. S. Army Veteran Armorer My rifle and pistol are tools, I am the weapon. |
|
October 17, 2017, 08:26 AM | #17 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 1, 2017
Posts: 391
|
My state doesn't require any specific training for a LTC, but I made sure to go to a local range run by former LE people to learn from them. They were, and continue to be, a big help.
|
October 17, 2017, 08:48 AM | #18 |
Senior Member
Join Date: September 24, 2008
Location: central Arkansas
Posts: 400
|
I just went on a search mission that took longer than it should have... the Arkansas legislature's official page about the bill doesn't actually have the text of the bill, which seems counterproductive, and it took a while to find it.
This is, as far as I can tell, the version the Governor signed into law: http://www.arkleg.state.ar.us/assemb...meo2PqvxhGpTYn Courtrooms, pre-K and K-12 schools, any Corrections or prison facility, liquor stores, and any place with a "no weapons" sign are still prohibited areas. The changes appear to primarily affect college campuses: You can carry on some college properties (unless signed as prohibited) Colleges can't make carrying a gun mandatory for employment unless it's part of your job description. You can't claim Workman's Comp if you hurt yourself with your gun. You can't open carry on college property. Colleges can't be sued or not sued if you use or don't use your gun. The "effective date" was September 1, 2017, but the Arkansas State Police (the licensing body) has nothing about it on their web site yet. |
October 17, 2017, 11:42 AM | #19 |
Senior Member
Join Date: February 13, 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 12,453
|
Sounds decidedly like something an unelected civil servants would come up with to help divide shooters.
"...the 2A guarantees..." It says nothing at all about concealed firearms.
__________________
Spelling and grammar count! |
October 18, 2017, 06:44 AM | #20 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: December 17, 2005
Location: Swamp dweller
Posts: 6,187
|
Quote:
__________________
NRA Life Member, NRA Chief Range Safety Officer, NRA Certified Pistol Instructor,, USPSA & Steel Challange NROI Range Officer, ICORE Range Officer, ,MAG 40 Graduate As you are, I once was, As I am, You will be. |
|
October 26, 2017, 02:05 PM | #21 |
Senior Member
Join Date: September 24, 2008
Location: central Arkansas
Posts: 400
|
Some states won't recognize other state's permits unless they meet their own standards for hours of training, range time, etc.
So other states offer "enhanced" permits which require extra training, which are primarily useful for reciprocity with more-stringent states. The Arkansas thing is mostly about campus carry. College properties including parking lots, farms, office buildings, sports venues, etc. are *also* prohibited areas in Arkansas, not just the campuses themselves. And a lot of those properties aren't marked in any way, nor do they have to be. I got warned about that by my CHCL instructor. Personally, unless the enhanced permit is some nominal charge on top of my renewal, I'm not going to bother; the additional carry areas aren't anywhere I need or want to go. But for people who do have to go those places periodically, it would save a lot of hassle. |
October 26, 2017, 02:11 PM | #22 |
Senior Member
Join Date: July 1, 2001
Posts: 6,326
|
Instead of more advanced training, just skip to testing standards. There definitely should be a hey, it’s a free country level of ccw. Not sure why, but if a higher level is required to carry in a school or on a train, then separate by testing. I’ll train myself....or pay to get trained right. You,state, just tell me the requirement and test me.....and so you don’t get embarrassed, make sure Leo can pass it to ccw also!
|
October 26, 2017, 04:55 PM | #23 |
Senior Member
Join Date: October 31, 2000
Location: Texican!
Posts: 4,453
|
While I'm a Texican, yea if they allow out-of-state CCW to take the test I might to.
Deaf
__________________
“To you who call yourselves ‘men of peace,’ I say, you are not safe without men of action by your side” Thucydides |
|
|